The FR Debate Continues! (Matrix FR212)

Morbid

Morbid

Inspired
Greetings Fractalites.

I did a quick search, but didn't really find any discussions that really quenched my thirst for knowledge.
As the people on this forum are quite possibly the most helpful I've run into, I figured there'd be no harm in starting a new thread.

I normally use my Axe-FX with a Matrix GT1000FX, plugged into my Mesa Stiletto 4x12 Cabinet, with the cab IR off (obviously). The more I dive into tones though, the more I realize just how much the cabinet effects your tone. Even using different amp models, things tend to sound really similar through the 4x12. Not identical, but very similar.
It's with that realization that I've decided I want...no, make that NEED, to get some form of an FR cab, in order to truly utilize the Axe-FX's full potential. My intention would be to keep the Mesa 4x12 (at least for now), and use the FR cab for my bedroom, ass well as honing tones for direct use, and playing bass. So I've been eyeballing the Matrix FR212, in large part due to the fact that it LOOKS like a cabinet, but also because I've heard MOSTLY good things. I have heard a few people say though, that when using the FR212 to craft tones for direct PA use, they've been disappointed by the sound of the tones through the PA, claiming that they sound very harsh and trebly. Some people have said the FR212 is very flat, others not so much. So far EVERYONE has said that it DOES have that "amp in room" feel.

Blah blah blah, bicker bicker.

So I wanted to get some first hand experiences from the folks here. How flat does the cabinet seem to you? When you use it to reference tones for direct PA only use, have you been satisfied with the results? (that part is really important, as I've been using the Axe-FX direct a lot lately, and if I'm to get the most out of the IRs, I need to know what I"m hearing is accurate).

Give me the honest skinny!
 
I`d like to help.....the only experience I have though is with the Atomic CLR powered...I can tell you it really is really quite accurate. I have it about waist high facing forward like a regular amp on stage and at stage volume I`m comfortable with it. It doesn`t move as much air as a guitar cab but at least I know whats going out the mains.
 
Morbid said:
Greetings Fractalites.

I did a quick search, but didn't really find any discussions that really quenched my thirst for knowledge.
As the people on this forum are quite possibly the most helpful I've run into, I figured there'd be no harm in starting a new thread.

I normally use my Axe-FX with a Matrix GT1000FX, plugged into my Mesa Stiletto 4x12 Cabinet, with the cab IR off (obviously). The more I dive into tones though, the more I realize just how much the cabinet effects your tone. Even using different amp models, things tend to sound really similar through the 4x12. Not identical, but very similar.
It's with that realization that I've decided I want...no, make that NEED, to get some form of an FR cab, in order to truly utilize the Axe-FX's full potential. My intention would be to keep the Mesa 4x12 (at least for now), and use the FR cab for my bedroom, ass well as honing tones for direct use, and playing bass. So I've been eyeballing the Matrix FR212, in large part due to the fact that it LOOKS like a cabinet, but also because I've heard MOSTLY good things. I have heard a few people say though, that when using the FR212 to craft tones for direct PA use, they've been disappointed by the sound of the tones through the PA, claiming that they sound very harsh and trebly. Some people have said the FR212 is very flat, others not so much. So far EVERYONE has said that it DOES have that "amp in room" feel.

Blah blah blah, bicker bicker.

So I wanted to get some first hand experiences from the folks here. How flat does the cabinet seem to you? When you use it to reference tones for direct PA only use, have you been satisfied with the results? (that part is really important, as I've been using the Axe-FX direct a lot lately, and if I'm to get the most out of the IRs, I need to know what I"m hearing is accurate).

Give me the honest skinny!
Click to expand...
One way to get 'accurate' is to use a small version of your main PA. If you match your PA's response close enough, your front of house sounds will be spot on to what you are hearing onstage! You will just have to get used to a FRFR for your guitar monitor that is, if you want to take 'full' advantage of the IR's influence on your sound.
 
jakbur said:
One way to get 'accurate' is to use a small version of your main PA. If you match your PA's response close enough, your front of house sounds will be spot on to what you are hearing onstage! You will just have to get used to a FRFR for your guitar monitor that is, if you want to take 'full' advantage of the IR's influence on your sound.
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Problem is, I don't actually have a PA of my own. When I DO play through a PA, it tends to rotate, so I can't even really dial it in for one specific PA or place.
The FRFR would only be used in my bedroom, 9.5 out of 10 times, because it would just be silly to bring it with me for where and what I'm playing. So I like to think that a the Matrix FR212 would give me a really good idea of what to expect when I plug into a PA, and would allow me to hone in on the sound I'm after, as well as taking advantage of the IRs for tonal creation.
 
I enjoy a pair of FR212s. I was drawn to the cab styling, weight/size ratio, and after trying various 2x12 and 2x15 PAs knew needed something that was 2-up (don't know what it is but more punch/in roomish). We are a cover band and presets translate well between them and EV ELX115Ps we rehearse/gig with and/or house systems, just dial in presets at volume. These ended my FRFR search so no experience with the other popular options see here. Good luck!
 
dpeterson said:
IMHO no FRFR is going to guarantee anything. All bets are off when you hand a mic cable to the FOH.
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I'm inclined to agree. I just need to know that it's going to get me in the ballpark...closer is of course better.
Fortunately, I'm not exactly in a position to do "big time" shows, so more often than not, I'm the one setting up the board. Obviously I'm not able to tweak on the fly, but thus far I've been able to get things to where they sound good enough to last the night with minor tweaks in between sets.

It was difficult finding that happy place with my tones though, considering I'm not really able to spend the necessary time going through trial and error at the shows, so I like to think the FR212 will help me experiment more at home, while not being TOO far off when I get to the show itself.

jjozwia said:
I enjoy a pair of FR212s. I was drawn to the cab styling, weight/size ratio, and after trying various 2x12 and 2x15 PAs knew needed something that was 2-up (don't know what it is but more punch/in roomish). We are a cover band and presets translate well between them and EV ELX115Ps we rehearse/gig with and/or house systems, just dial in presets at volume. These ended my FRFR search so no experience with the other popular options see here. Good luck!
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Hearing this pleases me.
Thank you for your input.

I must hear more!
Praise the Matrix FR212!
Or perhaps, damn it to hell!

All personal opinions shared are welcomed, and appreciated.
 
I'm currently demoing an ASM-12 and a CLR. I find the CLR to be 'clearer' and 'more honest' with regards to the tone that would be actually coming out through most FOH/PA that I would encounter. The ASM-12 definitely has more of the 'moving air' and 'punch' you've come to expect from a real cabinet, but a little less clarity like a cab in the room.
 
Of course this all depends on the player but a lot of guitarists like the extra "feel" of some kind of cab over just running to the FOH and then possibly only hearing yourself through In ears or a monitor. It seems that "movement of air" does help in a "reassuring" way (perhaps because we've been conditioned over the years to accept this with an amp and cab behind us) as well as helping with things like controlled feedback etc.

Perhaps a more accurate way of gauging the quality of PA you'll be running through is to listen to the other instruments, Kick drum will be a good one to listen to (especially on smaller PA's where it doesn't have that thump) or bass guitar. If it's lacking in those areas you'll at least have an idea whether your patch will translate well enough (although of course it's not necessarily a good thing for your tone to occupy the same sonic spectrum as some other instruments).

It may well be more useful to use the FR212 on smaller (ie smaller FOH rigs) as the cab will also provide some "background" to the PA also.

IMO, YMMV etc
 
I've been using mine and i love the way it sounds. I went from a Mesa Os 4x12 to it and dont miss the Mesa at all. The FR212 has plenty of low end punch and packs a punch. I actually was questioning the flatness of it recently. Since then i've had the luxury of playing through a couple different quality p.a. systems. To my ears the Matrix fr212 seems to translate pretty well. Sadly it seems to sound better than your average p.a. speaker. Thats why i was questioning my fr212. The better systems i played through sound so much closer to my fr212 and your general local band "band practice" p.a. speakers sound harsher and have more pronounced high end. Hope this helps!
 
Reet said:
I've been using mine and i love the way it sounds. I went from a Mesa Os 4x12 to it and dont miss the Mesa at all. The FR212 has plenty of low end punch and packs a punch. I actually was questioning the flatness of it recently. Since then i've had the luxury of playing through a couple different quality p.a. systems. To my ears the Matrix fr212 seems to translate pretty well. Sadly it seems to sound better than your average p.a. speaker. Thats why i was questioning my fr212. The better systems i played through sound so much closer to my fr212 and your general local band "band practice" p.a. speakers sound harsher and have more pronounced high end. Hope this helps!
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I feel less nervous when faced with the premise of purchasing an FR212 now. Thank you!

Still eager to hear everyone else's personal experience with the FR212 as well! :)
 
Just a quick tip. I've found dropping the speaker resonance (in the speaker tab/amp block) from it's default of around 110hz to about 80-90hz helps tighten up the bottom end. Much less boomy at volume but if you do need a bit of that back, just widen the Q slightly.
 
@Morbid ... how did it go. What are you happy with and what is it lacking ? I'm awaiting my AX8 - hopefully it should arrive in about 2 weeks, then my journey will begin too :)
 
mmpete said:
@Morbid ... how did it go. What are you happy with and what is it lacking ? I'm awaiting my AX8 - hopefully it should arrive in about 2 weeks, then my journey will begin too :)
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Truth be told, I haven't gotten it yet! haha.
My friend was kind enough to do me the favor of picking up the cabinet in Tampa, so he's got it. I haven't had enough free time to make the trip to Tampa, and he hasn't had the days off to come into town to visit yet. Hopefully soon that'll change, though.
Believe me when I say, no one is more eager to hear the results than me, and I'm really looking forward to putting together a detailed review...probably a video.
 
Morbid said:
Truth be told, I haven't gotten it yet! haha.
My friend was kind enough to do me the favor of picking up the cabinet in Tampa, so he's got it. I haven't had enough free time to make the trip to Tampa, and he hasn't had the days off to come into town to visit yet. Hopefully soon that'll change, though.
Believe me when I say, no one is more eager to hear the results than me, and I'm really looking forward to putting together a detailed review...probably a video.
Click to expand...

Im from Florida too! Im an hour south of Tampa in Venice.
 
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