Stupid question but still a question

[Giulio]

I know that the question may seem silly but it is something that has crossed my mind on more than one occasion: considering that the functioning of Fractal involves both software and hardware and that in the latter there are perhaps elements with different values and operating tolerances, is it possible that two AxeFx sound more or less different?

 

[zafreemusic]

All of the "sound" comes from modelling which is software on the axe fx. So no I don't think it is possible for 2 AFX to sound different. It is however possible that the volume pots are different due to tolerances I would think.

 

[iaresee]

is it possible that two AxeFx sound more or less different?

Not unless one of them is defective.

 

[Greg Ferguson]

I know that the question may seem silly but it is something that has crossed my mind on more than one occasion: considering that the functioning of Fractal involves both software and hardware and that in the latter there are perhaps elements with different values and operating tolerances, is it possible that two AxeFx sound more or less different?

Think of it like this: is it possible for two different computers to generate different answers to 1+1 in code? No.

A modeler is a computer at its core and the CPU is guaranteed to return the same result repeatedly. What would be the point of having a computer that was almost right?

 

[Rick]

At some point, to make it audible to you, the sound will have to be made analog and that’s where variation outside FAS‘s control might be brought in.

In my intentionally-less-than-scientific approach to playing, none of it really matters enough to be a concern. I know some will say they can hear the difference if the length of screws holding the lid on is changed. Don’t waste time in that bottomless pit. They all come out of the factory sounding great.

 

[Giulio]

Not unless one of them is defective.

Aside from when it doesn't make any sound, how do you know when it is faulty?

 

[Giulio]

Think of it like this: is it possible for two different computers to generate different answers to 1+1 in code? No.

A modeler is a computer at its core and the CPU is guaranteed to return the same result repeatedly. What would be the point of having a computer that was almost right?

In fact, if you re-read my question, it was probably more about the hardware elements, but I'm not an expert...

 

[iaresee]

Aside from when it doesn't make any sound, how do you know when it is faulty?

Unless there’s something seriously wrong it can be hard to tell. When in doubt https://support.fractalaudio.com can walk you through diagnostic steps.

 

[dr bonkers]

In fact, if you re-read my question, it was more about the hardware elements, but I'm not an expert...

The manufacturing tolerances on A/D and D/A converters are so low as to be negligible by design. Otherwise CD players, cable boxes, cell phones, etc. would all sound different from unit to unit within a model line. That doesn't happen.

Besides that you have the hum buster tech and a signal booster which are also tight tolerance.

No you don't have to worry about variability between units.

 

[Severed]

I'm curious to hear what Cliff would say TBH. I've read his displeasure on several occasions on the topic of components variances while measuring amps.

 

[Mark-B]

'Likely see more variables introduced by the types of signal transference into and out of the unit - quality of cables/connectors used into and out of the unit.. I think any tolerances to signal routed within the box would be unnoticeable if existent at all.

Practically. No. I doubt there's any difference. ..Just a guess.

 

[Teun]

Absolutely.

That's why people like Leon Todd always sound much better than me.
It's not because I'm a worse player, I promise.

(Honestly though, no, there is zero difference in sound between units)

 

[johnnypig]

Being pedantic, there will be differences in the too small to matter region on analog input and outputs, as in two units may not completely null say .5db @ -100db or lower, likely far better. There will be jitter and power supply noise down there too.
There's gonna be tiny errors in FIR filters and comparator circuits in the ad/da, also FFT in the pitch block as an example.
All dsps and cpus have errors depending on how hard they're working and how well the fpu, pipelining, caching, etc is designed.
That's simply a matter of physics that cannot be defeated.
None of what I typed has any value to anyone but bare metal designers and only a handful even then.

 

[Giulio]

Absolutely.

That's why people like Leon Todd always sound much better than me.
It's not because I'm a worse player, I promise.

(Honestly though, no, there is zero difference in sound between units)

I think knowing how to use the DAW and how to record well can also make a lot of difference

 

[Greg Ferguson]

I'm curious to hear what Cliff would say TBH. I've read his displeasure on several occasions on the topic of components variances while measuring amps.

Those are analog devices being made by companies that have a more “relaxed” attitude towards quality control because the majority of analog amplifiers don’t require tight tolerances.

Digital, by its nature, is accurate and repeatable. Encoders, like the A-E knobs, are exact. I suspect the output knobs are also encoders too, telling the D/A converters to generate more voltage, but even if they’re not, the content of the audio waveform would be identical with a tiny difference in amplitude. Cliff takes pride in the accuracy of the modeler’s output and ability to match the original amp’s sound, and consistency in doing so is important.

 

[johnnypig]

@Greg Ferguson "Identical with a tiny difference". You're either a geologist or an electronic engineer

 

[Greg Ferguson]

@Greg Ferguson "Identical with a tiny difference". You're either a geologist or an electronic engineer

Close.

 

[kushdingies]

Absolutely.

That's why people like Leon Todd always sound much better than me.
It's not because I'm a worse player, I promise.

(Honestly though, no, there is zero difference in sound between units)

I think Leon's guitars also have super high output pickups (at least the PRS ones he uses often). When I follow along with his videos using my Ibanez RG752AHM (with Dimarzio PAF's) I have to crank the shit out of the input trim (or add a preamp boost or something) to get similar levels of gain. But then when I use my Schecter (with Duncan Design pickups) the gain is much higher.

Of course Leon kicks my ass as a player too

 

[Greg Ferguson]

I think Leon's guitars also have super high output pickups (at least the PRS ones he uses often). When I follow along with his videos using my Ibanez RG752AHM (with Dimarzio PAF's) I have to crank the shit out of the input trim (or add a preamp boost or something) to get similar levels of gain. But then when I use my Schecter (with Duncan Design pickups) the gain is much higher.

Of course Leon kicks my ass as a player too

Leon has some PRS with high output and some with the stock/medium output. He always sounds good.

 

[pauly]

Hi Giulio,
I’m going to buck the trend here and say yes.
There are A to D, and D to A, sections within the axe fx and as these get refined over time, I’d suggest that the differences are quantifiable though maybe subtle. As an example, (I haven’t reverse engineered anything so may be completely wrong!j, I’d suggest the conversion sections in the ultra are different to those in the axe fx 3, and would probably be improved.

(Edit) - or did you mean 2 axe fx 3 units? If so - they will sound identical.

Thanks
Pauly

I know that the question may seem silly but it is something that has crossed my mind on more than one occasion: considering that the functioning of Fractal involves both software and hardware and that in the latter there are perhaps elements with different values and operating tolerances, is it possible that two AxeFx sound more or less different?