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Reverb between pre and power like in a fender

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chris

Legend!
How do Fractal achieve this, since there is no block between the Pre and the Power?
An FX Loop on an amp was originally a compromise. Guitarists wanted reverb after their cab like in the studio, but it was impossible in the early days. So amp makers made an Effects Loop placing it the closest to “after the cab” as possible, which is before the power amp.

On the Axe, you can place it before the amp like a pedal, or after the amp like in the studio. The Cab block placement is or isn’t important depending on what you desire: https://wiki.fractalaudio.com/axefx2/index.php?title=Cab_block#Position_of_the_Cab_block

It is not possible to place it between pre and power amp, and most of the time this is not needed to get the desired effect.
 

dumbeat

Inspired
Thanks! i do not mean an Effect Loop, i mean the traditional Vintage Fender location for the Spring Rev and i believe the Tremolo as well. Its such a classic sound that im not sure people are looking to "Improve" it...
 

YetAnotherOne

Inspired
It is not possible to place it between pre and power amp, and most of the time this is not needed to get the desired effect.
Couldn't it be done using two amp blocks? That presupposes that this is still true and that turning supply sag to zero still effectively bypasses the power amp sim. If both are still true wouldn't it be possible to set up one amp block as the preamp only followed by whatever one wishes in the way of effects then a second amp block as power amp only? I can think of several perfectly good reasons not to do that but if you just have to have the reverb & tremolo there ....
 

HerrSquid

Inspired
As a side note, the amp block does have trem built in to it, and it's very nice. See the "bias trem frequency" and "bias trem depth" controls in the amp block's power amp settings.
 

Rex

Legend!
i do not mean an Effect Loop, i mean the traditional Vintage Fender location for the Spring Rev and i believe the Tremolo as well.
It’s the same thing, for all practical purposes. Fender’s reverb and tremolo are in the same position that an effects loop would be, if it had one.
 

dumbeat

Inspired
But it’s not the same as having it between preamp and power sections of the amp.
Exactly- that's the one thing you can not emulate in the Axe, for some reason, even though it is one of the most iconic and loved signal chains in the history of electric guitar...
 

dumbeat

Inspired
It’s the same thing, for all practical purposes. Fender’s reverb and tremolo are in the same position that an effects loop would be, if it had one.
Technically, but not in the logic you presented. Where an effect loop on later amps may have been a "problem"(per your explanation), in the Vintage Fender world, its simply the "Sound", and it passed many auditions without a need to "Repair" it... That's what i meant.
 

dumbeat

Inspired
It's close enough. The preamp of a Fender doesn't distort much, if at all. Therefore it can be considered linear. Linear systems are commutative. Therefore reverb before the amp is the same as reverb between the preamp and poweramp.
Are you saying the color and EQ of the Pre going into the Spring is the same as the Spring going into the color and EQ of the Pre...?
 

Rex

Legend!
Technically, but not in the logic you presented. Where an effect loop on later amps may have been a "problem"(per your explanation), in the Vintage Fender world, its simply the "Sound", and it passed many auditions without a need to "Repair" it... That's what i meant.
To be honest, “the sound” passed the auditions mostly because it was the only option available. Unless you had a studio with a reverb chamber or a plate (or even a spring reverb you could use after your signal hit the desk). In which case, most people opted for that instead. Not sure where you were headed with the “problem” and “repair” references.
 

dumbeat

Inspired
To be honest, “the sound” passed the auditions mostly because it was the only option available. Unless you had a studio with a reverb chamber or a plate (or even a spring reverb you could use after your signal hit the desk). In which case, most people opted for that instead. Not sure where you were headed with the “problem” and “repair” references.
Yu implied that the location in the chain was less than desirable for some reason... and i say, who needs to fix an Old Fender? Do you have a better design? haha
 
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