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So far I'm not entirely sold on the Axe Fx 3....

pauliusmm

Fractal Fanatic
I dont understand why wanting a specific amp model is ok, but wanting a specific effect is not.
Of course different people like different effects. Same with amps, but there are 200+ amps.
There could be one amp model and one cab model and a ton of advanced parameters, so you could tweak it how you want, but i doubt people would like that. People want a specific amp model so they dont have to tweak the hell out of it and get good results right away.
Not everyone has a degree in tweaking advanced stuff.
This is just my oppinnion on where i would prefer to see improvements.
Its not to say that i dont like the effects. I am really happy with Fractal gear and these are just cherries on top.
 

hippietim

Fractal Fanatic
I get it, people want to be musicians and not engineers, but omitting controls just because people don’t understand them seems to appeal to the lowest common denominator.

Then it's a good thing that nobody has proposed omitting controls. The CE-2 on the Axe sure as hell is not limited to two knobs. A simple view with just two knobs would be welcome though.

I think in the time people spending wish for XYZ pedal they could experiment with the setting and actually match that pedal.

But again, I get it that some folks want it handed to them. They paid a lot of money and want to press a button and get a tone. For me though, the process is part of the fun.

That's you. For a lot of people, the fun is simply playing. Other than "modeling isn't there for me" and probably "amp in the room" - the number one complaint with modelers has got to be too much tweaking or too hard to figure out how to use it. So what you crave is actually a barrier to entry for many.
 

skracus

Inspired
Then it's a good thing that nobody has proposed omitting controls. The CE-2 on the Axe sure as hell is not limited to two knobs. A simple view with just two knobs would be welcome though.



That's you. For a lot of people, the fun is simply playing. Other than "modeling isn't there for me" and probably "amp in the room" - the number one complaint with modelers has got to be too much tweaking or too hard to figure out how to use it. So what you crave is actually a barrier to entry for many.

I agree but I see both sides and live somewhere in between with a lean towards "I just wanna play" Tweaking can be a deep rabbit hole... If I were marketing the Axe-Fx to someone I'd first slam out a huge power chord that get's big attention for the hook with all the tone and then use all the tweak-abilty in the box as icing once the sale was already made. Every now and then I nerd out with my Axe-Fx and just explore all the advanced stuff but usually once I have tones set up I just play.

lqdsnddist I wouldn't worry about it too much. It's only FW 1.05 and who knows what future updates will bring. Especially with all the pedals coming out these days and the horse power of the III. There's a plethora for Fractal to emulate.
 
That's you. For a lot of people, the fun is simply playing. Other than "modeling isn't there for me" and probably "amp in the room" - the number one complaint with modelers has got to be too much tweaking or too hard to figure out how to use it. So what you crave is actually a barrier to entry for many.

Axe3 makes a good compromise with the "Basic" and "Expert" or "Advanced" pages available for most of the blocks.

But block presets would be really great to allow people to get closer to "that tone" without compromising tweak-ability. Why isn't there a Klon model? Because you can get there with the FET drive, configured correctly, right? So why can't I download a Klon block preset for that FET drive and start tweaking from there, instead being forced to either apply an entire Patch or Scene, or having to manually set the block config?

Unless I'm missing something... :p
 

Sharka

Experienced
Going through the manuel and I picked up on this ... "THE SCENE MIDI BLOCK" Wow! Opens the door to a lot of cool external possibilities. I've always wanted this feature... I guess apparently others did too!

I keep finding out about more useful features. Even more sold! =:·D
 

Rex

Legend!
...block presets would be really great to allow people to get closer to "that tone" without compromising tweak-ability. Why isn't there a Klon model? Because you can get there with the FET drive, configured correctly, right? So why can't I download a Klon block preset for that FET drive and start tweaking from there, instead being forced to either apply an entire Patch or Scene, or having to manually set the block config?
You can do that now. All it takes is for someone to upload their settings to the forum's Preset Exchange.


Unless I'm missing something... :p
That "something" you're missing is Axe-Edit. In Axe-Edit, you can save all your favorite FX settings to the Block Library, and call them up at will.

This capability has existed for years. In truth, I'm surprised that there isn't already an active community of people swapping blocks from their Block Libraries.
 

unix-guy

Legend!
You can do that now. All it takes is for someone to upload their settings to the forum's Preset Exchange.



That "something" you're missing is Axe-Edit. In Axe-Edit, you can save all your favorite FX settings to the Block Library, and call them up at will.

This capability has existed for years. In truth, I'm surprised that there isn't already an active community of people swapping blocks from their Block Libraries.
At one point there was talk of a block exchange similar to the current preset exchange... I think that would be very useful.
 
At one point there was talk of a block exchange similar to the current preset exchange... I think that would be very useful.
Or a parallel forum to the Preset Exchange for Block Exchange - then we could have conversations around the block presets easier.
But right now the 3's Preset Exchange forum is pretty bare, and Axe-Change isn't doing the 3 yet.
 

Rex

Legend!
At one point there was talk of a block exchange similar to the current preset exchange... I think that would be very useful.
It would indeed. But there's nothing preventing us from doing that now on the forum. @simeon has shared a number of very cool FX settings right here. I could see a very cool, crowd-sourced attempt to get as klose to the Klon (or any other pedal) as possible.
 

skracus

Inspired
Going through the manuel and I picked up on this ... "THE SCENE MIDI BLOCK" Wow! Opens the door to a lot of cool external possibilities. I've always wanted this feature... I guess apparently others did too!

I keep finding out about more useful features. Even more sold! =:·D

Once you surrender to using scenes with a controller it's hard to give up. Axe-Fx mode with a Mastermind GT22 made life so easy with the Axe-Fx but scene buttons were global so you could add another midi command to each button to switch amp channels on a Boogie JPIIC+ for example but then you were locked in to dedicating scenes for certain channels. For example S1, S2 Amp Channel 1, S3, S4 Amp Channel 2...etc. Sure there were ways to get around it but the Scene Midi block eliminates all of that and makes that type of setup extremely flexible.
 

barhrecords

Axe-Master
I dont understand why wanting a specific amp model is ok, but wanting a specific effect is not.
Of course different people like different effects. Same with amps, but there are 200+ amps.
There could be one amp model and one cab model and a ton of advanced parameters, so you could tweak it how you want, but i doubt people would like that. People want a specific amp model so they dont have to tweak the hell out of it and get good results right away.
Not everyone has a degree in tweaking advanced stuff.
This is just my oppinnion on where i would prefer to see improvements.
Its not to say that i dont like the effects. I am really happy with Fractal gear and these are just cherries on top.

To me it's the difference between every one reverse engineering and A/B and dialing in their favorite pedals vs. FAS expertly doing that and providing preset "starting points" of the classic pedals as they have already done with the drives, wahs, etc.

Just more of that... please :)
 

steadystate

Fractal Fanatic
I understand the wish for turn-key effects and models, but personally I prefer the architecture as it is.

I like to have both. The Fractal effects are great, but if you want spot-on models of specific units, Universal Audio (and similar companies) are the only alternative to the real deal. A generic algorithm (no matter how good) with parameter presets to get it in the ballpark of specific units isn't the same. As true as it is for amps, so is it for effects units.

I also like to have spectacularly adjustable effects as well. Given one choice or the other, I'd go with the Fractal approach. But firing up a UAD model of a vintage effect sure puts a smile on my face.
 

Ant Music

Power User
Realize that no one pedal is the only gold standard. For every neo vent owner there is someone else who bought a lex, or some who who liked the chorusey sound of the rt20, or the noise of that tube driven one etc

To say something to the extent of “why doesn’t this axe have ______ blank, it’s the “best” effect is kind of silly.

I mean heck, I bought the neo vent and returned it, didn’t really like the sound, especially for the price. I actually like vibratone sounds more than a “proper” Leslie anyways

So while I get why one might want a specific model, realize that someone else could care less about it

Well.... I think it is well enough to point out where something can be improved. Referencing a particular piece of gear that does it well is not a bad place to start. There were many wishes to bring the Rotary closer to something like the lex and the ventilator and it was definitely improved. Some seem to think it could get even better but if you disagree then that's fine too.
 
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Ant Music

Power User
I think the point should be does it sound good, not is it an exact match for a given pedal. Authenticity doesn’t always equate to the best tone, but some people think it must.

Does anyone put a hardware pedal on their board just to say they have the pedal, or do they put the pedal on there to get a certain tone?

Taking away controls seems a steep backwards to me personally. I guess I can see why someone would want to turn a dial til it says ce2 and have just two knobs to adjust, but personally like more control.

I used to hate how limited pedals where back in the day, wishing hey had more control, nodding pedals for added control etc. the axe is a step in the right direction adding more control options, which I think is progress

Some folks seem to want to exist in a state of blissful ignorance, no offense implied, wanting less control because they can’t be bothered to learn what the controls do. I get it, people want to be musicians and not engineers, but omitting controls just because people don’t understand them seems to appeal to the lowest common denominator.

Oh god damn please...... No one is trying to take away controls!!!!!!!

The suggestion has only ever been to ADD an extra tab where only the native controls are present whilst still being able to access the generic parameters on the other tabs. It really is that simple.

If you don't want it, then you don't have to use it.

If you have a beloved piece of gear and you know how to get what you want out of it with 3 dials but instead on the AxeFX you have 20, it is easy to fall down the rabbit hole of tweaking and getting lost in options that simply don't exist on the original gear. Some people don't want to be tweaking out for ever. They want quick simple results. What is wrong with that?

I'd rather be dialing in the actual native parameters on an Amp model to get the sound it is known for rather than a bunch of extraneous parameters. Personally that's how I'd prefer to use it. But if anyone wants to try it out with different tubes, voltage plate induction and bla bla bla then they can go deep.

By INCLUDING this feature, people would be able to get faster results, if that appeals to them. If you prefer menu diving then go for it. This particular suggestion will not stop you from doing anything you currently like to do.
 
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Ant Music

Power User
To me it's the difference between every one reverse engineering and A/B and dialing in their favorite pedals vs. FAS expertly doing that and providing preset "starting points" of the classic pedals as they have already done with the drives, wahs, etc.

Just more of that... please :)
Exactly!!! Other companies have released apps that do this very well and they look like a breeze to use.
 

barhrecords

Axe-Master
Exactly!!! Other companies have released apps that do this very well and they look like a breeze to use.

From the DAW plugin universe, you can see lots of examples of this. Real world controls and deep dive advanced menus.

In my day job we study computer interface human interaction. Deep dive menus tend to keep the user in "left-brain" mode. Simple intuitive graphic interfaces tend to keep the user in "right-brain" mode.

This can be important if the software you are using is for a creative / artistic purpose vs. engineering.

When humans switch between right and left brain function the creative flow is interrupted.
 

Ant Music

Power User
I don’t know about that my friend. Many of you have heard of Fat Sound Guitars which was a great boutique guitar shop - killer amps, guitars, and pedals. It ended badly. But probably 9-12 months before the demise, I went there with the intent of buying one of the high dollar Leslie pedals - $350-450 iirc. This was before I had a Leslie myself. It so happens that the owner had his Fender Vibratone (Leslie rebranded for Fender and the model SRV used) in the shop and it had just been serviced and was running smooth and sounding great. So Stu set me up in the middle of the store with his Vibratone and another cab with the same amp and we proceeded to A/B boutique pedals - he had three or four of the boutique models and I know the Ventilator and Rotosim were two of them.

So naturally they all sounded really good. They should for that much money of course. But none held up great next to the Vibratone. Stu was even surprised. Then he looked over at the other side of the store where he had his Boss display and asked me if I wanted to try the Boss. I was skeptical. I was ready to pay a bunch more money, how could the Boss hold up? Heh. Well the Boss more than held up. It was appreciably better sounding than any of the boutique pedals and was much more natural sounding next to the Vibratone. The only thing the Boss didn’t sound as good on compared to a couple of the boutique models was with a lot of gain but the Vibratone didn’t sound good with high gain either (and neither does my Leslie).

I have not revisited Leslie pedals since that day and I know there are a lot more variations of Leslie’s than just the Vibratone and since that time I know more pedals have come out and there’s a Ventilator 2, etc. so take my experience for what it was at a point in time some years ago.

I have not done any A/B testing with the rotary in the 3 yet (so many things to test). But I know that the rotary in the 3 sounds damn good.

Ok, well I think we're getting bogged down in talking about specific effects here which is not what this thread was really about but for what it's worth, I feel that the Axe doesn't seem to quite have the depth that this ventilator in the hands of Greg Koch. If I could get the Axe Fx to sound THIS good then I'd be very happy. Buuuuuut as I said before, I think the Axe Fx Rotary is very good and I'm not complaining about it. But I don't think it sounds this good.

 

Ant Music

Power User
Dive Bomb can be configured.

Really?.... I am rather dubious about this but please do explain.

Ages ago I tried placing 2 pitch blocks in series and dropping them both by- 2oct with the expression pedal and it sounded like shit as you would expect. In the Digitech Whammy pedal the Divebomb feature is listed a going down -6oct. It goes so low that it sounds as if the bar were depressed to the point that the strings go slack. I will be very surprised if you can pull this off.

But in any case it should be just a feature of the AxeFX pitch block as it is in the real Whammy pedals.
 

yek

Legend!
Ah okay, didn't know that it was about the number of octaves. 6 octaves will indeed pose a challenge, if not impossible.
Can't imagine when I would want to use that, but that's not the point.
 

steadystate

Fractal Fanatic
Ah okay, didn't know that it was about the number of octaves. 6 octaves will indeed be challenge, if not impossible.
Can't imagine when I would want to use that, but that's not the point.
My old Eventide had at least four octaves both ways; never used it past two.
 
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