Stef Carpenter and firmware updates

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Stef and I are friends through Fractal. I totally get where he's coming from. He worked hard. He brought in people (including yours truly) to help him dial in what he wanted, with VERY fine attention to detail. He was satisfied. For whatever presumably good reasons (see below) he'd then update to a major new firmware version and find he needed to revisit tones -- probably because he is in a very demanding situation where things are expected to work and sound a specific way. This "revisiting" cycle happened several times over the years. I think he has now realized that it's OK to stay where you are and that even a Fractal owner can be happy with that. Hey, maybe he'll keep an extra Axe-Fx to play with on the latest version while your touring gear stays parked.. ;-) Scratch the itch!

About this "itch", I'll share some more thoughts.

The truth is, I recommend to any pro that they should not upgrade firmware mid-tour, or during rehearsals, or unless they've really got the time to re-visit what they need. (Sometimes even being between tours does not constitute a "break." Gear will be stowed. Time will be tight. etc.) For different people, the amount of time required will vary considerably. As for why things need to be consistent, how we play is affected by how we sound. Also, a band's sound can depend on a very specific guitar sound. There's often no reason or desire to make changes--which have ripple effects through an organization. (Have you read FOH engineer "Big Mick's" quote on the Fractal home page? His opinion probably mattered as much as or more than those of the band members, who'd gotten onboard first.) It's the same with other tours I've worked on over the years. Could things sound "better?" Sure! Would it be fun to try all those new amps, cabs, and effects? Sure! But is not being on the latest firmware the only compromise that professional musicians make? Hehehehe. Not by a mile. (A talk for another day.)

So... that itch... the itch to upgrade. On one hand you have the objective fact that firmware updates bring improvements. Sound evolution. New features. Fixes. It's a real temptation!!! If you have the "juice" (meaning the energy, the time, and the desire to bring in new features, resolve problems caused by things like retired factory cabs, changes in amp level, etc.) then nothing should prevent you from enjoying the benefits of updates. In fact, due to features like RESET AMPS (which I pair with screen captures of Axe-Edit) very little skill is required and MOST of us are probably in a position to take advantage of most updates. Example: I play all the time, and I never take anything less than the very latest firmware with me (even beta!). A few hours of prep and I know I'll have my basics: some forms of clean, crunch, heavy, lead, ambient sounds, a few outliers. Heck, there are pros all over the world who play on rented backline or borrowed gear and face greater challenges than what comes with a firmware update. As for me, I embrace that leading/bleeding edge. It's the notes that matter. It's the communication between the musicians on stage. (On the flip side, if I'm feeling crummy, no tone however perfect is going to make me think I didn't suck.) Therefore, I embrace the Zen of firmware updating. (We could have the same basic conversation about the "rabbit hole" of tone).

I'd also like to talk about seeking change for the sake of change. This is actually a two-edged sword. For many of us—top pros included—that ever-changing aspect of our sound is not tedium, but fun. We love to tinker. Pedalboard players often swap pedals in and out. Sound techs the world over are driven mad by ever-moving amp settings (like between soundcheck and curtain). But we NEED to do it. We need it to be RIGHT. I am reminded of a story I tell about comedian George Burns making "tweaks" to his punchlines. It became like a pseudo-science of small variables. Even within the small space his career carved out for change, he drove "his people" crazy by obsessing over the details, always thinking and talking about whether "psoriasis" or "eczema" might get the bigger laugh on a given night. The truth was, it would probably never have mattered to anyone except him. But if this obsession excited him to perform, then it mattered to everyone!

At the same time though, "dissatisfaction" can become an obsession, taking the focus away from our looking more closely at ourselves, our musicianship, our circumstances. Knowing where to put your energy, picking the right battle, having the foresight to stick with a good thing... these represent a discipline. Mastering the satisfaction of stasis, understanding the factors that push and pull you to want to change... these things can be just as important as mastery of your instrument, or having the right band mates. I see people OWN this challenge. I likewise see it DESTROY people. Maybe ask yourself: why update?

So, to change course a little, I want to disagree with the comment about Axe-Change being obsolete. I think this isn't true at all for several reasons.
  • Every Axe-Change upload ALSO includes information on which firmware version was used to create the preset in question.
  • In my experience, no firmware update has ever "destroyed" a preset beyond simple tweaking.
  • Individual presets don't necessarily shift in the same way members of a set might diverge from each other.
  • If the IR hasn't changed you can recover the basic underlying tone incredibly easily.
  • Most presets represent a starting point anyway. You're already going to tweak to taste.
  • The differences between guitars and players account for more disparateness that the differences between firmware versions.
  • Many presets are mostly about effects, most of which have grown but never changed.
  • Axe-Change is just as much of a learning tool as it is a grab-and-go. One learns by "vivisecting" other people's presets.
  • Presets for the most recent major version always sound exactly as intended!
Talking about these things is like the study of history: there are often perspectives, but seldom answers. Now that you have my perspective, I feel I've gone on too long for a forum post.

Have fun,
 
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Yeah, that's one hell of a post! ;)

Great points there though... especially about dissatisfaction can be an obsession too. Man I've been there with gear. Can't say my Axe is one of them though, lol.
 
I would think he could have his touring rig, with a known and dialed in FW, and then maybe have his home Axe unit which he experiments with creating new tones on, and that is up to date.

2 Axe's is extravagant to some degree, but he is a rock star....
 
I just want to get preset and an IR that'll get me to the crunch of the song "Risk" :)

Seeing Stef and the boys in August !
 
I tend to only update when I see a new feature or new amp I want to try. I've personally never noticed much difference between these incremental updates where cliff changes some small obscure thing to be more accurate. The most common change is volume differences, which is easy to adjust for. I've also never had any issues with bugs. I once was inadvertently using a beta firmware for a few months, and I didn't even realize. People here tend to make noise when any little bug pops up or anything stops working and it gets fixed immediately.

The only times a firmware update has 'broken' my patches (basically just made them sound significantly different) is when a single amp gets a major update. When it happened to the Rectos back in firmware 18 or so, it was a huge positive for me, since it was then way easier to get the sound I was going for. But when the Cameron CCV got updated, I wasn't able to get the same sound I had before with my CCV patch. I could downgrade for FW18 to get back to that model, but I don't care enough to do so, to be honest, as everything else in the box more than makes up for losing that particular model.

I might try messing around with the CCV again today though, I remember it having a real nasty, grindy midrange.
 
Btw, I'm really digging the new record.
The tunes are very diverse and there are cool sections throughout the record.
If you listen to a song like 'Doomed User' it kind of sounds like an Orange cab (which he uses atm on stage).
Could very well be IR's or tonematches too.
I wonder what amp models he uses....
 
This one should be a sticky thread :cool:

Stef and I are friends through Fractal. I totally get where he's coming from. He worked hard. He brought in people (including yours truly) to help him dial in what he wanted, with VERY fine attention to detail. He was satisfied. For whatever presumably good reasons (see below) he'd then update to a major new firmware version and find he needed to revisit tones -- probably because he is in a very demanding situation where things are expected to work and sound a specific way. This "revisiting" cycle happened several times over the years. I think he has now realized that it's OK to stay where you are and that even a Fractal owner can be happy with that. Hey, maybe he'll keep an extra Axe-Fx to play with on the latest version while your touring gear stays parked.. ;-) Scratch the itch!

About this "itch", I'll share some more thoughts.

The truth is, I recommend to any pro that they should not upgrade firmware mid-tour, or during rehearsals, or unless they've really got the time to re-visit what they need. (Sometimes even being between tours does not constitute a "break." Gear will be stowed. Time will be tight. etc.) For different people, the amount of time required will vary considerably. As for why things need to be consistent, how we play is affected by how we sound. Also, a band's sound can depend on a very specific guitar sound. There's often no reason or desire to make changes--which have ripple effects through an organization. (Have you read FOH engineer "Big Mick's" quote on the Fractal home page? His opinion probably mattered as much as or more than those of the band members, who'd gotten onboard first.) It's the same with other tours I've worked on over the years. Could things sound "better?" Sure! Would it be fun to try all those new amps, cabs, and effects? Sure! But is not being on the latest firmware the only compromise that professional musicians make? Hehehehe. Not by a mile. (A talk for another day.)

So... that itch... the itch to upgrade. On one hand you have the objective fact that firmware updates bring improvements. Sound evolution. New features. Fixes. It's a real temptation!!! If you have the "juice" (meaning the energy, the time, and the desire to bring in new features, resolve problems caused by things like retired factory cabs, changes in amp level, etc.) then nothing should prevent you from enjoying the benefits of updates. In fact, due to features like RESET AMPS (which I pair with screen captures of Axe-Edit) very little skill is required and MOST of us are probably in a position to take advantage of most updates. Example: I play all the time, and I never take anything less than the very latest firmware with me (even beta!). A few hours of prep and I know I'll have my basics: some forms of clean, crunch, heavy, lead, ambient sounds, a few outliers. Heck, there are pros all over the world who play on rented backline or borrowed gear and face greater challenges than what comes with a firmware update. As for me, I embrace that leading/bleeding edge. It's the notes that matter. It's the communication between the musicians on stage. (On the flip side, if I'm feeling crummy, no tone however perfect is going to make me think I didn't suck.) Therefore, I embrace the Zen of firmware updating. (We could have the same basic conversation about the "rabbit hole" of tone).

I'd also like to talk about seeking change for the sake of change. This is actually a two-edged sword. For many of us—top pros included—that ever-changing aspect of our sound is not tedium, but fun. We love to tinker. Pedalboard players often swap pedals in and out. Sound techs the world over are driven mad by ever-moving amp settings (like between soundcheck and curtain). But we NEED to do it. We need it to be RIGHT. I am reminded of a story I tell about comedian George Burns making "tweaks" to his punchlines. It became like a pseudo-science of small variables. Even within the small space his career carved out for change, he drove "his people" crazy by obsessing over the details, always thinking and talking about whether "psoriasis" or "eczema" might get the bigger laugh on a given night. The truth was, it would probably never have mattered to anyone except him. But if this obsession excited him to perform, then it mattered to everyone!

At the same time though, "dissatisfaction" can become an obsession, taking the focus away from our looking more closely at ourselves, our musicianship, our circumstances. Knowing where to put your energy, picking the right battle, having the foresight to stick with a good thing... these represent a discipline. Mastering the satisfaction of stasis, understanding the factors that push and pull you to want to change... these things can be just as important as mastery of your instrument, or having the right band mates. I see people OWN this challenge. I likewise see it DESTROY people. Maybe ask yourself: why update?

So, to change course a little, I want to disagree with the comment about Axe-Change being obsolete. I think this isn't true at all for several reasons.
  • In my experience, no firmware update has ever "destroyed" a preset beyond simple tweaking.
  • Individual presets don't necessarily shift in the same way members of a set might diverge from each other.
  • If the IR hasn't changed you can recover the basic underlying tone incredibly easily.
  • Most presets represent a starting point anyway. You're already going to tweak to taste.
  • The differences between guitars and players account for more disparateness that the differences between firmware versions.
  • Many presets are mostly about effects, most of which have grown but never changed.
  • Axe-Change is just as much of a learning tool as it is a grab-and-go. One learns by "vivisecting" other people's presets.
  • Presets for the most recent major version always sound exactly as intended!
Talking about these things is like the study of history: there are often perspectives, but seldom answers. Now that you have my perspective, I feel I've gone on too long for a forum post.

Have fun,
 
I save my old firmware. I only have what came with it and the latest version.
But Here is part of an article that explains a procedure:
Backup, Install, and Rollback Firmware on the Axe-Fx II
by Chris | Aug 28, 2015 | Featured, General FAQ - Axe-Fx II

Tempted to install the latest Firmware or Public Beta, but not sure what to do if you don’t like it? Use Fractal-Bot to Backup your current settings, Install the latest Firmware, and Rollback to previous Firmware and settings you saved from the Backup.

The most important step always is to BACKUP using the Receive tab in Fractal-Bot. Without a backup, you can never return to an older version. Also be sure to quit Axe-Edit when using Fractal-Bot.
I use Bot for backups but why is it necessary to quit axe edit when doing a backup with Bot?
 
I use Bot for backups but why is it necessary to quit axe edit when doing a backup with Bot?
They compete for MIDI comms with the hardware. You don't have to quit Axe-Edit, simply pausing comms from it is sufficient.
 
I just want to get preset and an IR that'll get me to the crunch of the song "Risk" :)

Seeing Stef and the boys in August !
That's one of his harder tones (Risk) to nail because that song has less gain than the rest of the DE album and it's much cleaner yet still has that punch crunch tone. That's a tough one
 
I'm an actively gigging and rehearsing guitarist. I scrambled one too many times to get my tones dialed in for a show after updating firmware. I stopped upgrading pre Quantum. I should have stopped at FW10, just after the introduction of Scenes functionality. The introduction of Scenes was, in my case, the last real justification for me to upgrade. I also believe FW10 was the best compromise of "easy to work with" vs "great tones" for the old school amps I use - mostly Vox, Fender, Marshall. I was very satisfied at 10.

I'm on FW 14 or 17 now. I don't remember. I have no noticeable bugs or glitches and still enjoy finding amazing and useable new sounds to this day.

But, the main reason that I stopped upgrading: My Hearing.

I play enough as it is. To have to sit and listen critically to all of my presets and dial them in again was not only taking up valuable time. It was greatly fatiguing my ears.

Tinnitus is something we all probably struggle with. IMHO, tinnitus is exacerbated by digital music. I'm not necessarily referring to the Axe FX as it lets me achieve tones I need at lower volumes - which helps.

Digital music as a whole contains computer generated frequencies and subharmonics that don't occur naturally in analog music. Those artificially enhanced frequencies seem to fire up my tinnitus.

As proof, I can listen to a ton of recorded-to-tape-vinyl with very little fatigue. But, when I stream or playback digital downloads - my ears get tired sooner.

I've also noticed that I can turn up analog music louder and still talk with friends than I can with digital. Conversation struggles with digital at the same perceived volume.

For proof of concept, Red Rocks concert venue here in Colorado had to impose decibel and frequency limits on the EDM shows recently as the artificial bass frequencies were shaking homes up Morrison canyon - something that never occurred in the past with even the loudest analog artists.

I also do a lot of mixing and playback of our band. The bass player has embraced digital modeling for years. I always struggle with getting his recorded tones to translate. At gigs they sound great - big, full and round. When I load them into my DAW, I have to make significant cuts under 60hz to get them to play nice with the other instruments due to the digital artifacts. It's gotten better since he switched to Axe FX. It was really bad when he was using the POD Pro.

Firmware updates may bring new sounds that are critical to you but even more critical is your hearing health. Protect your hearing!
 
sorry but am i the only guy here who always upgrades to the newest fw (except betas) and never had to re-tweak presets after updates ? i just dont upgrade before gigs just in case but still...
and im not bashing anyone maybe my presets are just too simple to get effected drastically from upgrades.
 
I'm an actively gigging and rehearsing guitarist. I scrambled one too many times to get my tones dialed in for a show after updating firmware. I stopped upgrading pre Quantum. I should have stopped at FW10, just after the introduction of Scenes functionality. The introduction of Scenes was, in my case, the last real justification for me to upgrade. I also believe FW10 was the best compromise of "easy to work with" vs "great tones" for the old school amps I use - mostly Vox, Fender, Marshall. I was very satisfied at 10.

I'm on FW 14 or 17 now. I don't remember. I have no noticeable bugs or glitches and still enjoy finding amazing and useable new sounds to this day.

But, the main reason that I stopped upgrading: My Hearing.

I play enough as it is. To have to sit and listen critically to all of my presets and dial them in again was not only taking up valuable time. It was greatly fatiguing my ears.

Tinnitus is something we all probably struggle with. IMHO, tinnitus is exacerbated by digital music. I'm not necessarily referring to the Axe FX as it lets me achieve tones I need at lower volumes - which helps.

Digital music as a whole contains computer generated frequencies and subharmonics that don't occur naturally in analog music. Those artificially enhanced frequencies seem to fire up my tinnitus.

As proof, I can listen to a ton of recorded-to-tape-vinyl with very little fatigue. But, when I stream or playback digital downloads - my ears get tired sooner.

I've also noticed that I can turn up analog music louder and still talk with friends than I can with digital. Conversation struggles with digital at the same perceived volume.

For proof of concept, Red Rocks concert venue here in Colorado had to impose decibel and frequency limits on the EDM shows recently as the artificial bass frequencies were shaking homes up Morrison canyon - something that never occurred in the past with even the loudest analog artists.

I also do a lot of mixing and playback of our band. The bass player has embraced digital modeling for years. I always struggle with getting his recorded tones to translate. At gigs they sound great - big, full and round. When I load them into my DAW, I have to make significant cuts under 60hz to get them to play nice with the other instruments due to the digital artifacts. It's gotten better since he switched to Axe FX. It was really bad when he was using the POD Pro.

Firmware updates may bring new sounds that are critical to you but even more critical is your hearing health. Protect your hearing!

Whaat? :confused:
 
I came here because i thought Stef Carpenter had something to say.
All he would say is "try not to get too wrapped up into another's tone or what preset u should use or fiddle with, the most important thing to remember is you gotta have fun. Just have a good time and go with what makes YOU happy."
Btw that's a real quote haha
 
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