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Reverse Delay Problem

stereotactic

Experienced
Hello all, I am trying to get the reverse delay block to only output reverse echos, as one might expect given the name. But currently, I hear the reverse echos and then the forward passage I played into it echo after the reverse echo, alternating back and forth, which is not what I want. It says in the manual that if I want reverse only sound, I must turn up the mix to 100%, which of course means no dry sound, which I would like to have. Does anybody have a solution for this? I am using the reverse delay block in mono essentially panned hard left, while on the right side I have a completely identical signal path with a slightly shorter mono regular delay. With both sides featuring forward echoes, and only one side of having reverse echoes things get a bit confusing and are not sounding clear. This has also caused problems in balancing L R levels. This is not good, please help! Thanks!
 

Shenks

Experienced
To use mix at 100% (whilst still having a separate dry signal) you have to ensure that your delay block is in parallel - is this how you have your preset configured?
 

Bakerman

Axe-Master
That's how feedback works with the reverse algorithm. To get multiple reverse-only repeats you'd need to set feedback to 0 and send the wet signal through a separate forward delay.
 

Bakerman

Axe-Master
See post #3. Mix at 100% w/ parallel dry path isn't an immediate solution, but it's a step in routing the reverse delay through an additional forward delay.
 

stereotactic

Experienced
See post #3. Mix at 100% w/ parallel dry path isn't an immediate solution, but it's a step in routing the reverse delay through an additional forward delay.

Ok, thanks, I don’t understand why this has to be this way, it’s very counterintuitive and inconvenient. I don’t have another delay block available, and I don’t know why I should use one just to route a dry signal in parallel. But, in order to control the wet/dry reverse delay mix with a parallel dry signal, i know I will need another block. Could I use a mixer block?
 

Bakerman

Axe-Master
The problem is that delay feedback just sends the output back to the input, so the reversed bit gets reversed again and played back forward every other time. You can't use feedback in the reverse delay if you want several repeats, all reversed.

The extra delay wouldn't be for routing a dry signal, it's to create extra repeats of the reverse delay playback. Multidelay or megatap delay can be used for this. (Depending on your Delay 2 settings, it's also possible that could tackle this extra left-channel delay while still doing what you need for the right channel signal.)

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stereotactic

Experienced
Thanks very much for this, now I understand the issue. I never had this problem with my Eventide reverse delays, I guess they figured out how to do this within the algorithm.

So essentially, I need the reverse delay on zero feedback and a separate delay downstream to repeat each new reverse?
 

stereotactic

Experienced
Just checked those 2 delays and they are not long enough to handle the 8000ms setting I’m using in the reverse block, I guess it can’t be done.

I guess I’ll add this to the wishlist, along with an AES FX block. The Axe does so many things so well, but I still keep running up against limitations in trying to replicate my refrigerator rack!
 

Bakerman

Axe-Master
Multidelay quad-series type can do 8 seconds. Set levels 1/2/3 to 0 and all 4 times to maximum (2000 ms).

Also did you see this part above?

"Depending on your Delay 2 settings, it's also possible that could tackle this extra left-channel delay while still doing what you need for the right channel signal."
 

stereotactic

Experienced

Thanks for the idea, but wouldn’t that mean chopping up an 8000ms repeat into 1/4’s?

I was still trying to understand what you were suggesting about the Delay 2 block, but I only see one tap, so I don’t understand what you are suggesting.
 

Bakerman

Axe-Master
Thanks for the idea, but wouldn’t that mean chopping up an 8000ms repeat into 1/4’s?

It acts just like one 8000 ms tap with those settings.

I was still trying to understand what you were suggesting about the Delay 2 block, but I only see one tap, so I don’t understand what you are suggesting.

What delay config are you using? The idea was that if it's mono, you can switch to dual and have separate time/feedback for each side.
 

stereotactic

Experienced
It acts just like one 8000 ms tap with those settings.



What delay config are you using? The idea was that if it's mono, you can switch to dual and have separate time/feedback for each side.


Ahh, ok, I forgot about the dual delay.

Delay 1 is reverse delay set to 8 seconds hard left. Delay 2 to is digital mono set to 4 seconds hard right. Are you saying that if I used dual delay, I could have both reverse and forward delays in one block on the left side?
 

stereotactic

Experienced
Hi Bakerman, I forgot about something, I'm using the 2290 block in D2, so I can't use the dual delay version of your work around. So I tried the Quad series version but I can't get any sound through the block. I thought I followed your basic instructions, but I'm sure I've overlooked something. Would you be so kind as to tell me what other parameters I need to set? FYI, the Vol Pan at the end of the feed to output 1 is to mix a dry signal into the reverse delay repeats feeding an outboard reverb. I am using both stereo outputs, one using onboard verb and the other feeding a second verb, hence the 2 parallel stereo signal paths:
 

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Bakerman

Axe-Master
I don't know if anything on that page is causing the no sound problem. FB Return should be set to 1 though, unless you want 2nd repeat onward at shorter intervals (2000 ms). Can you post the preset?

What's the reason for the 2290 setting? It sounds like you have that delay in the right channel only, which makes the phase reverse setting irrelevant. One side of a dual delay can accomplish the same thing.
 

stereotactic

Experienced
Thanks for the info and help. Yes I do have the 2290 in the right channel only.

How do I post the preset? Sorry, this is my first time doing this.

I am using the 2290 because of the gradual defune modulation on the repeats, can that be recreated on one half of the dual delay?
 

Bakerman

Axe-Master
Click Export in AE, save file, click "upload a file" below forum text box to attach & post.

Use the LFO 1/2 Target parameters to apply modulation to one side of dual delay. 2290 type only uses LFO1. If you switch config (not type) to dual it will keep the mod settings. Then just change LFO1 Target from "both" to "right".
 
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