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Wish Roland® Dimension D SDD-320

skyko

Inspired
Used to own one of these until it "dissolved" beyond repair.
I dream of being able to select it as a type for the Chorus block ...

I get close ... but not quite match it ...
 

vAmp

Fractal Fanatic
Someone once said he got very close, but never came with the preset.
Cliff gave hints, but no preset either.
I once heard that unit live and found it a magical sound (still have a cassette of that gig, some 30 yrs ago). I'm not reminded of it when I hear the Dimension C or simulations of it, but it's been a while. The player that used it told me "You only hear it when you switch it off, then you'll miss it."

I would consider it an essential piece to clone, along with the TC 1210 & Tri-Chorus :) I'm happy with the Tri-Chorus settings, but haven't heard a Dimension D attempt (that I liked). OTOH, I may not consider it magical today, IDK.
Javajunkie did Dimension C presets for the Ultra, but no DD magic in there for me (no dig at JJ), although I couldn't directly compare them with a real or recorded DD (or didn't).

Here some older info:

Roland Dimension D:

- Cliff: The Quad Chorus can probably do the Dimension D. The Dimension D is, IIRC, four chorus units, each with individual LFO's. The Quad Chorus is very similar to that.

- Jezza:
* I have owned 2 Roland Dimension D rack mount units, and for a long time it was my staple chorus sound. I bought one new when they first came out (wow- that makes me feel old!). I sold them some time ago to raise some cash, but after getting my Ultra I borrowed one back for a while. I tested it extensively both by measurement and listening to see if it was possible to nail that elusive ‘D’ tone with the Axe-Fx. So - I have some information that you guys might find useful. Here goes... Firstly, due to component tolerances and internal trimpots, the units can all be slightly different. The modulation waveform in the one I had (which sounds great) is almost perfectly triangular with only the tiniest amount of ‘dwell’ caused by the very slight 'rounding off' of the triangle points. I have seen a service diagram in the past and the waveform was also shown as a triangle on that. One side of the modulation is 180 degrees out of phase. The speed and depth of the mod. is controlled by the buttons 1 to 4. The unit has 2 mod speeds, roughly a 2 second and a 4 second cycle with 2 different depths. The triangle wave in the Axe-fx sounds very close when all the other variables are matched.

Just as important is the eq applied to the delay. There is a bass roll off before the compander noise reduction. This can be simulated by placing a parametric eq block after the delay, and using the high pass filter at around 120 hz. There is also a ‘brickwall’ filter at around 8khz applied after the analogue delay lines to filter out the clocking frequency. This is not so easy to simulate perfectly as the Axe-Fx low pass filter is not steep enough. However, using the low pass filter section in the parametric gave very similar and good sounding results.

The compander circuit adds a little bit of program dependant distortion, which gives a small amount of extra ‘warmth’ to the delay. If you wanted to go the whole hog you could follow the parametric eq with a Drive block set to a low value of ‘tape’ distortion to simulate this.

The direct signal has a small (1db) bass lift to compensate slightly for the roll off in the delay. I set the chorus mix to fully wet and used a filter block (adding the bass lift) around the chorus and eq blocks for the direct sound.
The ‘D’ handles stereo signals in a special way. With buttons 1, 2 or 3 depressed the delay component for the left channel appears on the right side and vice versa. Inputting a guitar with stereo bouncing repeats sounds fabulous. Signals retain their stereo position but sound lush, wide and spacious. Button 4 returns the delays to their usual L/R position, and combining 4 with 1, 2 or 3 gives more modulation options.

So- you need a chorus block with independently pannable voices. I used 2 voices of the Ultras quad chorus but you could use a stereo delay and add the modulation. Of course, if you only use a mono input a standard chorus block will do. The delay time is not quite the same in the two channels. I think that for all except button 1 one side is about 5ms and the other about 5.5ms in my unit -about a 10% offset. Button 1 selects the slower speed with a longer delay time, but I did not measure this.
Regrettably, for you guys- I did not take notes on the final individual settings needed to exactly replicate the Dimension D sound, but it is possible to get very very close. I really just used this as an exercise to see whether it could actually be done, and to glean information to use in creating, and fine tuning my own definitive chorus. The Dimension D is fantastic, but not perfect for everything as it adds its own colour. Doing all this also confirmed my opinion that the Ultra is possibly the best and most versatile processor available at the moment.

* Well guys, I was just following where Java was leading... :) To distill the broad directions in my first post:
Use a triangle lfo with the rate set to around 1/2 or 1/4 of a second. Invert phase on one side. Set depth to taste. Use a normal chorus block if you only want a mono input and a quad chorus or stereo delay block with the two voices set to cross pan if you want stereo. Set delay around 5ms. Offset 1 side if you like by around 10%. Set mix fully wet. Follow it with a PEQ block with a high pass filter set around 120hz and a low pass about 8k. Bypass both of these with one filter block set to a low shelf at around 120hz +1dB. Adjust chorus level to suit. Enjoy a 90% authentic Dimension D sound!! Fiddle and tweak all parameters for at least couple of hours. I know... why didn't I say that in the first place.

* At that time, although it could get close, the Axe couldn't completely duplicate the D as the circuit calls for cross panning and phase reversal. The Axe is now capable of of reproducing this part, using the revised enhancer block. The re-creation of this effect needs a lot of blocks to generate the required signal path, which is quite complicated in the D as there is a lot of filtering and subtle modulation. So - as I still have all my notes and test results I have borrowed back my old unit and am working on a complete sound-alike of my favourite chorus. I will post my patches when I complete them to my satisfaction. [never uploaded his preset?]
 
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Admin M@

Administrator
Fractal Audio Systems
Moderator
Does someone have one they want to loan me for analysis? I could use the old H8000 preset, I suppose, but to me it never sounded quite like the real deal.
 

HJM

Inspired
The CE20 is close. I've got the Dimension D pedal which I love, the Dimension C always cost too much for how little I use chorus. The Universal Audio sim is good. You can borrow the pedal...but it's not as good as the rack!
 

javajunkie

Moderator
Moderator
The CE20 is close. I've got the Dimension D pedal which I love, the Dimension C always cost too much for how little I use chorus. The Universal Audio sim is good. You can borrow the pedal...but it's not as good as the rack!
Yeah, I matched the dimension C on the Ultra.

BTW many of the limitations mentioned in that post are no longer the case in the II.
 
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Swedish Chef

Power User
What about doing the Dimension D thing in the the pitch block? With a mix at 50%. Detune 1 and 2 panned hard left and right with different levels of Detune for right and left. Perhaps connecting the detune amounts to separate LFO's?
 

simeon

Axe-Master
no, use the dual delay instead. i replicated all the quirks and settings, but it's still not as lush as the original. fx block attached...
 

Attachments

tskidmore

Inspired
I have a couple of tc 1210s, I am willing to loan one out to someone who is experienced at modeling this kind of gear.
 

vAmp

Fractal Fanatic
I have a couple of tc 1210s, I am willing to loan one out to someone who is experienced at modeling this kind of gear.
Thanks! Sadly and understandably, they're not into truely cloning any or many FX, although IMO there are some classics that should be. And the TC1210 has come up multiple times throughout the years. You never know :)
 

skyko

Inspired
no, use the dual delay instead. i replicated all the quirks and settings, but it's still not as lush as the original. fx block attached...
I tried the attached effect block: during the sustain phase it seems pretty close, but on attack it's too much delay-type slapback-kind of barking at me.

But nevertheless way cool effect setting!
 

Secret80'sMan

Experienced
Does someone have one they want to loan me for analysis? I could use the old H8000 preset, I suppose, but to me it never sounded quite like the real deal.
Who has one of these to loan to Matt at Fractal? I'll even help and pitch in some bucks towards shipping if necessary if it means we can get that tone happening.
 

Swedish Chef

Power User
That would be such awesomeness. Even Eventide have the Dimension D covered in their H7600. Maybe that can be a good alternative. Or just the UAD plugin...
 

billmeedog

Inspired
Tube-Tops!

This is as far as I know the schematics of the Dimension D:

Did anyone stay awake during science class? Cliff?
Hey Swedish Chef,

I'd bet that Cliff was awake enough in science-class to shoot spit-balls at the back of Jay Mitchell's head...Oh wait a minute, when Cliff was in school he had 6L6's in his AMP, when Jay was in school he had 6L6's in his TELEVISION - different decades - LOL! (...just a little humor folks...relax!)

Bill
 
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