The Confession and Conversion of a Loyal Tube Amp Patriot

MKeditor

Experienced
The little black box that we are all obsessed with has caused a big stir on all the guitar message boards. It has polarized players almost to the point of an us-vs-them situation. Comments about the Axe-FX have range from it being "the second coming" to "an abomination." If I may take the analogy a little further...when you switch to the gizmo, other players think you're nuts... much like when a person becomes a Christian, some of your non-religious friends question your sanity and wonder if you have lost touch with reality. In both cases there is more than a fair amount of eyes that are being rolled by non-believers, with comments like "well....that's good for you...but it's not for me."

Actually I too was rolling my eyes not long ago. I had a CAA 3+SE with all of the mods by John Suhr, through a VHT 2502 and a pair of 1X12's loaded with V30's....and the more desirable processors to boot. My 11 space rack had received numerous compliments as one of the better setups for a regular gigging player. It was a handsome rig with pretty lights that sounded amazing.

Mk_Rig_2008.jpg


When I first read about the gizmo, I thought it was another FX processor attempting to challenge Eventide, Lexicon and TC Electronics. I wasn't interested in amp simulations. I had the real deal. When I learned that it was a two space unit and cost as many grand as it was high, my interest ended. I decided to buy an Eclipse that was only one space instead.

In my mind, I moved the Axe-FX into the Line 6 amp category....which is synonymous with the round file. I know people who have Line 6 amps. They sound just ok and I really don't like playing through them. I feel a bit disconnected from the amp when I have tried them. I know that some players like Lincoln Brewster sound fine with Line 6 sims, but it wasn't for me.

The Axe-FX fanatics were posting in almost every thread on HRI that the black box was the answer to everything. There were comments to threads like these:

"What delay should I get?" AXE-FX!
"Reverb: What’s better Eventide or Lexicon?" Just get an AXE-FX!
"What is the ultimate metal tone?" AXE-FX!
"Is there a pedal that sounds like an Tube Screamer and a Big Muff?" Buy an AXE-FX!
"How can I play better?" Get an AXE-FX!
"My wife is thinking of leaving me." Just get an AXE-FX....quick!!!!
I am going to kill myself. Buy an Axe-FX...No.....BUY TWO!!!!!

OK. I might be exaggerating just a little but definitely the Fractal zealots were over the top with their enthusiasm. To borrow from the above analogy again.... Cliff's converts had found the answer and wanted to share it with the world.

The clips on the Fractal site were interesting but nothing to get too excited about. I could duplicate most of those with my luscious mini-refrigerator rack. But the new converts began posting some great sounding clips that were causing me to have a furrowed brow. I consoled myself with the knowledge that these clips recorded direct. They weren't played through speakers and recorded with a microphone. It was one thing to make an audio file but another to gig with the gizmo. I also told myself it probably had that disconnected feeling like Line 6 amps. I was holding my ground but losing my resolve.

The real blow was dealt by Ed DeGenaro. He is a real player who constantly gigs. Ed has a ton of gear and can use pretty much play with whatever he wants too. Even though he and I don't always have the same take on things, I knew if Ed gigged with it....it defiantly was viable. Here is what Ed posted back in February in a thread about the Eclipse...with some converts plugging the Axe-FX :

Got the Eclipse in my "money rack" and it won't go anywhere. Got a G system I use for a grab and go thing. Either one of them will suffice for my needs. I prefer the Eclipse sonically, but the convenience of G-sys is hard to beat.
Never tried the Axe-Fx, nor do I see any pressing reason to.


Then in April he starts a thread called "So...I'm checking this Axe FX thing..." and posts one of the best clips of the gizmo so far. He comments, "no opinion so far...I just messed with the one thing I likely will never use...the amp sims." I PM'd Ed asking him to shoot me straight on what his take was...but he was keeping his cards close to the vest.

About that time Enzo Sutera posted clips from some sessions that he did using the gizmo. I couldn't knock them. The tone was very cool. Now I was getting the dangerous itch to try one. My thinking was that at the very least, the Axe-FX could replace my Eclipse, Lexicon MPX1, Yamaha SE-50 and probably my Roland SDX-330. The part that was scaring me was....could it replace my amp too? No switcher? No mixer? No miles of cable? I tried not to think about that. If that were true, it would change everything I knew about guitar gear.

The straw that broke the camel's back was Flukather's brilliant explanation of the PCM70's circular delay and how a few other devices could duplicate it....including the Axe-FX. That was one of the very few limitations of my current rig. I had always liked Steve Lukather's approach to delays but I never could quite match that sound. I had been keeping my eye out for a PCM70 at a good price for a long while. I wasn't thrilled to invest a chunk of change into a 20+ year old delay that weighed sixteen pounds and was the deepest single rack space unit I have ever heard of......but until then it was the only unit that I knew of that could pull off circular delays. When Cliff posted a clip of his gizmo doing the deed....that sealed the deal. I pulled out the plastic and bit down on the hook hard.

By June the innocent looking box that might rock my world arrived. It sat there confidently waiting for me to plug it in as if it were saying, “Go ahead. I dare’ya.” I finally caved to the taunting and hooked it up. The black box looked ominous on top of my pretty white rack. The Spartan, no-nonsense style was like some secret CIA device for clandestine operations. I had gone this far. There was no turning back now. I needed to know….so I plugged in. I felt a little like Marty McFly plugging into Doc’s amplifier in Back To The Future. There was no telling what was going to happen. Would there be a slight overload?

All kidding aside, it wasn’t life changing the first day. Some guys are in ecstasy a few hours after playing through the Axe-FX. That wasn’t my experience. I am sure that a guy going from a 80’s Crate practice amp to the black box will be on cloud nine a few seconds after plugging in. Also there are a few players that are rocket scientists and are a whiz at dialing in parameters. Some guys are quick learners too. I am none of the above. I like to think I am fairly intelligent but I learn slow and let’s say that Einstein has a few moves on me. Combine that with a very high standard to compare the gizmo to means the probability of me walking on air the first afternoon playing with the thing was about as likely as me out-swimming Michael Phelps.

Back in June….which is centuries ago in Fractal years….the levels and EQ of the stock presents were all over the map. It took much longer to audition sounds and try and get them on the same page back then. My first goal was to determine if the Axe-FX could replace my Eclipse. If I sold the Eventide it would pretty much pay for the new toy. It was very, very close….but the verdict was still out. It did out class the MPX-1 on all but one patch.

Reverb

I love the Lexicon’s Guitar Solo reverb and I was having a hard time matching it. I tried using the FX loop with MPX-1 through it….but something didn’t jive. The tone of the Lexicon lost a considerable amount of it’s hi-fi quality through the loop. I tried various combinations but gave up trying before finding the cause. Instead I ran the Axe-Fx and the Lexicon to the mini-mixer in parallel. I posted about my disappointment in the Axe’s reverb while searching for a solution.

Some people took it that this was my final conclusion when it was just the rambling of a new guy trying figure out this new device. There is so much loyalty to Cliff and the Axe-FX here, that some people get a little perturbed when someone says anything less than great about the wonder box. I feel frustrated too when a new guy gives the Axe-FX one shot and since he doesn’t understand it, decides the gizmo isn’t cutting and sells the thing….but I digress. Let’s just say I was too stubborn to quit and was committed to see this through. As a result of more tweaking and Cliff improving the reverb, the Lexicon and Eventide we pulled from the rack. Now the reverb sounds beautiful. It is big, rich and smooth as anything I have ever heard.

This post by Ed in August cracked me up: "Change the rack once again...gone are the Eclipse and TC box since they were superfluous." This gadget was causing a paradigm shift in the guitar world.

Delays
The delays are very versatile. They can do everything I can think of. It can do the 2290 thing. You can have ducking delays. I have yet to come up with a delay that can’t be done…though for a time I was having difficulty matching the circular delay to the PCM70. After a few updates and much tweaking the circular and panning delays are great.

The Kitchen Sink
I love being able to have almost any combinations of sounds imaginable. For example I only use a flanger every blue moon. It wouldn’t make sense to spend the cash and haul around a pedal I rarely used. Rack gear run in parallel won’t give you that thick flanger tone. The same story goes for a wha-wha pedal.

Another cool thing I have always wanted to try is delay one side of the power-amp a few milliseconds to widen the stereo image sometimes. Other than using a switchblade, I would have to have one unit just to do that. I couldn’t see going to all that expense and trouble….and space! With the Axe-FX, I can have it all that and more. It is like being a top session player that has a cartage company just a phone call away that can bring anything your hearts desire to the gig….except it is all in one box.

Amp Sims
I wasn’t counting on this new processor to replace my amp. All my life tubes were king. Anything less was second rate at best. If this box could sound as good as my tube rig, it would change everything I knew to be true about guitar amps. Yet because of the great clips people had posted, I secretly hoped that it would change my world. If it really was magic in a box, it would make the rig much cleaner and lighter. It would also allow for some options that wouldn’t be possible with a four cable approach.

Dirty Tones
It only took a week for me to see that indeed it was magical and it would end up replacing my 3+SE. I did wait a long while to confirm that conclusion and did many tests back and forth. This was the real fork in the road. I couldn’t afford to have a two thousand dollar preamp setting on the shelf for a rainy day. This was the one piece of gear that would have been a major pain to replace. Even if I could find another one it would take several weeks for John Suhr to do the mods. I found it wasn’t hard to find dirty tones that sounded great. Although some of the sims don’t sound that much like the amps they are patterned after, I had several that fit the bill. The clincher was Pete Thorn’s Van Halen amp patch. That gave me the confidence to put the 3+SE on E-bay. Cliff keeps pushing the envelope and tones just get better.

FRFR vs. Guitar Rig
Not very far into this journey, I wanted to try running FRFR. I had been using the VHT 2502 with the V30’s but was intrigued by the concept. Scott Peterson’s posts were especially encouraging. I initially tried a QSC at a music store but it was in the middle of the showroom. I am not one to blast everyone like some guys do. Also my patches were set for the VHT. You can’t just plug in to a FRFR amplification system and expect it to sing. You have to tweak for that….or at least try some patches that had been created with FRFR. My first try didn’t reveal much.

A couple of weeks later I was able to spend some time auditioning a pair of QSC’s at Guitar Center in a isolated corner of the pro audio department. Through the VHT set up I could push patches a bit to the point of a slight clip, but the QSC’s hid nothing. I could tell that I would need to start almost from scratch if I went FRFR. I will say the clean chorus patches sounded much chummier. It took a bit of faith…as everything did in this process. So I bought the QSC’s. With the VHT/Guitar cabs the amp and cab sims sounded almost the same. Through the QSC’s there was much greater character definition and variance to these choices. After making all the adjustments for the new system, I can say with great joy that my range of luscious tones has never been greater. This choice my not be for everyone but it is a huge step forward for me. It has allowed me to do away with microphones. I plug output A straight to the PA. I send output B to my DMC Mini-mix. I input a monitor feed with the rest of the band from the board. All this goes to the QSC’s. I have more control and clarity in a live setting then ever. I run the QSC’s in front of me like monitors. This helps contain stage volume and provides even better guitar interaction at a lower volume. Some guys are turned off by the QSC’s because they are 60 lbs. I just have to smile when I read that. Switching from a 200 lb. rack and a pair of 45 lb. speakers makes my current rig a cakewalk. For the first time in 20 years, I can move my rig without help.

Clean Tones

My clean tone with the black box is great. It is big and warm. Drop a drive block in front and it breaks up nicely. The only thing lacking was my 80’s chorus patch. It just wasn’t quite as chimey as I would have liked. Last week I was think about the lush, chimey tone Steve Stevens got on Flesh For Fantasy. Back in the day I couldn’t figure for the life of me how this was achieved. Thanks to the internet, I learned that he plugged into a Tom Schultz RockMan then straight into the board. A Roland Dimension D. I had also heard that several of the holy grail, 80’s lush clean tones by Mike Landau were done by plugging straight into the board. ….then the light bulb lite up above my head. I removed the cabinet from the signal chain. There it was. The tone that I was able to get close to but never quite right. With my old rack I was in the ballpark but the V30’s in closed cabinets couldn’t reproduce tones as clean and crisp as those recordings.

The Bottom Line
The Axe-FX doesn’t looks as cool as my previous mini-refrigerator rack. There were more individual choices in that system. It took more technical expertise to know how to wire it and troubleshoot it. I do miss all the pretty lights and how people did a double take when they saw it. This allowed me some pride. Regardless of these shallow losses, I much prefer my Axe-FX rig. It allows me to optimize the signal chain and virtual components for each patch in my sonic arsenal without compromise. A rig using individual processors and tube amps to achieve the same level of versatility and uncompromised quality would be enormous and cost as much as small house.

The tones are without limit. The only weak point is me.

I am at what I call "The Grinning Stage." That is when the rig just does exactly what you want and everything sounds incredible. I just wish my playing was as cool as my rig.

There you have it. Enjoy!

MK_axe_rig_2008b_sm.jpg
 
Awesome post MK. I love it when a skeptic "sees the light". Quite a fair review, and you gave all that "boutique" gear the chance to stay in the rack and the Axe-FX still earned it's lonely 2 spaces.
 
That was a very good and pleasant read...and yes, I read the whole thing ;) !

One thing about the Rockman you mentioned though is, that eventhough it's straight to the board, Tom Scholz still designed 'sort of' a speaker sim in there, so disableing the cab sim is not what I would do. The Rockman's clean is really extremely clean and I'd try to use the tube pre together with a cab to take back a little bit of that 'acoustic guitar' kinda tone which in my opinion seems to happen when you play without a speaker sim. The choice of speaker is very important though not to loose too much of that 'direct' tone...

Stevens wasn't the only one to use Rockmans direct to the board. The whole Hysteria album was done like that. ZZ Top's big 80s albums and you can still hear it on tons of other albums. I don't think the Rockman was ever intended to go through an amp...I like to think of it as the Axe's great great great Grandfather :lol: ...basically an amp simulator, just very basic ;) .

Still, out of sheer interest I'd really like to hear your patch for that tone... ;) ...or at least which amp sim you're using.
 
My first impression was much the same. After spending some time with it though,WOW. I am sold on it now.
Great review.
 
Wow... Well I read the whole thing too. Really an interesting chronicle of your road to " enlightenment". I'm just getting my toes wet. Trying a DCM150 and a Mesa Fifty-Fifty into guitar cabs I already own. Haven't yet tweaked a patch. Haven't yet created a patch. Just previewing presets one at a time with my Strat , Tele and LP. I have a Standard. Got mine in June like you. Was thwarted from diving in due to a multitude of personal life hurdles that just didn't allow the time. I downloaded 5.22. I downloaded the new improved A & B Banks as well as the Ultra C Bank. Just taking my time. I'm finding that time goes down a wormhole and that some of the patches inspire me to play things that I never would have come up with otherwise. Patch inspiration? FRFR? I'll be checking that out at some point. Got a lot ahead of me with tweaking/creating patches and the midi floor controller program thing and like you, I'd say I'm intelligent but this will take some doing. However, with what I'm hearing so far ( and what I'm hearing are some of the tones I've heard in my head that have eluded me forever it seems) I'm all in and look forward to working it out. Thanks again for your review. Keep us posted on your journey!
 
That was a very cool read (yes, I read the whole thing :mrgreen: ).

Is there any way you could post a detailed description of your circular delay and reverb settings?
 
VegaBaby said:
That was a very good and pleasant read...and yes, I read the whole thing ;) !

One thing about the Rockman you mentioned though is, that eventhough it's straight to the board, Tom Scholz still designed 'sort of' a speaker sim in there, so disableing the cab sim is not what I would do. The Rockman's clean is really extremely clean and I'd try to use the tube pre together with a cab to take back a little bit of that 'acoustic guitar' kinda tone which in my opinion seems to happen when you play without a speaker sim. The choice of speaker is very important though not to loose too much of that 'direct' tone...

Stevens wasn't the only one to use Rockmans direct to the board. The whole Hysteria album was done like that. ZZ Top's big 80s albums and you can still hear it on tons of other albums. I don't think the Rockman was ever intended to go through an amp...I like to think of it as the Axe's great great great Grandfather :lol: ...basically an amp simulator, just very basic ;) .

Still, out of sheer interest I'd really like to hear your patch for that tone... ;) ...or at least which amp sim you're using.

Thanks for the kind words. Actually I didn't mean to imply that my 80's chorus sound was based on Steve's. It is a combination of Landau, Luke, Huffs and Steve's. I don't think the others were using a Rockman. I will post the patch soon. It has the circular and panning delays too. I try to have most of the same....or at least simular effects on most of my patches. That way when I press the button I use for chorus on the GCpro, it will be there. It is more like having dedicated processors....which is what I am used to. There are some patches I have that are more specialized with blocks that are for that specific sound.
 
Nice review, Michael, (and yes, I read the whole thing) you ought to get into publishing! :lol:

Seriously all, I have stood in the middle of Michael's QSCs while he was playing through the Axe FX through some of those patches with circular delays, reverbs and tones he was talking about... and it is audio heaven. And while he does not mind packing that weight of the QSC's, the cost and weight is too much for me at this point, but I would never knock the tone he gets.

-richard
 
jiagap said:
Seriously all, I have stood in the middle of Michael's QSCs while he was playing through the Axe FX through some of those patches with circular delays, reverbs and tones he was talking about... and it is audio heaven.

Thanks. Wait until you hear them tonight. It sounds even better than last time. :cool:
 
That's one of the best written reviews of anything (not just the Axe-FX) I've ever read.

Kudos.

Now I have to search for your presets if you've uploaded them. I don't download many presets (in fact, I haven't ever done so) but I have to hear yours. That 80's clean chorus sound is something I need for a certain project and I can't find it yet. Color me intrigued to say the least.

Well done.
 
Scott Peterson said:
That's one of the best written reviews of anything (not just the Axe-FX) I've ever read.

Kudos.

Now I have to search for your presets if you've uploaded them. I don't download many presets (in fact, I haven't ever done so) but I have to hear yours. That 80's clean chorus sound is something I need for a certain project and I can't find it yet. Color me intrigued to say the least.

Well done.

Wow! Thanks Scott. I consider that a high compliment considering your writings here have been very instrumental to my journey.

I haven't uploaded the patches yet but I will be bringing the rig back home this weekend...so I will get to it in the next few days.
 
Thanks for a very inspiring review MK! Much appreciated.

I'm not 'there' yet with my Ultra, partly due to lack of satisfactory amplification (existing 4x12 too impractical, existing FRFR not up to par), but mostly due to ongoing lack of time and precious few opportunities to experiment at gig volume. What can I say, I'm a weekend player with a day job and a family. Reviews like this give me the confidence boost I need to know that I'll get there eventually, and it will be worth the wait!

BTW, I'm planning to go pick up a single QSC this weekend. I will really appreciate if you upload your patches to the exchange, I'll definitely check them out.

Now I just need some way to kick everyone out of the house for a week or two ;) lol, I'm lucky if I get an hour or two in a calendar month.
 
As one who has heard MKeditor's patches up close and personal, I would testify that I am not sure ONE QSC would do them justice. He capitalizes on the stereo imagining available within the ULTRA - and it is SWEET to the ears.
 
Robboman- man can I relate. I'm a self employed plumbing contractor w/ a family trying to do a classic rock band and also do 2-3 Sundays a month with a Praise and Worship band. I think I just need to take two solid weeks off and try to make some real " Axe Progress" ! Sure liking what I'm hearing so far but haven't used it live yet.
 
Hey MK...thanks for the patch !

I gave it whirl last night, but it clipped my Axe pretty hard.

Are you using the volume pedal a lot to keep the patch from doing that or did I dl a bad patch ?

I noticed there was a weird buzzing going on (almost like static) as well whenever I played anything. I bypassed all the effects one at a time to no avail, then I bypassed the amp and that got rid of it.

I just kinda wondered how you were using it, I can hear the possibilities with it,(I have 2 QSC's as well and was excited to hear it thinking it would translate well) maybe I need to tweak a bit on my end.
 
gittarzann said:
Hey MK...thanks for the patch !

I gave it whirl last night, but it clipped my Axe pretty hard.

Are you using the volume pedal a lot to keep the patch from doing that or did I dl a bad patch ?

I noticed there was a weird buzzing going on (almost like static) as well whenever I played anything. I bypassed all the effects one at a time to no avail, then I bypassed the amp and that got rid of it.

I just kinda wondered how you were using it, I can hear the possibilities with it,(I have 2 QSC's as well and was excited to hear it thinking it would translate well) maybe I need to tweak a bit on my end.

That is puzzling. What kind of guitar were you using? Which firmware do you have? I do use the volume pedal but I haven't had any clipping on that patch. Since you have QSCs too, my best guess is the pickups. My guitar is a Suhr with V60LP single coils. The LP stands for low output. Perhaps your pickups are putting out a hotter signal. Try backing off the gain.

Has anyone else tried the patch?
 
I was using my Paul with JB bridge and Dimarzio PAF neck.

I should have broke out my Melancon with Rio Grande Half Breeds to try.

Maybe tonight I will try again.

From what I can make of the patch, I really like the idea of no cab sim.....super crystal clear, but something is definitely going on.

The thought has crossed my mind that perhaps some patches don't always upload/download correctly. I doubt that is possible, unless user error is involved some where.


edit...I am running the latest fw
 
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