Question on routing OUT1 to FOH w/cab sim, OUT2 to Matrix/EVM12L without Cab sim

wknight2

wknight2

Inspired
I'm hoping someone can provide some thoughts:
For years I've been using OUT1. At first, with an FBT Verve with cab sims on. For the last 9 months or so, to a Matrix and EVM12L with cab sims turned globally off.
Things have changed where I need to route some sound to the PA, and also record directly to my laptop. Recording without cabs sims, and sound to PA without cab sims doesn't sound good.
So, after reading the wiki, I see using an FXL Loop block, the main outputs will now go to OUT2, and FXL will send an output to OUT1. OK, so that means I need to change my rig: turn cab sims back on, and send OUT2 to the Matrix/EVM, and OUT1 to the PA or laptop. I also need to change all my patches and move the CAB block to the very end, and split the signal just before it, so 1 route goes to the CAB, and the other to the FXL.
Is this correct? Is there a way to flip-flop that so the FXL sends to OUT2 and regular output goes to OUT1?
Here is a picture of my before and after.
EuroBlueBefore.jpg

EuroBlueAfter.jpg


Next question: What to do when there are 2 amps and cabs in the path? Below are pictures of the 2 patches in question, and I attached the Syx files as well.
Any thoughts?
Thank you in advance for any help!
StoneInLove.jpg

DualClean.jpg


View attachment Stone in Love .syx View attachment Dual Clean .syx
 
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wknight2 said:
So, after reading the wiki, I see using an FXL Loop block, the main outputs will now go to OUT2, and FXL will send an output to OUT1.
Click to expand...
Nope. "Main outputs" still go to Out1 and the FXL sends to Out2. Therefore cab-off sound will come out of Out2 and cab-on sound comes out of Out1. This is what you want, right?

send OUT2 to the Matrix/EVM, and OUT1 to the PA or laptop.
Click to expand...
This is opposite of what you said above, but it is actually correct and does what I just said above. The main reason this is working is because your FX loop block is not connected to the OUT column on the far right. This is because it's in the 2nd to the last column. Putting it in the last column will automatically connect it to the OUT column, which routes anything to Out1.


For your 2nd question, that's a tough one and you'll just have to do what you think gets you the best tone. Maybe the FX Loop only gets 1 Amp. Or something like that.
 
AH, ok I think I understand. So, if I want CAB OFF sounds to come out of OUT1, I should split my last effect. One end, without CAB block, should go to the OUT block. The other end of the split, I insert the CAB block, and run it into the FXL block, and not into the OUT block. Is that correct?
 
why do you want cab off sounds going to out1, your computer and PA?
 
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I already have the right short cable to go from out 1 (XLR) to the matrix in my rack. So I'd like cab sims off going to OUT1 to the matrix/EVM12L. I use this 90% of the time.
Something new: For when I want some signal going to the PA/FOH, or to my laptop to record, I need cab sims on, so having those at OUT2 would be more convenient.
So it looks like changing my layout in the above pic, with no cab going to the OUT block, and a cab going to the FXL would accomplish this? Any downsides?
 
so the thread title is kinda misleading huh?

if what you described works for you, then do it :)

i think xlr outs are more beneficial for feeding a PA system though, and i would rather use out2 for my power amp setup because of that.
 
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Well no, the thread title was my original question. I tried setting it up that way, but didn't have a short cord, so I had to connect a 30 foot cord for a 4 inch span, plus my volume inc/dec isn't working for out 2, (works on some patches not others), and a bunch of other bugs popped in. After reading your description of how the OUT block works, I figured it might be easier to try running OUT2 to FOH.
Once I buy a short cord for Out 2, and figure out why my vol inc/dec isn't working right for out 2, and why some patches are mysteriously louder than others when switching outputs, I will end up feeding XLR to PA. But I have a show Sunday so I'm quickly scrambling to get things to work :( This is my first attempt running cabs off and on to two different outputs.
 
got it! good luck! check the entire global menu and EQs for anything funny going on, as well as the I/O menu boost/pad settings.
 
OK. You should be able to do the twin amp/cab setup thing as long as the signal chain is that length - because youll need the send/return blocks (at least for this method). Im away from home this weekend so cant take a screen shot - but Ill try to explain.

Move the amps/cabs to the end of the chain as you did in the single amp patch.

Take a feed from before one of the amps to the FX loop as you did before.

From just before the 2nd amp - take a feed and then a send block. Place the return block in the slot before the FXL and link those two blocks. You should now have two feeds into the FX loop - one from each amp. if you need to mix them, then put a mixer block inplace of the FXL - with the FXL after it.
 
Sometimes moving the cab will change the sound. It depends on exactly what's after the amp & the settings used. Often there won't be much of a difference.

You probably won't want to move the amp blocks in these examples (that will change the sound more) and you likely wouldn't need the feedback send/return either. Possible solutions might look like this:

dualclean.jpg


If you set the amps' balances L & R all the effects will process in full stereo, except for reverb which works from a L+R sum. Here there will be a slight difference having cab after reverb; the reverb sound will differ between L & R more than if cabs were first (assuming different L/R cabs). I'd suggest a stereo cab block so you can route like this. To use 2 mono cabs you need to add something like filter/vol/eq before each one, with balance L or R.

stoneinlove.jpg


Similar to other preset. Here you could set chorus & delay balances L/R. Since there are 2 reverb blocks, you have a choice of keeping the reverb balance to one side, or putting some reverb (but nothing else) from that chain in the opposite channel. If you prefer the reverb balances fully L/R you could actually add Reverb 2 to the Dual Clean preset and do the same thing, combining into the chorus block.
 
Thanks!
Would there be any reason the output 2 light would clip but not the output 1?
Also I'm assuming here Copy Out1 to Out2 is off.
 
are your global eq's flat? is any balance control more to the left than right? level controls on the send page of Fx loop block all 0?
 
One output has the cab sim, the other doesn't. It's normal that certain things would make one output clip before the other in that scenario. If you bypass the cab block and Out 1 suddenly clips there's probably nothing to worry about. Just turn down the Out 2 global EQ gain.
 
Hi everybody.
I have quite the same problem:
I want to send Output 1 (cab sim on) to the FOH / Computer etc. and Output 2 without cab sim to my poweramp and into a real 4x12 cabinet.
Is there any chance to archieve this without using the FX-Loop - because I want to have the effects after the cab sim (sounds better)

Thanks for your help
 
the amp and cab sim don't have to be next to each other. many put the amp, then the "post amp" effects, then the cab, then the fx loop block last.
 
so is this the only possibility?
I wished there would be a seperate option for both outputs to activate amp and cab sims
 
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