Show Buddy Automated MIDI Control of Axe-Fx III Question

Hi, Gang,

Okay, let me see if I can explain this clearly, because I know one of you has a two- or three-line answer that will unlock these binary secrets…

I’m fooling around with Show Buddy to use MIDI commands to make automated changes to my presets, and then scenes through each preset. I’m sure those of you that know, know what I mean. (MIDI Events in most DAWS do this, of course.)

My goal is to make a set list, hit play, and have the MIDI commands transmit at certain time points.

As the new song starts, that song’s preset automatically gets called up. As the song plays, my scenes change at the predetermined time points I define.

They call each command a (MIDI) “Chunk.”

I made a “chunk” all by myself (!) and I can get Show Buddy to call up the right preset. That’s a nice little win right off the bat.

That chunk is defined as: Patch Change at 00:00 (time point), Axe-III (output), MIDI Channel 1, Program Change (message), and Prog 48 (Data 1 value). Data 2 value is not an available option. IOW, these are the options and values input to columns to get SB to make that change.

So, this chunk correctly gets me to my preset, which, of course, starts on Scene 1. Hooray!

I make my next chunk, which will be placed at a proper time point to change to Scene 2. My input options are:

Note ON
Note OFF
CC Control
Preset Change
Pitch Wheel

I’m ASSuming I use the CC Control option, since I am already in the correct preset. With that, I can select a CC Control Number from 0 to 127. Within this 0-127 menu, some values are already defined, and some are blank. (Ex; Bank Change (course), Data Entry Slider, Foot Controller (course) and so on.)

I don’t see a Scene Change, Scene Increment, etc.

I took a look at page 185 in the Axe-III manual, looking at the CC Value to Scene table. Then I scratched my head and had a think. Nothing.

First question; The first value on that list in the Axe manual are the numbers 0-127. The second value are sequential repeats of 1-8 for scenes. What is the logic here, please? I’m not equating how the two sets of numbers relate to each other. Am I to understand CCs 0-7 are assigned to Preset 1, Scenes 1-8?

Second question; The CC Control menu has those 128 spots for actions. Is Show Buddy reading that menu from the Axe? Do I have to go somewhere within the Axe and assign the operations I want to use? If so, how? (Yes, I rooted around like a hungry rat.) Do I have to learn PC Mapping? (It sounds horrible...)

It’s obvious I’m not the smartest tool in the box, and I’m new to MIDI. I also understand this mournful cry for assistance is going to take a minute out of someone’s life. I really appreciate any help on the subject. My eternal thanks in advance.

Scotty
 
CCs are Control changes.

There are 128 (0-127)... Standard midi.

When you send a CC, that consists of the CC number and a CC data value.

On the Axe Fx you will need to define which CC number to use for scenes. This is in one of the Midi/Remote menus.

Since the Axe Fx II defaulted to CC #34 for scenes, many people use that for Scenes.

Using that as an example, to change to scene 1 you will send CC#34 with data value 0. If you wanted to change to scene 2, send CC#34 with data value 1.
 
I went through more or less the same process to get Logic to send MIDI to the AxeFX3. The one difference is the value I sent. Logic appeared to be treating the 0 --> 1 value change as a slope rather than an abrupt jump, so I used multiples of 17 as the values. The larger jumps seemed to work better in Logic's MIDI CC thingie. I forget which CC # I used, but I think it was around 110. Not having worked with the II, I wasn't habituated to use 34. I remember using 84 with my old Quadraverb2 ages ago, but have been away from MIDI since I got the ToneLab SE in the early 2000s, so even that is a distant memory....
 
First answer: you tell the Axe what CC# to use to select scenes. You do this on the Axe itself. A MIDI CC message contains the CC# and a value. The value determines what scene will be selected, as determined by that list of “sequential repeats.”

Second answer: SB doesn’t read anything from the Axe. It only gives commands to the Axe. You have to know how you set up MIDI in the Axe in order to tell SB to give the right command to the Axe. And no, you don’t have to learn MIDI mapping.


Where do you go to set up MIDI in the Axe? Strangely enough, you go to... Setup > MIDI. :)
 
Echoing what my esteemed colleagues mentioned - Many digital devices have their CC assignments made by the manufacturer. The Axe III allows each user to define their CCs. This is because there are more midi controllable parameters than there are CC's. So, you have to pick which 127 items you want to have control over, and assign the CC's inside the Axe Midi setup menu.

If you want to make it a bit easier, you could look at the factory assignments that are hard programmed into the Axe II, and emulate that as a starting point.
 
Well, thanks to the great input here, I figured it out in about 5 minutes.

Thank you so much! I appreciate your help!

So, here is what I did...

1. In Show Buddy, the right-click menu for CC values has a lot of unassigned values. I saw 14, 15, and 16 were empty, so I decided to use those. You can use any of the unassigned numbers.

2. In the Axe-III menu (you can't do it through Axe Edit)

3. MIDI/Remote page / scroll to Scene Select - I changed the value to 16.

4. Scroll down to Scene Increment - I changed the value to 14.

5. Scroll down one more to Scene Decrement - I changed the value to 15.

These three commands give you all the Scene control you're going to need. You're set up to have Show Buddy either bump the Scenes up or down one (the 14 and 15 commands), or choose a Scene (the 16 command) without having to toggle and wrap through them.

You're done navigating the Axe-III.

Back in Show Buddy, open the Chunk Editor (Chunks are basically MIDI events you design.) Here are the columns you fill out for the commands you send:

Time - Time in seconds/tenths/hundredths when the event is sent after selection/trigger. Default is 0, but you can change it if you want.

Output - What piece of equipment you're sending the data to (Axe III in this case).

Channel - MIDI channel for that device.

Message - Right-click the menu of message types you can send and choose the one you want. (Note On, Note Off, CC Control, Program Change, Pitch Wheel.)

Data 1 - for a Preset Change, you enter the Program/Preset # within the Axe you want to call up. For a CC Control (a Scene Change in my case), you scroll to one of the numbers you entered into the Axe. Putting that 14 in the Data 1 column tells the Axe to toggle up one scene. Entering a 15 tells the Axe to toggle down one scene. And if you enter that 16 value, then you further tell the Axe just which Scene you want within the song. And you do that in...

Data 2 - For Program Changes, Data 2 is not used. For a CC Change, Data 2 needs to know which of the eight Scenes you want to call up. ) 0 = Scene 1, 1 = Scene 2 and so on.

So the logic I can see working for me is sending a Program Change, which puts me in the song patch I need, and that Program/Patch always starts in Scene 1. As the song progresses, each CC Control message takes me to a specific Scene within the song's Patch/Preset. Once the song is over, starting the next backing track with that song's assigned Chunks repeats the whole process - without having to tap-dance on the FC-12 all the time.

So, in Show Buddy, how do you time when the MIDI messages are sent? Within your backing track, you set each Chunk (like an event) at a point in time some milliseconds before you actually need the change - the message gets sent, and the new Scene magically arrives. I haven't played with how many ms it takes to time the Scene change to when it kicks in, but it's pretty short latency.

That's tomorrow's project.

Hope this helps MIDI newbies like me. Turns out, the great and succinct explanations above from the other members were key to getting how the logic worked. Once I understood those posts above, figuring it out in the Axe and Show Buddy was a breeze.

And for those of you that run lights that can be controlled by MIDI, the same thing works for those in addition to MIDI changes for effects units, drum machines, pads, and keyboards.

Now, can we MIDI the drummer somehow..? :p
 
Well, thanks to the great input here, I figured it out in about 5 minutes.

Thank you so much! I appreciate your help!

So, here is what I did...

1. In Show Buddy, the right-click menu for CC values has a lot of unassigned values. I saw 14, 15, and 16 were empty, so I decided to use those. You can use any of the unassigned numbers.

2. In the Axe-III menu (you can't do it through Axe Edit)

3. MIDI/Remote page / scroll to Scene Select - I changed the value to 16.

4. Scroll down to Scene Increment - I changed the value to 14.

5. Scroll down one more to Scene Decrement - I changed the value to 15.

These three commands give you all the Scene control you're going to need. You're set up to have Show Buddy either bump the Scenes up or down one (the 14 and 15 commands), or choose a Scene (the 16 command) without having to toggle and wrap through them.

You're done navigating the Axe-III.

Back in Show Buddy, open the Chunk Editor (Chunks are basically MIDI events you design.) Here are the columns you fill out for the commands you send:

Time - Time in seconds/tenths/hundredths when the event is sent after selection/trigger. Default is 0, but you can change it if you want.

Output - What piece of equipment you're sending the data to (Axe III in this case).

Channel - MIDI channel for that device.

Message - Right-click the menu of message types you can send and choose the one you want. (Note On, Note Off, CC Control, Program Change, Pitch Wheel.)

Data 1 - for a Preset Change, you enter the Program/Preset # within the Axe you want to call up. For a CC Control (a Scene Change in my case), you scroll to one of the numbers you entered into the Axe. Putting that 14 in the Data 1 column tells the Axe to toggle up one scene. Entering a 15 tells the Axe to toggle down one scene. And if you enter that 16 value, then you further tell the Axe just which Scene you want within the song. And you do that in...

Data 2 - For Program Changes, Data 2 is not used. For a CC Change, Data 2 needs to know which of the eight Scenes you want to call up. ) 0 = Scene 1, 1 = Scene 2 and so on.

So the logic I can see working for me is sending a Program Change, which puts me in the song patch I need, and that Program/Patch always starts in Scene 1. As the song progresses, each CC Control message takes me to a specific Scene within the song's Patch/Preset. Once the song is over, starting the next backing track with that song's assigned Chunks repeats the whole process - without having to tap-dance on the FC-12 all the time.

So, in Show Buddy, how do you time when the MIDI messages are sent? Within your backing track, you set each Chunk (like an event) at a point in time some milliseconds before you actually need the change - the message gets sent, and the new Scene magically arrives. I haven't played with how many ms it takes to time the Scene change to when it kicks in, but it's pretty short latency.

That's tomorrow's project.

Hope this helps MIDI newbies like me. Turns out, the great and succinct explanations above from the other members were key to getting how the logic worked. Once I understood those posts above, figuring it out in the Axe and Show Buddy was a breeze.

And for those of you that run lights that can be controlled by MIDI, the same thing works for those in addition to MIDI changes for effects units, drum machines, pads, and keyboards.

Now, can we MIDI the drummer somehow..? :p
Winner!
 
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