Solid State Amp + Cab... no low end like a real amp

p_lawl

New Member
Owned my FM9 for a couple years, gigged it about 15 times with an EV PXM12 wedge. Pretty happy, but decided to try the SS amp + cab setup after scoring a deal on a used Seymour Duncan Powerstage 170 and seeing all the pro rig rundowns with a power amp + cab.

For the life of me, I can't get the tone where I want it... lacks a lot of the low end thump and doesn't move the air like a tube amp. Doesn't sound like a closed back 1x12 speaker cab.

I'm using my Revv 90 watt 1x12 closed back and Out 1 to FOH and Out 3 splits off before the cab block to the power amp + cab. I have Out 3 turned all the way up and the Powerstage up about 12 to 2 o'clock. It's definitely gig volume, but it's not even coming close to a real amp.

I tried the same setup with an HX Stomp and the Stomp even sounds way better than the FM9. I used a York IR on the Stomp. Only had the Powerstage at about 10 o'clock and it was just as loud as the FM9 and Powerstage at 12 or 1 o'clock. But Stomp was more dynamic, more lows and it was just a stock amp with no tweaking.

Is this common? Does the Powerstage 170 just not jive with Fractal products? Maybe something like a Matrix is better? Do I need a third party IR? Bigger cab? Do I need to add EQ blocks to try to get it to sound right?

I'm totally stumped and have put in hours over the past few weeks trying to figure this out. Any advice, expertise, rude remarks, for the good of the order... I'll take em! I've read the manual cover to cover and have been doing the Cooper Carter FM9 masterclass.

I'm using the stock Brit 800 preset, just with an Out 3 splitting off.
 

Attachments

  • Screen Shot 2024-05-19 at 8.06.08 PM.png
    Screen Shot 2024-05-19 at 8.06.08 PM.png
    734.2 KB · Views: 31
As a test, what happens if you disconnect FOH from Output 1 XLRs, and connect the PS170 to Output 1's 1/4" (Humbuster) connectors?
 
As a test, what happens if you disconnect FOH from Output 1 XLRs, and connect the PS170 to Output 1's 1/4" (Humbuster) connectors?
Kids are going to bed so I'll have to try it tomorrow. But I can use a regular 1/4" instrument cable from Output 1 into the Powerstage, right? In other words, I don't have to buy a Humbuster to test it do I? Always just used the XLRs from Output 1 and never tried the 1/4" outs
 
Right now you are running the cab IR into the real cab (screenshot). This wont necessarily sound bad but definitely affects the sound you hear.

faster test:
In-amp-out

Find the closest speaker impedance curve to your real cab

Also not sure if you’ve ever tried a real jcm800 into a 112 cab but it wont sound massive, the 112 is the limiting factor.

Iirc there is a “real cab” factory preset you can try as well.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JTI
you've got poweramp sims turned on in the fractal? this is a very common problem. volume usually fixes it, but it might be worth a search on the forum.
 
Right now you are running the cab IR into the real cab (screenshot). This wont necessarily sound bad but definitely affects the sound you hear.

faster test:
In-amp-out

Find the closest speaker impedance curve to your real cab

Also not sure if you’ve ever tried a real jcm800 into a 112 cab but it wont sound massive, the 112 is the limiting factor.

Iirc there is a “real cab” factory preset you can try as well.
Yep. Cab block is getting routed through traditional speakers and is going to probably sound wonky.
 
Yep. Cab block is getting routed through traditional speakers and is going to probably sound wonky.
I briefly had an hx stomp+powerstage 200+1960A to audition for a friends band. First couple jams I left the cab block on as i didnt really know my way around the device at all. I was happy with what i had dialled in. I knew it would need refining as the other guitarist does FOH, mixing and engineering (read: picky) but I wouldnt have described the sound as poor.

It shouldnt sound wonky per se, but it will be different.

I think some people actually leave cabs on because the filtering it applies before the real speakers works for them.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JTI
I briefly had an hx stomp+powerstage 200+1960A to audition for a friends band. First couple jams I left the cab block on as i didnt really know my way around the device at all. I was happy with what i had dialled in. I knew it would need refining as the other guitarist does FOH, mixing and engineering (read: picky) but I wouldnt have described the sound as poor.

It shouldnt sound wonky per se, but it will be different.

I think some people actually leave cabs on because the filtering it applies before the real speakers works for them.
With the Stomp; I was nowhere near as particular. Mainly because the amps I like were good enoughish vs awesome in FASland. Helix sounds are an avalanche of sizzling highs so IR into a traditional guitar speaker probably did sound good :p
 
I'm using a Fryette PSA with real cabs (recto 2x12 or Mesa Thiele 1x12 with EVM12L).
I don't have experience with the powerstage.

I did struggle a bit to get the low end right.
It was not about the amount of bass frequencies. I got to a point where it had more than enough bass on with out the low end thump.

I believe getting the speaker impedance curve right is what you're missing.
After I had set it right I have less bass and a realistic low end thump.

Get the closest SIC that matches your cab. Use Leon's sine wave rattle trick to get the low resonant frequency right and it should really help.
 
I'm using a Fryette PSA with real cabs (recto 2x12 or Mesa Thiele 1x12 with EVM12L).
I don't have experience with the powerstage.

I did struggle a bit to get the low end right.
It was not about the amount of bass frequencies. I got to a point where it had more than enough bass on with out the low end thump.

I believe getting the speaker impedance curve right is what you're missing.
After I had set it right I have less bass and a realistic low end thump.

Get the closest SIC that matches your cab. Use Leon's sine wave rattle trick to get the low resonant frequency right and it should really help.
Yup, 100% this OP. Play around with the speaker impedance curve- that made a big difference for me dialing in my matrix power amp using a couple of Carol Ann 1x12s.
 
Right now you are running the cab IR into the real cab (screenshot). This wont necessarily sound bad but definitely affects the sound you hear.

faster test:
In-amp-out

Find the closest speaker impedance curve to your real cab

Also not sure if you’ve ever tried a real jcm800 into a 112 cab but it wont sound massive, the 112 is the limiting factor.

Iirc there is a “real cab” factory preset you can try as well.
My bad on the screenshot... I grabbed a quick screenshot of the Brit 800 setup from my FM9 and peeled off Out 3 just for the sake of an example. When I was originally testing it all out with the 1x12, I had the Cab block going just to Out 1.

I'll give the real cab factory preset a shot.
 
My bad on the screenshot... I grabbed a quick screenshot of the Brit 800 setup from my FM9 and peeled off Out 3 just for the sake of an example. When I was originally testing it all out with the 1x12, I had the Cab block going just to Out 1.

I'll give the real cab factory preset a shot.
Pretty sure both Leon and Burgs have youtube vids on setup, and they may include test presets too.
 
I put a bump around 120Hz (Q=1) on Output 2 which feeds my LXII and cab, and adjust depending on the venue. I also cut around 5.8KHz to not take the heads off of people in the front row. YMMV.
 
Back
Top Bottom