Scenes / and no default state for effects

Thomas Larsson

Experienced
Hi !

I am trying to configure my ax 8 like this.
:
Switch 1-4 scene 1-4 (four different amounts of gain on the same amp)
Switch 5-8 comp,chorus,delay,vol, in stompbox mode.

It works but: The delay turns of or on depending on the default state of each scene. I want it to work as a stompbox. I want the delay to stay on untill I shut it of with the delay switch, no matter of scene changes.
Some equipment allows the effect to not change. Just stay at it´s pevious state.

Does anybody know a way around this.

(The reason I do this is because of the audiogaps. I don´t want to x/y any amp)
 
I don't think, it is possible to do exactly what you want, but there might be other ways around it. I have some jam presets with three different levels of gain in scene 1-3, and then I have a boost on button four. Buttons 5-8 are effects. Before we start a song, I go to the scenes, I am gonna use and turn the FX on that I will need with that scene in this song. I have scene revert ON, so when I return to the scenes during the song, the FX will come on and on as I set it up, before starting. It litterally takes less time to set up three scenes than it takes to switch guitars.
 
The option to retain effect states across scene changes (ignoring the saved states) is a longstanding request.
I'd love this because it mimics the way many traditional rigs work.
Currently only possible if you attach external controllers to effect blocks.
 
Hi !

I am trying to configure my ax 8 like this.
:
Switch 1-4 scene 1-4 (four different amounts of gain on the same amp)
Switch 5-8 comp,chorus,delay,vol, in stompbox mode.

It works but: The delay turns of or on depending on the default state of each scene. I want it to work as a stompbox. I want the delay to stay on untill I shut it of with the delay switch, no matter of scene changes.
Some equipment allows the effect to not change. Just stay at it´s pevious state.

Does anybody know a way around this.

(The reason I do this is because of the audiogaps. I don´t want to x/y any amp)
It's possible indeed, instead of assigning the switch to the delay block just set the switch as a controller switch and attach it to the delay bypass state ;-)
The only downsides are that the display will show CS1 instead of DLY and that we are limited to 2 control switches so you can't do it for all your 4 effects, you could do it with a couple external switches though
 
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It's possible indeed, instead of assigning the switch to the delay block just set the switch as a controller switch and attach it to the delay bypass state ;-)
The only downsides are that the display will show CS1 instead of DLY and that we are limited to 2 control switches so you can't do it for all your 4 effects, you could do it with a couple external switches though

Nope, won't work with the Control Switches. The onboard Control Switches do not operate the same way as external switches. Their state is set per scene, just like regular blocks.
 
It's possible indeed, instead of assigning the switch to the delay block just set the switch as a controller switch and attach it to the delay bypass state ;-)
The only downsides are that the display will show CS1 instead of DLY and that we are limited to 2 control switches so you can't do it for all your 4 effects, you could do it with a couple external switches though

Yes
I have tried that to. I thought it worked at first, but no. I still have to decide th day before gig when I gonna feel like adding delay .
 
FAS does so much for everyone already, but maybe on their to do list is a firmware update that would make it possible to assign an additional parameter to certain effects blocks that could be set to either "scene dependent", that would conform to the state defined by the new scene setting or "switch dependent" that would ignore the scene setting and remain at the current switch setting?
 
Well, I was just getting ready to set up like the OP wanted. Glad I read the forum often. Hopefully FAS will find a way.
 
EDIT: Doesn't work-Still has audio gap-sorry...did seem to simple of a solution....@OP or YEK............What if you made 1-4 presets with the gain increase. IOW, just stay in scene 1 for that bank? I guess this would work. I'll try it out myself when I can. Not sure about the audio gap issue though, which was the ops main objective.
 
EDIT: Doesn't work-Still has audio gap-sorry...did seem to simple of a solution....@OP or YEK............What if you made 1-4 presets with the gain increase. IOW, just stay in scene 1 for that bank? I guess this would work. I'll try it out myself when I can. Not sure about the audio gap issue though, which was the ops main objective.

OP wants to only change the amp gain and maintain (carry over) the current state of the effects when switching between the gain.
Doesn't work with scenes and doesn't work with presets either. Plus there's an audio gap when switching between presets.
 
Nope, won't work with the Control Switches. The onboard Control Switches do not operate the same way as external switches. Their state is set per scene, just like regular blocks.
Ops, you're right! Didn't remember that also control switches are scene dependent. Sorry for the wrong suggestion!

Ps: maybe it's possible to achieve that by changing the way to alter the amp gain? For example by using cs or external controllers instead of scenes?
 
I'll never under this part of the FAS firmware design. The differentiation between scenes and presets on one side and the complex and complicated controller handling on the other side looks to me like an old design has been extended with more and more backpacks over a long time. In my eyes every preset and scene is nothing but a set of parameters to be stored and recalled. What's the need for having both? Why can't every footswitch and every external controller control everything and multiple parameters at once?
 
OP wants to only change the amp gain and maintain (carry over) the current state of the effects when switching between the gain.
Doesn't work with scenes and doesn't work with presets either. Plus there's an audio gap when switching between presets.

Yup, found that out...Should have tried before my original post .........Thanks Yek....
 
I'll never under this part of the FAS firmware design. The differentiation between scenes and presets on one side and the complex and complicated controller handling on the other side looks to me like an old design has been extended with more and more backpacks over a long time. In my eyes every preset and scene is nothing but a set of parameters to be stored and recalled. What's the need for having both? Why can't every footswitch and every external controller control everything and multiple parameters at once?
Because a preset recall takes a long time while a scene change can apply changes on only bypass states and 2 parameters and the main level, so it' s faster and produces no glitch
 
I'll never under this part of the FAS firmware design. The differentiation between scenes and presets on one side and the complex and complicated controller handling on the other side looks to me like an old design has been extended with more and more backpacks over a long time. In my eyes every preset and scene is nothing but a set of parameters to be stored and recalled. What's the need for having both? Why can't every footswitch and every external controller control everything and multiple parameters at once?

Presets and scenes have different purposes. The simplest explanation:
  • Presets are like swapping out your entire rig for a different one. Different effects, different amp, different settings. Everything.
  • Scenes are like a MIDI loop switcher. The rig stays in place, but you can control which effects are bypassed or engaged. You can control a few parameters as well (similar to having MIDI control over those parameters). You can't change which effects are where, and you can't change most settings. You can also swap XY which is similar to changing channels on an effect or amp.
 
on the other side looks to me like an old design has been extended with more and more backpacks over a long time.
This is, in part, true -- scenes were added as a way to address a common complaint about audio muting on preset changes. So yes, it was an addition to the unit's spec, but hardly a "backpack". Scenes were purpose built to address a very specific problem: you want to toggle the state of one or more things with a single footswitch and have the transition time be much faster and potentially seamless. Something you can't do with a preset change.

In my eyes every preset and scene is nothing but a set of parameters to be stored and recalled. What's the need for having both? Why can't every footswitch and every external controller control everything and multiple parameters at once?
This is true, but the available list of things a scene can change is much smaller than what a preset can change. As a result, there are optimizations for scene changes that allow for much faster changes with no audio drops (or very, very small audio dropouts in comparison to changing a preset). Thing of scenes as a highly optimized parameter change where only a few blocks and parameters change values and presets as a heavy weight operation where every block is re-initialized and reloaded on change with the new values.
 
Instead of using Scenes or x/y, here's how I've started setting multiple gain levels with Control Switches...

Set one of the CS to control Amp Drive, and set the range for the settings you want... 5 > 9 or whatever. Set the other CS to another Amp control, like Input Trim, Boost, or Sat. (I prefer Trim because I can dial in the amount.)

Now you have two separate boosts that you can control, for a total of 4 gain stages. You can also control other parameters like Bright on/off, levels, etc with either of the CS to help dial in the sound. I haven't had to do much of that other than cutting some of the flub that comes with the Boost with an EQ in front of the amp. I wish the Cut switch had a modifier.

And you still have room for two more switches for Drive or whatever on the front row :)
 
Instead of using Scenes or x/y, here's how I've started setting multiple gain levels with Control Switches...

Set one of the CS to control Amp Drive, and set the range for the settings you want... 5 > 9 or whatever. Set the other CS to another Amp control, like Input Trim, Boost, or Sat. (I prefer Trim because I can dial in the amount.)

Now you have two separate boosts that you can control, for a total of 4 gain stages. You can also control other parameters like Bright on/off, levels, etc with either of the CS to help dial in the sound. I haven't had to do much of that other than cutting some of the flub that comes with the Boost with an EQ in front of the amp. I wish the Cut switch had a modifier.

And you still have room for two more switches for Drive or whatever on the front row :)

Yes !
That´s probably the best idea so far :)

I will try that , thank´s..
 
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