Put on your Prognosticator Hats, show us your Crystal Balls

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Dr. Dipwad

Experienced
Everywhere I go, a musician is bringing an iPad, or two, to the gig or rehearsal for one reason or another. And I see that a lot of modeling products for guitar have recently appeared (e.g. at NAMM) which use the iPad either purely for a control interface, or for that plus processing.

Although I have neither tried these products nor compared their published features, I am confident they don't hold a candle to the Axe FX II...yet.

I do, however, wonder about the following things:

Question 1: Isn't using an iPad (or similar device) for an interface during a live show pretty much the wave of the future? Won't products that lack this be resented as too hard to use?

Question 2: Am I right in thinking that Axe Edit is only for desktop computers (Mac/Windows) and not for iOS and Android? Or, is an iOS/Android version already in the works?

Question 3: Is the processing power in an iPad already so close to that of the Axe FX II that, in a year or two, the then-current version of the iPad won't even need an outboard "helper" processor in order to do all the processing Axe FX II does, and will basically only need an add-on hardware unit to provide inputs and outputs? Or is there such a huge difference in processing power that it'll be a decade or more before that happens?
 
I can only answer question 3. Altough as a non specialist

AXE Fx 2 uses very special chips( 2 of them ) which you can get today for calculating the sound algorythms.Usually now,as there is the power we use about 80 % of CPU power for purely that purpose.So Ipad,whichever one will not be capable of doing what the rack box does,unless you want to go back to POD levels

and these are the best uptpdate chips available although not that young.

if I use the crystal ball and interpret correctly what Cliff stated as hints in various threads then the next firmware step is deeper amp modeling which allow us to build an amp off its wireing diagramm,enable then to do the modified amps ( think Mesa's hot rodded Princetons) then again more CPU power needed.So in short,apart the piracy threat Cliff has ofteen stated,will not happen.

My five cents

Roland
 
Dr. Dipwad said:
Everywhere I go, a musician is bringing an iPad, or two, to the gig or rehearsal for one reason or another. And I see that a lot of modeling products for guitar have recently appeared (e.g. at NAMM) which use the iPad either purely for a control interface, or for that plus processing.

Although I have neither tried these products nor compared their published features, I am confident they don't hold a candle to the Axe FX II...yet.

I do, however, wonder about the following things:

Question 1: Isn't using an iPad (or similar device) for an interface during a live show pretty much the wave of the future? Won't products that lack this be resented as too hard to use?
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I think that resentment is a bit harsh and overstates the importance of a 'feature' that isn't a necessity but more about gee-whiz stuff.

If you are performing then your hands are full, secondly if you can find something that sounds better you're going to use it....regardless of whether there is an app for that or not. Its also another piece of gear that can fail, not to mention troubleshooting a wireless connection of some kind is damn near impossible. Plus you shouldn't be editing a patch during a show to the degree that you'd need the editor. It's actually much faster to get around on the front panel due to what all the AxeFX has in terms of parameters....it also uses MIDI sysex so that you get better integration with multiple devices and is an instrument standard...but it's also kind of bulky. Can't have it both ways though; either you get full control or you don't. This is also why professional musicians use MIDI foot controllers or sequencers; because they're hands are usually full when performing.

Not to be rude, but the only real practical solution that I think that the handheld device as a controller solves is something that controls the mixer at the other end of the room and that's because you can walk around and dial in the mix with just one person if need be. Most of the other stuff is a bit gimmicky IMHO.

Question 2: Am I right in thinking that Axe Edit is only for desktop computers (Mac/Windows) and not for iOS and Android? Or, is an iOS/Android version already in the works?
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There is a 3rd party beta available that it being tested right now. Needs one of those adapters that goes to MIDI to work....I don't really have a lot of interest or details on it.

Question 3: Is the processing power in an iPad already so close to that of the Axe FX II that, in a year or two, the then-current version of the iPad won't even need an outboard "helper" processor in order to do all the processing Axe FX II does, and will basically only need an add-on hardware unit to provide inputs and outputs? Or is there such a huge difference in processing power that it'll be a decade or more before that happens?
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This is why I chimed in here. As of right now a quad core sandy bridge processor pretty much chokes on the code used in the AxeFX Ultra, I can't imagine what the stuff going on in the AxeFXII which uses two DSP's would do to it. It isn't all about CPU 'speed', there is bandwidth and latency issues that a generic processor cannot handle better than a dedicated DSP like the one in the AxeFX systems. Its basically the same as asking why no one has strapped a CPU onto a video card because they're so much faster....because where a CPU does many things, a GPU is optimized to perform a specific set of tasks and perform one function.

Basically it comes down to you would hit a note and then you'd have to wait for a bit to hear it. That's the amount of time it takes to get from input, be processed, the output and to your ear and it's probably the biggest hurdle that systems like this have to overcome. I mean if it doens't have to be done in near real time it wouldn't matter.
 
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There are more robust computers in the same price range as the iPad 3G which would be able to run the current Axe-Edit(i.e. HP Mini's and Netbooks) and all of the app's musicians want to run now. For the record, I DO own an IPad which I love, and I have a small Toshiba Satellite that I use with my Axe-FX II that eats it for lunch that cost me as much as a 64GB iPad with 3G. The beauty of the iPad is its touch screen interface and orientation to mass media applications. The touch screen itself is a addictive, so much so that sometimes I catch myself trying touch screen a regular computer. For on the fly gross adjustments, you can't beat it, but there is no "right/double click" deeper functions on the interface. I also have a bluetooth keyboard for it which which I find much more useful for some apps than the touch screen. That being said, I'll answer the questions.

Question 1: I suspect that a touch screen laptop with a bluetooth connection to the hardware and a locking dock with a keyboard and some other device like a trackball or a mouse will be the wave of the future. Whether that's an Apple product or not is debatable. The keyboard/mouse/trackball isn't going away tomorrow. I think products will be resented if they don't have all three more than the touch screen by itself.

Actually, thinking about this further. I think that wireless network devices will be the wave of the future. You'll have a group of rugged but relatively cheap touch screen interfaces in the throw up zone on stage with high powered and expensive processing/computer gear safely locked up in a rack backstage. The band will have its own private local area network that carries control and audio signals back to the processors. Sounds complicated, but I suspect it will become easier as the tech matures.

Question 2: I would think more in terms of operating systems as there are many types of computers that are not "desktops in the traditional sense."

Question 3: Axe-FX is using components that are specifically optimized for Digital Signal Processing while the iPad is using ones that are designed for a more general use. I suspect that as components improve that optimized components for specific applications will always be "better" than those designed for general use; however, that may not always be evident to the user. "Perfect is the enemy of good enough."
 
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I'm old and can't keep up with this crap. I'll still be playing an old beat-up Marshall with ripped tolex 10 years from now. :)

Seriously though, it is getting scary how technology is improving. The idea of hooking up to an IPad for a show is unbelievable.
 
shasha said:
I think that resentment is a bit harsh and overstates the importance of a 'feature' that isn't a necessity but more about gee-whiz stuff.

Its also another piece of gear that can fail, not to mention troubleshooting a wireless connection of some kind is damn near impossible. Plus you shouldn't be editing a patch during a show to the degree that you'd need the editor. It's actually much faster to get around on the front panel due to what all the AxeFX has in terms of parameters...
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I agree, the current wireless systems would be impossible troubleshoot under gig conditions, but the US Military is already able to run secure networks under combat conditions used by not necessarily the most tech savvy. I suspect that as that technology filters into the private sector we'll see some musical applications.
 
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