The conspiracy paranoids have won again

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There's plenty of papers describing the efficiency and in fact necessity of mask usage. Here's a good one:

https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rspa.2020.0376

From the conclusion:

(iv) Lock-down periods alone do not prevent the occurrence of secondary and tertiary waves of the pandemic occurring and these may be larger than the initial wave (figures 5 and 6).

(v) If lock-down periods are combined with 100% adoption of facemask use by the public, the initial disease progress peak is dramatically flattened and delayed and subsequent waves are prevented (figures 5c and 7a).
 
Analyzing the data and listening to the experts...Kudos to all three levels of government for making fact based decisions.
“OMG marxist leftist freedom-crushing deep-state conspiracy overreach of tyrannical government out of control!!!”

Sarcasm aside, IMO only the word conspiracy is correct. Where you live, the scientific experts and branches of government are conspiring to preserve life (proper role of gov BTW) in order to preserve rights to liberty and pursuit of happiness...in that precise sequence, because you can’t have the third without the second and you can’t have the second without the first.

Anyone find it ironic in this pandemic — where a foreign invader is massing inside country borders and killing innocent civilians — that non-USA countries are actually preserving core inalienable rights better than the USA?
 
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Hmmm....two threads nuked, but lets restart the argument. The third time is sure to be the charm.

Even handed and well sourced mask analysis:
https://aapsonline.org/mask-facts/
Well, here we go again: This organization is a complete outlier amongst medical professionals. Please don't listen to this advice. Or at the very least, investigate the weird and strange things this organization supports for yourself.
 
Well, here we go again: This organization is a complete outlier amongst medical professionals. Please don't listen to this advice. Or at the very least, investigate the weird and strange things this organization supports for yourself.
Everything at that link is factual and sourced, and the science 100% solid. You can get the same information elsewhere if you prefer, but facts don't change.
 
Everything at that link is factual and sourced, and the science 100% solid. You can get the same information elsewhere if you prefer, but facts don't change.
For everyone else reading this, here is a good summary of this small group:
"The publication's archives present a kind of alternate-universe scientific world, in which abortion causes breast cancer and vaccines cause autism, but HIV does not cause AIDS. Cutting carbon emissions represents a grave threat to global health (because environmental regulation would make people poorer and, consequently, sicker) ... The organization opposes some of the most accepted practices in health care, including mandatory vaccine regulations. Peer review, a long-standing hospital practice that helps doctors learn from and prevent errors, is viewed as the source of great injustice by AAPS, which fights attempts to micromanage doctors with such bureaucratic nuisances as medical evidence about what works and what doesn't. Computers, too, are an ominous threat. The organization has resisted the use of electronic medical records—which, naturally, represents an attempt by the government to acquire masses of private information about American citizens. (AAPS' executive director claims to keep all her patient notes in longhand.)"
Their recommendations are in direct conflict with the American Medical Association, the American Nurses Association and the American Hospital Association. Everyone can look at those and decided for themselves.
 
For everyone else reading this, here is a good summary of this small group:
"The publication's archives present a kind of alternate-universe scientific world, in which abortion causes breast cancer and vaccines cause autism, but HIV does not cause AIDS. Cutting carbon emissions represents a grave threat to global health (because environmental regulation would make people poorer and, consequently, sicker) ... The organization opposes some of the most accepted practices in health care, including mandatory vaccine regulations. Peer review, a long-standing hospital practice that helps doctors learn from and prevent errors, is viewed as the source of great injustice by AAPS, which fights attempts to micromanage doctors with such bureaucratic nuisances as medical evidence about what works and what doesn't. Computers, too, are an ominous threat. The organization has resisted the use of electronic medical records—which, naturally, represents an attempt by the government to acquire masses of private information about American citizens. (AAPS' executive director claims to keep all her patient notes in longhand.)"
Their recommendations are in direct conflict with the American Medical Association, the American Nurses Association and the American Hospital Association. Everyone can look at those and decided for themselves.
You keep attacking the organization that collated the data, and you may have a point about them....but the data they present is sourced from entirely mainstream science. They show their work.

edit: I take back the 'you may have a point' portion of my post.
 
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Masks are not shields, ask any surgeon you know. Don't know any? Okay, well then just trust the past 50-60 years of modern medicinal practices in an Op Room. The surgeons are not wearing the mask to prevent themselves from contracting the patients virus/infection, they are protecting their patient from any idle illness that the surgical staff may have...
I thought that was well understood. Masks offer partial protection to the wearer, but are very effective at preventing the wearer from infecting others. That's still a very good reason to wear them, no? I honestly don't see how you could describe a state governor mandating their use as 'unethical or down-right evil.' Can you explain?
 
Worth repeating... Masks and social distancing works... Proven in other countries like S. Korea, Japan, Germany, etc. The mask is not about people trying to control you. They are not trying to control you by telling you literally not to spit at each other. Vaccines are not going to implant chips on you... The phone you are holding already holds so much information about you and you have a number attached to you for life. Worry about that separately.

The people in power want to open up the businesses because it will look good this upcoming election. But if we don't start controlling this pandemic, instead of a broken economy, will have more dead people AND probably a worse economy.

Here's an easy to understand guideline that kindergarden kid can comprehend. View attachment 70130
This this this this this this this. I live in Costa Rica and we stupidly blew up our numbers after we crushed covid. Finally masks are mandatory for the entire country and hopefully we will be rewarded with falling numbers in the next 30 days. Humans for the most part do really seem to act like the idiots we see in the disaster films.
 
Wait a minute, jclemensfi's cut 'n paste was from Mother Jones! Mother Jones is the absolute last source on the entire planet I would trust for unbiased, factual info.
 
Wait a minute, jclemensfi's cut 'n past was from Mother Jones! Mother Jones is the absolute last source on the entire planet I would trust for unbiased, factual info.
Yeesh. You don't need a study to understand that a mask drastically stops spit and snot from flying all over. The fact this is a debate is insanity and a core reason why the USA is such a disaster today.
 
@ElectricPhase:
I'll grant that Mother Jones isn't, uh, "fair and balanced," to borrow a term. ;)

But let's keep in mind that if Hitler claims the (non-clouded, daytime) sky is blue, it doesn't become wrong just because a scummy person said it. That's the "genetic fallacy" (or, done a little bit differently, it's called Bulverism).

Probably the best plan is to do what journalists used to do: Look for independent confirmation of the story, one way or the other.
 
Yeesh. You don't need a study to understand that a mask drastically stops spit and snot from flying all over. The fact this is a debate is insanity and a core reason why the USA is such a disaster today.
Right. So symptomatic people should wear a mask? No, actually they should stay home. That's what the article I linked states. There is no evidence for asymptomatic spread.
 
Asymptomatic peo
Right. So symptomatic people should wear a mask? No, actually they should stay home. That's what the article I linked states. There is no evidence for asymptomatic spread.
Asymptomatic people who account for roughly 50% of the spread don't spit when they talk or in general? Wear a mask people. Save our world.
 
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