Sounds boxy

The PEQ block is an incredible tool to add / subtract frequencies. I know feel like my power amp and cab patches feel better than before. I also try to match the impedance curve when possible to my real cabs. Sometimes this doesn't work as well as I'm using a single amp in the chain for FOH and Real cab. I highly recommend becoming familiar with the PEQ black to get rid of the "boxy " sound, as well as bump up where you want more fullness.

YES!!!
 
Wondering about the syn 5050, that's one I wanted to check out with the axe. Unlike a PS100 or PS, the syn5050 could have options with the modules as well, I know the fryette gear is superb, I just do not need an attenuator, so it would not make sense and seems like I'd be not using it for one of it's best features. The syn5050 or LX seem more appropriate for a pA.
I really like the Syn5050 - I'm an old tube guy so it just "feels" right to me. I like the Depth and Presence controls on the front. The other day I switched back to the Matrix to see the difference and I was impressed. The Matrix still sounded good with the patch I have dialed in for the Syn 5050. I do like the the low mids in the SYN for fullness. Since i use it just to monitor on stage it's not a huge deal.
 
I really like the Syn5050 - I'm an old tube guy so it just "feels" right to me. I like the Depth and Presence controls on the front. The other day I switched back to the Matrix to see the difference and I was impressed. The Matrix still sounded good with the patch I have dialed in for the Syn 5050. I do like the the low mids in the SYN for fullness. Since i use it just to monitor on stage it's not a huge deal.
Thank you, definitely interested, knowing it's not totally night and day comparison help with the G.AS. and $ at least for a week lol
 
I don't have experience with the Matrix, but I've used the Seymour Duncan PS170 and Fryette LXII. I frequently will use the output EQ (as parametric) to occasionally boost in the 120hz range (peaking, with a relatively narrow Q) for that low thump. Each stage/room is different though, so that's why I don't build that boost into my presets. Additionally, the PS170 and LXII are voiced very differently (PS170 is much boxier to my ear), so the PS170 usually gets a cut somewhere in the lower mids as well. Conversely with the LXII, I'll often use a very wide midrange boost (centered anywhere between 600-800 hz).
 
I don't have experience with the Matrix, but I've used the Seymour Duncan PS170 and Fryette LXII. I frequently will use the output EQ (as parametric) to occasionally boost in the 120hz range (peaking, with a relatively narrow Q) for that low thump. Each stage/room is different though, so that's why I don't build that boost into my presets. Additionally, the PS170 and LXII are voiced very differently (PS170 is much boxier to my ear), so the PS170 usually gets a cut somewhere in the lower mids as well. Conversely with the LXII, I'll often use a very wide midrange boost (centered anywhere between 600-800 hz).
Great news!! Definitely trying this! Thank you for your knowledge! The low thump is what I seem to not hear when I crank the amp..one thing I love about the fractal is it stays the same at all volumes, I dont play super loud at home but I find it's best to play loud when creating/tweaking presets. Some of the sounds I love sound the same when louder with frfr. Which is good and bad if that makes sense. That particular sound is great for lower volumes and plain enjoyment, not suited for a mix. And that's ok, different dbs for different situations is even more to enjoy!!
 
Thanks AndrewJay, it's more of a dynamic I cant seem to dial out or dial in. PRS, matrix1000, bogner 2x12 w/ v30s. This patch is one I like and would like to go from there, it's safe to say I could just use another patch, scene but then I am not dialing out or in what I'd like to hear. Hopeful its something simple or perhaps nothing and over analyzing, I think it sounds good! Just looking for more low end punch, not necessarily bass or resonance. Was hoping someone downloaded the file and heard something that could be of help to add or leave out or adjust
I use a Mesa 295 and two 4x12. I almost always use the GEQ set to the «Mesa eq»/5-band eq.
Less sliders to mess up the sound with and does the job for me at least.
 
Thanks AndrewJay, it's more of a dynamic I cant seem to dial out or dial in. PRS, matrix1000, bogner 2x12 w/ v30s. This patch is one I like and would like to go from there, it's safe to say I could just use another patch, scene but then I am not dialing out or in what I'd like to hear. Hopeful its something simple or perhaps nothing and over analyzing, I think it sounds good! Just looking for more low end punch, not necessarily bass or resonance. Was hoping someone downloaded the file and heard something that could be of help to add or leave out or adjust
Thanks for the info. Low end punch is usually a result of volume. You usually have to move air to get that, but there are ways in the Axe to get a taste of that at lower volumes. I especially found that to be true with V30s. Now, in your patch, you have the Cab blocks activated. You said in your initial post that you have them disabled, I'm assuming you've done that in the Global setup menu. Also, the wah is activated on every Scene. I'll assume with your rig it isn't. Since you are using a Bogner 2x12, I think the closest Speaker Impedance Curve would be the Recto 2x12 one. I would try that to help shape your tone and response. That low end punch comes from the relationship of your amp, speaker, and guitar forming a feedback loop and a SIC that matches helps that process. As far as your power amp is concerned, I have the same one. I like it, but it does require turning it up to get it to get to that place. I dime the volumes on the Matrix and use the Output Level control on the front panel of the Axe to control the overall volume. There is something about the taper of the volume control on the Matrix that just needs to be opened up to at least 2 o'clock. Anyhow, others will chime in with additional information that may be of use, but this is what I got. Hope this helps!
 
Thanks for the info. Low end punch is usually a result of volume. You usually have to move air to get that, but there are ways in the Axe to get a taste of that at lower volumes. I especially found that to be true with V30s. Now, in your patch, you have the Cab blocks activated. You said in your initial post that you have them disabled, I'm assuming you've done that in the Global setup menu. Also, the wah is activated on every Scene. I'll assume with your rig it isn't. Since you are using a Bogner 2x12, I think the closest Speaker Impedance Curve would be the Recto 2x12 one. I would try that to help shape your tone and response. That low end punch comes from the relationship of your amp, speaker, and guitar forming a feedback loop and a SIC that matches helps that process. As far as your power amp is concerned, I have the same one. I like it, but it does require turning it up to get it to get to that place. I dime the volumes on the Matrix and use the Output Level control on the front panel of the Axe to control the overall volume. There is something about the taper of the volume control on the Matrix that just needs to be opened up to at least 2 o'clock. Anyhow, others will chime in with additional information that may be of use, but this is what I got. Hope this helps!
Many thanks!! I have matrix at about 2 o'clock, I've cranked the axe up from there and yes its louder and I can hear some more definitive tones. The low end is the one thing I definitely cant get , dont get me wrong I'm more of a standard tuned guitar player and the Diezel, and maybe the rec are both heavy favorites in the realm of dropped tunings and bass heavier guitars. If I am able to get more of that bass response I think it will allow me to feel like I'm getting solid results from my Matrix/axe3. I owned a Hagen for a bit and they have a very unique low end gain structure, I had the amp.modded to dial some of it out, Peter Diezel provided the specs for me to try the mod. Anyway, finding that or close to sound would help me as far as creting ,and knowing what not and to do for certain amps. I honestly think its me hearing the SS power of the matrix, not meaning that in a bad way. It's great sounding. I look forward to trying your suggestions, where do I find the SIC of the mesa 2x12? I am new to the SIC curve and know it's in settings , is there a place or adjustment that gives the values so I can implement the SIC settings in reference to a mesa 2x12 w v/30? Regards.
 
I have a Matrix that I use as my power amp which normally feeds a Greenback 412 cabinet. During a couple recent gigs I had no room for the 412 so I used a 212 cabinet with Vintage 30's. Oh man, it was not pleasant on my ears. I have a Greenback IR cabinet going out FOH and it is a nice match for my real cabinet but the Vintage 30's not so much. I guess my point is that it could be the speakers. I know some people like Vintage 30's because of the cutting mids but I tend to EQ with a high mid bump anyway and the Vintage 30's just made it almost unbearable.
 
Can anyone see anything that jumps out, I am using a matrix 1000gt/2x12 cab. Amp modeling on cab modeling off, I cant seem to dial out , what I hear as a boxy perhaps slightly muffled tone. Many Thanks
it's IMPOSSIBLE to tell what you hear even sharing your preset (although it helps). I think you should also record the result and share that to provide some kind of baseline. Boxy for you might be perfect for someone else.
 
I tried to snap shot the patch/preset so people could.maybe download and plug in and notice anything that jumped out or a setting that may not be good. The recording you mentioned was explained earlier in this thread, I do not have an interface, YouTube recordings add gain and frequencies and do not give 100% authentication, as well as cell phones have buffering when recording and that is what I would have to use not having an interface. My apologies, thank you for your efforts and consideration. Regards
 
I use a Mesa 295 and two 4x12. I almost always use the GEQ set to the «Mesa eq»/5-band eq.
Less sliders to mess up the sound with and does the job for me at least.
I've used the mesa geq, love it and used it in this preset. I'd love to hear this preset with your 295, I wonder if it's the SS I'm hearing, it's a killer amp, no question but tubes may add something
 
Many thanks!! I have matrix at about 2 o'clock, I've cranked the axe up from there and yes its louder and I can hear some more definitive tones. The low end is the one thing I definitely cant get , dont get me wrong I'm more of a standard tuned guitar player and the Diezel, and maybe the rec are both heavy favorites in the realm of dropped tunings and bass heavier guitars. If I am able to get more of that bass response I think it will allow me to feel like I'm getting solid results from my Matrix/axe3. I owned a Hagen for a bit and they have a very unique low end gain structure, I had the amp.modded to dial some of it out, Peter Diezel provided the specs for me to try the mod. Anyway, finding that or close to sound would help me as far as creting ,and knowing what not and to do for certain amps. I honestly think its me hearing the SS power of the matrix, not meaning that in a bad way. It's great sounding. I look forward to trying your suggestions, where do I find the SIC of the mesa 2x12? I am new to the SIC curve and know it's in settings , is there a place or adjustment that gives the values so I can implement the SIC settings in reference to a mesa 2x12 w v/30? Regards.
No problem. I would try bringing the amp back to default settings, turning off the EQs and try to get the bass response from your patch at as close to gig volume as possible. Then, slowly start adjusting from the basic EQs to post or pre EQ. The SIC is in the Speaker tab of the Amp Block. I would use that to start with and adjust as necessary.
 
Make sure Output Mode in the Amp block is set to "SS PWR AMP + CAB".
Could you please share what is the sound difference between the Amp block Output modes? I am just wondering what to look for in the sound.
I don't seem to hear much of a difference when switching in between the modes, either on SS amp (Technics Class H+) & Traditional Cab (egnater oversized 2x12 loaded with V30 or F12M-150) or with studio monitors.

Either way it sounds fantastic!!
 
Curious why I could not so much as get a reply on this? I see people.posting looking for help and suggestions, that is what I am hoping for. Perhaps I did something wrong?
I've started a few threads with no replies lol! would'nt worry about it. Got around to taking a look after moving my GT1000fx over to my 2 x 112s (v30s). You sure you've got cab modelling off eh?, cuz the patch is crazy bright for me even with my darkest guitar (Carvin Humbuckers) and listening with my tinnitus ears - definitely not muffled - ya maybe a bit boxy. Here it's also almost clipping on output. I find the the patch much better to my ear (less boxy) with the EQ at the end off - but..., different hands, different ears, different room, different cabs ... hard to say - you'd probably have to post a clip as suggested above - I don't see/hear any obviously severe issues.
 
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Thank you for downloading the file, I believe your the 1st, everyone else just chimed in, and that's not a complaint, I need the advice and appreciate everyone for the efforts made. I'm new at this so my efforts were actually curious if I had done the capture from edit screen camera, saved then uploaded, I'm sure there more ways and probably easier, just wanted to see if I could do it from the camera tab. Yes definitely have cab modeling off. They are viewable on the preset but bypassed, at least I want to think, my global settings are set to pA modeling on cab modeling off. My output tickles the red as I had seen was ok for settings, yet the preset is definitely loud compared to others, I believe I bumped it up a bit , my input meter is not clipping. Not trying to act like I'm ready to even be posting something I'd want someone to consider using. I had just tried adjusting some perimeters in this with a few settings in the eq, amp block( speaker) delay block and got it close to sounding decent, but I felt I had a boxy type sound I could not dial out. Are the output meters not supposed to tickle the red if using output 1? I have amp block set to SS pA+cab in the amp block. Thanks for your input and suggested help. I dont hear it sounding spiky, or unpleasant highs as you mentioned. Using paf style hbucker and prs. Got some suggestions yesterday about trying peq , plan to check that out. Cheers and many thanks!!
 
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Thank you for downloading the file, I believe your the 1st, everyone else just chimed in, and that's not a complaint, I need the advice and appreciate everyone for the efforts made. I'm new at this so my efforts were actually curious if I had done the capture from edit screen camera, saved then uploaded, I'm sure there more ways and probably easier, just wanted to see if I could do it from the camera tab. Yes definitely have cab modeling off. They are viewable on the preset but bypassed, at least I want to think, my global settings are set to pA modeling on cab modeling off. My output tickles the red as I had seen was ok for settings, yet the preset is definitely loud compared to others, I believe I bumped it up a bit , my input meter is not clipping. Not trying to act like I'm ready to even be posting something I'd want someone to consider using. I had just tried adjusting some perimeters in this with a few settings in the eq, amp block( speaker) delay block and got it close to sounding decent, but I felt I had a boxy type sound I could not dial out. Are the output meters not supposed to tickle the red if using output 1? I have amp block set to SS pA+cab in the amp block. Thanks for your input and suggested help. I dont hear it sounding spiky, or unpleasant highs as you mentioned. Using paf style hbucker and prs. Got some suggestions yesterday about trying peq , plan to check that out. Cheers and many thanks!!
You don't want to see any red on the Axefx front panel output lights. For the physical Axefx front panel, the tickling the red recommendation applies only to the input level lights, not for output. For output level, go to AxeEdit > Tools and open the "Preset Leveling" window. Adjust your patch output so that you just start seeing red on that levelling window's meters which will put you about 12db shy of nasty digital clipping - a good place to be. I know - all the different red tickling can be confusing.

I've read about the Matrix sounding best with dials at 2pm many times but honestly, playing around with it I've never noticed a sweet spot. + the 2pm tip kind of does not make sense to me since the Matrix input can vary a lot without impacting tone - it's all headroom - afaik, the volume knobs are attenuating.
 
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You don't want to see any red on the Axefx front panel output lights. For the physical Axefx front panel, the tickling the red recommendation applies only to the input level lights, not for output. For output level, go to AxeEdit > Tools and open the "Preset Leveling" window. Adjust your patch output so that you just start seeing red on that levelling window's meters which will put you about 12db shy of nasty digital clipping - a good place to be. I know - all the different red tickling can be confusing.

I've read about the Matrix sounding best with dials at 2pm many times but honestly, playing around with it I've never noticed a sweet spot. + the 2pm tip kind of does not make sense to me since the Matrix input can vary a lot without impacting tone - it's all headroom - afaik, the volume knobs are attenuating.
My mistake, I meant the input level, one on the far left is tickeling the red. The output meter is green not even halfway up, I will check the settings you mentioned in axe edit about preset leveling, setup. I do have my matrix at about 2 o'clock, agree, not sure if I hear much difference when it's set lower, did think maybe I heard something more likeable at 2 o'clock, I've seen where users set matrix to max volume then adjust axe for desired level.
 
I wanted to take another look your preset. I downloaded it and went through it the other day, but went through my monitors. There are so many variables that it didn't make sense to try it through my rig. However, today I did. I took your preset and went through my Matrix GT1000 and into two Mesa Thiele 1x12 cabs loaded with EVM12Ls. The guitar I used was a R7 with Classic 57s. So, some similarities, a lot more differences. I bypassed the cab blocks and had a listen, knowing it will sound very different than what you are hearing. I did hear that boxy sound. What I did to get rid of it was bypass the GEQ block as well as flatten the Output EQ in the Dizzy amp. And of course I had to bypass the Wah and the Formant. The boxy sound went away, but it left the sound a little flat. I also changed the SIC to the 2x12 Recto setting. The preset is pretty dark now, but it doesn't have the boxy sound and it's not as harsh going through my setup. So, it seems like the boxy sound may be coming from the extra EQ. It could also be the Bogner 2x12; I'm not sure about that though, seeing as I've never played through one. Anyhow, hope this helps.
 
I wanted to take another look your preset. I downloaded it and went through it the other day, but went through my monitors. There are so many variables that it didn't make sense to try it through my rig. However, today I did. I took your preset and went through my Matrix GT1000 and into two Mesa Thiele 1x12 cabs loaded with EVM12Ls. The guitar I used was a R7 with Classic 57s. So, some similarities, a lot more differences. I bypassed the cab blocks and had a listen, knowing it will sound very different than what you are hearing. I did hear that boxy sound. What I did to get rid of it was bypass the GEQ block as well as flatten the Output EQ in the Dizzy amp. And of course I had to bypass the Wah and the Formant. The boxy sound went away, but it left the sound a little flat. I also changed the SIC to the 2x12 Recto setting. The preset is pretty dark now, but it doesn't have the boxy sound and it's not as harsh going through my setup. So, it seems like the boxy sound may be coming from the extra EQ. It could also be the Bogner 2x12; I'm not sure about that though, seeing as I've never played through one. Anyhow, hope this helps.
Definitely helps, thanks for the tips, the cabs are on the preset, if I have cab modeling off are they being bypassed? I know this is probably silly, I should just shunt them to be 100% sure. I would imagine the preset being a bit dark is probably a reality, those are to bottom heavy amps, at least I thought so. What about the para eq that's been mentioned in output block, have not added that yet , planning to try as it was suggested. I used the geq to try and dial out the boxy type sound, so maybe that wasn't a good idea, seemed to allow me to get the mids and lows closer to AITR sound, my bogner cab has always been a great match for anything I've thrown at it, possibly not a match for ax3 , seems highly unlikely tho..be100, bogner helios, diezel Hagan, elmwood m90, marshall jvm , modded jmp all sounded great thru it, Thanks for the efforts and suggestions, going to give them a try. Cheers and Thank You!!
 
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