Scene Switching Lag Time

56panhead

Member
The FM3 had a noticeable increased lag time compared to the Axe FX III (with an FC12).

Will the FM9 address this issue?
 
There's no Scene lag time.

There can be a gap when switching scenes includes changing channels in the Amp block. That's not caused by scenes.

Another reason for "lag" can be the way that the Scene switches are configured. If there's a HOLD function assigned to Scene switches, the FM will wait a while before executing the TAP function. To solve this: remove the HOLD function.
 
There's no Scene lag time.

There can be a gap when switching scenes includes changing channels in the Amp block. That's not caused by scenes.

Another reason for "lag" can be the way that the Scene switches are configured. If there's a HOLD function assigned to Scene switches, the FM will wait a while before executing the TAP function. To solve this: remove the HOLD function.
How long is the gap when switching channels in the amp block? Are we talking tens of milliseconds or hundreds? Does it cut out and go silent, or does it just retain the previous amp tone longer? Is it a problem with channels in general or only for amps?

This is my main concern based on reading about the FM3 in anticipation of the FM9. I have no experience with Fractal but I have a Helix and there's no gap when switching amps.
 
How long is the gap when switching channels in the amp block? Are we talking tens of milliseconds or hundreds? Does it cut out and go silent, or does it just retain the previous amp tone longer? Is it a problem with channels in general or only for amps?

This is my main concern based on reading about the FM3 in anticipation of the FM9. I have no experience with Fractal but I have a Helix and there's no gap when switching amps.
I dont know how long the gap is, it was something that bothered me with the AX8, but not with the FM3. It is pretty short.
 
How long is the gap when switching channels in the amp block? Are we talking tens of milliseconds or hundreds? Does it cut out and go silent, or does it just retain the previous amp tone longer? Is it a problem with channels in general or only for amps?

This is my main concern based on reading about the FM3 in anticipation of the FM9. I have no experience with Fractal but I have a Helix and there's no gap when switching amps.

If you need absolutely no gap between switching amp sounds, then use two amp blocks. The FM9 has two amps, just like the AxeFX3
 
How long is the gap when switching channels in the amp block? Are we talking tens of milliseconds or hundreds? Does it cut out and go silent, or does it just retain the previous amp tone longer? Is it a problem with channels in general or only for amps?

This is my main concern based on reading about the FM3 in anticipation of the FM9. I have no experience with Fractal but I have a Helix and there's no gap when switching amps.

No gap means you aren’t truly getting a new algorithm. Likely more getting a new (albeit very complex) eq when you switch amps if a processor has no gap. Not saying it doesn’t sound good, L6 has done a great job at simulating amps but it’s not the same implementation that Fractal uses.

Fractal uses algorithms to simulate each individual piece of circuitry in the entire schematic of the amp. It’s basically impossible to not have some sort of gap when switching amps unless you use two amp blocks. Even using a physical amp with channel switching there will be a small gap.

This issue has been been blown way out of proportion over the years.
 
Actually even on FM3 when switching the AMP channels, with the latest update, this gap is so tiny, that it seems, as if there's only some kind of relay doing a switch. Just like the real amp does this, the FM3 does this. There's no significant gap now. If you're bothered even by this small gap, then use 2 amp blocks in the FM9 and there's zero gap....
 
No gap means you aren’t truly getting a new algorithm. Likely more getting a new (albeit very complex) eq when you switch amps if a processor has no gap. Not saying it doesn’t sound good, L6 has done a great job at simulating amps but it’s not the same implementation that Fractal uses.

Fractal uses algorithms to simulate each individual piece of circuitry in the entire schematic of the amp. It’s basically impossible to not have some sort of gap when switching amps unless you use two amp blocks. Even using a physical amp with channel switching there will be a small gap.

This issue has been been blown way out of proportion over the years.
No, the Helix doesn't have "channels" like Fractal so I'm talking about different blocks. There's no gap because it's switching blocks on and off that are otherwise already loaded, just like you suggest with the Fractal using more than one amp block to accomplish this. The only difference there is that Helix doesn't limit the number of amp blocks explicitly (i.e. if you want a preset with no effects, a bunch of amps and one cab, you're free to do that). So channels seem like a compromise somewhat, but hopefully a usable one.

If it's comparable to a real amp, I'm fine with that. The goal of my question was to find out if it was really usable. I don't need absolutely no gap, but I also don't want anything distracting. Thanks for the info.
 
So is the gap avoided by basically not changing a channel
ie: using 2 amp blocks and making sure each is on the same channel
since you have 4 channel and 2 amps do you essentially have 4 combos you an use
amp1 clean on channel A
amp2 Jcm800 chA
 
since you have 4 channel and 2 amps do you essentially have 4 combos you an use
amp1 clean on channel A
amp2 Jcm800 chA
Yes, you can look at it that way. With 2 amp blocks, you can have seamless switching between Amp1 and Amp2, and since you have 4 channels each, you can switch out the amp channels in each (independently, too!) which gives you 10 different possible combinations of Amp1/Amp2 pairings. If you tend towards the same group of FX before/after for most songs, one preset can cover a lot of sonic ground.

Early on, with my FX3, I made a preset that covered every sound my old '90s rack used to be able to produce, which was enough sounds for a 4-set bar gig. Probably isn't enough CPU on the FM9 for that preset, but with 2 amps you have a lot to work with....
 
Yes, you can look at it that way. With 2 amp blocks, you can have seamless switching between Amp1 and Amp2, and since you have 4 channels each, you can switch out the amp channels in each (independently, too!) which gives you 10 different possible combinations of Amp1/Amp2 pairings. If you tend towards the same group of FX before/after for most songs, one preset can cover a lot of sonic ground.

Early on, with my FX3, I made a preset that covered every sound my old '90s rack used to be able to produce, which was enough sounds for a 4-set bar gig. Probably isn't enough CPU on the FM9 for that preset, but with 2 amps you have a lot to work with....
No thats awesome and what i thought the dropouts are happening
w one amp block because you have to switch channel now you can just use same channel different amp
so that works
thanks for the clarification
 
No thats awesome and what i thought the dropouts are happening
w one amp block because you have to switch channel now you can just use same channel different amp
so that works
thanks for the clarification
The channel switching takes a tiny bit of time to load and start running the next channel's amp model. If you switch amp blocks instead, the other amp block is already loaded and running, so it's gapless. The two amp blocks' channels don't necessarily have to match, i.e., you can switch from, say, Amp1-A to Amp2-B (or not 2B 🤪) if they are the channels that were already active in that preset when you switched amp blocks. You can simply switch their bypass states via a scene change so only one is heard at a time, or use the multiplexer or a mixer following them to hear one or the other, or use a pair of VolPans in front of them to switch from one to the other.
 
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