So, the Dumble thing...

Leon! Awesome dude. Aja is one of my favorite albums of all time.

Interesting thing, I have a friend that used to teach at MI when it used to be GIT, and he told me he went to Dumble's shop many times. He said Dumble would tune all his amps by ear so all his amps were very inconsistent with one another. He told me he played many of them, some of them being the same model, and they sounded incredibly different. There's also a story that Robben Ford had two dumbles of the same model, and wanted Howard to tweak one of them to sound like the other one, and he couldn't no matter how long he tried. Basically, the dumble sound was just how he heard things on the day he tweaked it.

That being said, this is probably my favorite video of a dumble....

 
Mr. Carlton played a dumble live, but he had a fender tweed amp that he used on steely dan records. Now wouldn’t that be a great amp for Mr. Chase to get a hold of and model?
Well... We have a number of Tweed Fender models. Any idea which amp?
 
I seriously think you know what you do, and you know what you talk about and your posts help alot of folks on the forum....but i don't think this is a good representation of the dumble tone. Don't get me wrong,
since you can play anything can sound good under your fingers...but this is maybe 60% of the dumble.

Many amps get anemic when you roll down the volume.(hense gurus like Tim Pierce suggest using a volume pedal instead of volume pot on guitar). In my experience Trainwrecks are an
exception, they almost react the same way when you roll the guitar volume down or turn down the gain/input. I think thats what makes them shine.

I am not sure if this is the strength of dumble...or the strength of the clean channel.

note: i listen your posts in a professional studio environment through really good speakers, not on a mobile phone or computer speaker.

note 2: i almost feel bad about writing this cause the work you do, your honesty, musicianship deserves appreciation/praise/respect (what ever the right way is in English:)
I hear what you’re saying, however while this might not be what most would associate with the classic Dumble tone persay it is an area where these style amps I believe do shine. Especially the way their harmonic content shines in that edge of breakup within double stops, triads & chords vs single notes. Whereas single notes sound clean but add in a second or third note and things start to pick up this wonderful bit of breakup. Not that other amps can’t or don’t do this but the Dumble & Dumble style amps have a different kind of mojo & voice to them. A certain kind of thick, rich, bacon & cheesey goodness.
There is a world of great dynamics & tone in those Clean channels when ya drive em.
 
I hear what you’re saying, however while this might not be what most would associate with the classic Dumble tone persay it is an area where these style amps I believe do shine. Especially the way their harmonic content shines in that edge of breakup within double stops, triads & chords vs single notes. Whereas single notes sound clean but add in a second or third note and things start to pick up this wonderful bit of breakup. Not that other amps can’t or don’t do this but the Dumble & Dumble style amps have a different kind of mojo & voice to them. A certain kind of thick, rich, bacon & cheesey goodness.
There is a world of great dynamics & tone in those Clean channels when ya drive em.

I totaly agree with what you say, but don't players like Robben Ford push the clean channel with boost or drive pedals to get the edge of break up or lead tones? I don't think they turn the master full on for it.
 
I totaly agree with what you say, but don't players like Robben Ford push the clean channel with boost or drive pedals to get the edge of break up or lead tones? I don't think they turn the master full on for it.
Well probably, but they also don’t have the “luxury” of having an AxeFX III. In the real world, a 100w Dumble with the MV on 10 would be quite painful.
But also, just cause someone else isn’t doing it, doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be done. If it gets ya where ya wanna be..
Edit: the one thing I do find a lot of times with cranking MV amps Master Volumes is that they start to get mid heavy & on some amps the tone controls become less effective. But I want to say that’s more so on amps or amp channels that have more gain, but don’t quote me on it. There definitely seems to be some kind of interaction between the two. Maybe the more power amp distortion ya get the less ya hear the tone controls or something like that. Or maybe it’s just that it’s cause the mids become more pronounced with higher MV it masks the tone controls? Hopefully someone who knows the inner workings can chime in & set the record for us.
 
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The ODS Clean model is such a great model in the collection. Enormous dynamic range, very strong and powerful, very present. Cuts through everything.

I'd settle on this model for clean tones ... if only it would do edge-of-breakup as well as the really clean stuff. I just don't think that edge-of-breakup is this amp/model's strong point. But it's a great pedal platform.
 
Many amps get anemic when you roll down the volume.(hense gurus like Tim Pierce suggest using a volume pedal instead of volume pot on guitar).

Unless you're using it after some buffered device (a buffered effects device, for example), a volume pedal is just a volume pot external to the guitar. The same loading, series resistance, et al would apply to one as would apply to the control in the guitar.
 
Unless you're using it after some buffered device (a buffered effects device, for example), a volume pedal is just a volume pot external to the guitar. The same loading, series resistance, et al would apply to one as would apply to the control in the guitar.
There's a video that was shared here a while back where Tim explains it. I seem to remember he felt like rolling of the guitar volume loses the transient but using a pedal does not. The video seemed to confirm this...
 
There's a video that was shared here a while back where Tim explains it. I seem to remember he felt like rolling of the guitar volume loses the transient but using a pedal does not. The video seemed to confirm this...

If it's post-buffer of some sort, then I'd agree - that's one thing active electronics (EMG, et al) gets you, treble retention and fidelity as you roll down volume. But in a totally passive setup, it's simply another volume pot in series with the guitar.
 
Well... We have a number of Tweed Fender models. Any idea which amp?

Fender 'wide panel tweed' Deluxe Amp 5C3

Here are the Fractal tweed models I am aware of:
11 59 BASSGUY (based on '59 Fender Tweed Bassman, 5F6-A)
12 5F1 TWEED (based on Fender Tweed Champ, 5F1)
13 5F1 TWEED EC (based on Fender EC Vibro-Champ)
14 5F8 TWEED (based on '59 high powered Fender Tweed Twin, 5F8)
92 DELUXE TWEED (based on Fender Tweed Deluxe, 5E3)
190 PRINCE TONE 5F2 (Fender Tweed Princeton, 5F2)
225 SUPERTWEED (custom model)

*edited, original post inaccurate...sorry
Trivia time: The opening riff a two guitar part...by Walter Becker(RIP!)...according to Wikipedia
 
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If it's post-buffer of some sort, then I'd agree - that's one thing active electronics (EMG, et al) gets you, treble retention and fidelity as you roll down volume. But in a totally passive setup, it's simply another volume pot in series with the guitar.

the way i do this is with a volume block before the amp. the results are way different/better than using the volume pot on guitar. as i mentioned before, trainwrecks keep the tone way better when you roll the volume on guitar compared to other amps i tried.
 
The ODS Clean model is such a great model in the collection. Enormous dynamic range, very strong and powerful, very present. Cuts through everything.

I'd settle on this model for clean tones ... if only it would do edge-of-breakup as well as the really clean stuff. I just don't think that edge-of-breakup is this amp/model's strong point. But it's a great pedal platform.

that's also kind of what i am trying to say. I think it can do the edge of break up with the right drive block (ie: timothy) but not on its own. when you push the master volume that high it kinda of starts loosing the attack, presence, sparkle as the power amp starts compressing the tone in a different way.
 
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Well probably, but they also don’t have the “luxury” of having an AxeFX III. In the real world, a 100w Dumble with the MV on 10 would be quite painful.
But also, just cause someone else isn’t doing it, doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be done. If it gets ya where ya wanna be..
Edit: the one thing I do find a lot of times with cranking MV amps Master Volumes is that they start to get mid heavy & on some amps the tone controls become less effective. But I want to say that’s more so on amps or amp channels that have more gain, but don’t quote me on it. There definitely seems to be some kind of interaction between the two. Maybe the more power amp distortion ya get the less ya hear the tone controls or something like that. Or maybe it’s just that it’s cause the mids become more pronounced with higher MV it masks the tone controls? Hopefully someone who knows the inner workings can chime in & set the record for us.

:) i get you, but my conclusion-critic about this post was only about tone, i mentioned i am listening with good speakers and in acousicaly treated room. ofcourse it doesnt matter where the knobs are, what you do as long as you get the tone. but i am pretty confident Robben wouldn't turn the master to 10 in studio either even if he could...ofcourse i might be wrong.
 
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