Real fuzz pedal in front?

[giantslayer]

I’ve kind of settled on the Fuzz Face as my favorite drive model in the Axe FX 3. Lately, I’ve had this nagging thought that a real pedal might be even more magical. I know Cliff said at some point that the impedance thing on a fuzz is not possible to model accurately (yes, I do run the fuzz first so it can do the impedance thing that the AF3 does have). I guess I’m wondering if the grass is greener or if it is a negligible difference…

 

[Greg Ferguson]

What happened when you tried it?

 

[Gl4th]

I’ve kind of settled on the Fuzz Face as my favorite drive model in the Axe FX 3. Lately, I’ve had this nagging thought that a real pedal might be even more magical. I know Cliff said at some point that the impedance thing on a fuzz is not possible to model accurately (yes, I do run the fuzz first so it can do the impedance thing that the AF3 does have). I guess I’m wondering if the grass is greener or if it is a negligible difference…

I tried Pedal Pawn Fuzz (Si) and King Tone Fuzz (Ge) in front of the FM3 before I got the Axe-Fx III. And I have experience with many others before I switched to full digital.

Short answer: Yes, you can get all the tones of the real pedal.

Long answer: not with the same drive block. If I set the drive block to get the tone of the fuzz at full drive I can’t get the glassy clean when I roll back the volume with that same block like with the real pedal. But I can set another channel of that same drive block to get the gassy tone. The EQ is super useful for this purpose. The real pedal goes from massive fuzzy at full drive to glassy clean with guitar volume rolled back. With the modeler version I never got the same with 1 drive block, but I can get there with 2 different ones so much that I sold the pedals.

 

[giantslayer]

I guess it also depends on the pedals, i wasnt to fond of my Kingtone Fuzz and FoxRox BUT,
i have 3 handwired Fuzz pedals with some nos goodies and those are absolutely killing the Fuzz in the Axe.

What is your take on the germanium vs silicon thing, and compared to the models in the axe fx?

 

[ESW]

Heresy, I know, but all of my actual fuzzboxes sound better (to me) than the fuzzes in the Axe. I'm sure there's a way to dial in the drive unit block to sound the same as each of my fuzzes, but to this point it's been easier just to stick a fuzz box in front.

 

[giantslayer]

I’ve been eyeing the Benson fuzz pedal because it self-regulates the temperature to keep the germanium performing consistently. Downsides are that sucker ain’t cheap and it takes up more pedalboard real estate than I would like, but it might be worth it.

 

[giantslayer]

Another question: if you didn’t roll the volume off on the guitar, would you still consider a real fuzz to sound better or are they about equal? In other words, am I just missing out on the volume knob thing or is there more across the board?

 

[Bodde]

For me personally, and im a fuzz addict. theres definately more, but that might be different for others.
I REALLY love a good fuzz into the Axe Plexis, instant Hendrix, yeah one could use the Axe one which is fine, but not as organic sounding at all, for me as i said.

Yes I agree. It’s hard to get the organic feel of a real fuzz pedal out of the Axe fx.

 

[cole lewis]

Check out the amp models in the axe that are fuzzy/thick especially when cranked.

Atomic space tone (my fav), tweed deluxe, champ models, etc. Run them through whatever IRs you would've used with your marshall/hiwatt + fuzz face presets. Sounds imo better than the pedal models.

 

[boltrecords]

In my experience, if im using a wireless guitar unit, using a fuzz never sounds right. thats why I like using the fuzzes in the axefx. It eliminates the need for a cable direct to a fuzz pedal.

 

[Gl4th]

In my experience, if im using a wireless guitar unit, using a fuzz never sounds right. thats why I like using the fuzzes in the axefx. It eliminates the need for a cable direct to a fuzz pedal.

Agree

 

[Omri Bazelet]

This thread makes me want to compare the Hizumitas Fuzz pedal onto an Axe Fx grid and then compare it to the closest model

 

[giantslayer]

In my experience, if im using a wireless guitar unit, using a fuzz never sounds right. thats why I like using the fuzzes in the axefx. It eliminates the need for a cable direct to a fuzz pedal.

The Benson Fuzz pedal has an innovative design to where it can work after other pedals. I emailed them and they said it works after wireless unit.

In this demo, the guy uses a wireless:

 

[giantslayer]

So… the urge got the better of me and I ordered the Benson fuzz. Initial impression is it blows the axe fx fuzz face model out of the water. It may not be a true apples to apples as the Benson is based on the fuzz face but isn’t an exact clone, but aside from just the flavor, I feel like the Benson has more depth, is better balanced, and has a more organic sound.

 

[giantslayer]

I recently learned in this thread that the rear input doesn’t have the impedance thing for fractal fuzz models:
https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/front-rear-instrument-input-comparison.182138/post-2235281

I had been using the rear input because I made a nice pedalboard with a snake for all the cables to streamline setup/tear down. Everything else plugged into the back so I plugged the guitar in there too.

Going back and comparing the front/rear inputs, that was definitely the problem, why it felt “off” and not as good as it should be. Using the front input improves it to the point where I wouldn’t have bought the other pedal if this had happened first.

So how does the front input fuzz compare to the Benson? First, I lowered the bias on the fuzz face, which got it closer to the Benson, which is fairly tame for a fuzz. After getting them as close as I could, the fuzz face sounds good but I think I still like the Benson more. The Benson has more pop or dynamics to it and feels a little more alive.

 

[trancegodz]

With the guitar turned full up, the Classic Fuzz in the Axe FXIII sounds just like a real Fuzz Face. (I have several original Fuzz Faces from the 60's.) I compared it directly to my Roger Mayer Classic Fuzz and it sounded exactly like it, but it does not react the same as a guitar plugged into a real one. Especially when turning down your guitar. That is probably why Dweezil Zappa uses quite a few fuzz pedals before he goes into the front of his Axe FX.

I definitely prefer plugging my guitar straight into my Roger Mayer Classic Fuzz over just using the Fuzz Face (Classic Fuzz) in the Axe FXIII, because of how a it reacts when turning the guitar volume control down.

I like a germanium Fuzz Face for some things and silicon Fuzz Face for others. Both are good, but sound different.
If I had to choose one, I like the Germanium the best.

The Benson in the video clip sounds really good, but it does not sound like a fuzz face to me. I would not use that as a comparison.

 

[giantslayer]

The Benson in the video clip sounds really good, but it does not sound like a fuzz face to me. I would not use that as a comparison.

The Benson is based off a fuzz face circuit as a starting point, but they are different beasts. Is there another model on the axe that you would suggest as a better comparison?

 

[Budda]

You guys turn the volume down with fuzz on?

All sludge all day over here 😅

 

[App12]

What happened when you tried it?

A real fuzz and OD pedal feels better to me. But in terms of recording and front of house live with just the Axe, it is a wash (no one in the audience, as far as I know, can tell the difference).

 

[Greg Ferguson]

(no one in the audience, as far as I know, can tell the difference).

And that's an important point.

Once my modeler is at stage volume it all feels the same to me. Moving enough air to shake the guitar changes the sound and behavior of the entire system.