Pros and Cons of Multiband Compression

H13

H13

Inspired
So I've been experimenting with multiband compression.

It's been a pretty interesting experience. I've been putting it between the cab block to sorta control what gets sent to the cabs.

What I've found it real useful for is setting up Band 1\2\3 to be Bass\Mid\Treble and adjusting the levels from there. Want a bit more bottom end? No wuckas, just give Band 1 a few extra DB. Like the mids but feel like the top end is screeching a bit? Ease off band 3 and things kinda balance out real nicely.

I also find it great to hear what each range sounds like. Sound like there's something weird in the mids? Mute the Bass\Treble side and tweak the GEQ or something. It's been really useful in that area too.

That being said, I'm suspicious because it's working out so nicely that I'm not...sure why it isn't mentioned all the time? Either I've found a magic bullet that works brilliantly for me, or there's a gremlin that I haven't discovered yet, which is why not everybody talks about it.

I know with compression you lose dynamics. I have lost some of the dynamic range (EG: Things don't quiet down as much), but the tone is still responsive if I pick heavy\light or roll the volume back\forth. So the tone is still dynamic. I would suggest the volume range is more consistent, but the tonal range is the same (if that makes sense).

So after all that rambling.

What are the pros and cons of multiband compression? Any reason why I might not want to use it?
 
In fact I'm feeling exactly like you do, the MBC is on in all of my presets. I've not used it the way you do with boost or cut in one band, but from my experience the compression is nearly "invisible" with the MBC for the bass frequencies do not affect the compression in mid and high band. I'm not compressing the sound very much there, if I need further compression in a preset, I prefer to use an additional and "normal" compressor before the amp.
 
Like keh, mostly I'm using the MBC for adjusting the bass amount nearly in all my presets. Works very great for me. Increasing the level of the frequencies up to 180 hz by 4 - 6 db with threeshold between 30 - 33 db and a bit compression (all by taste, depending on the sound I wish) make the all in all sound a bit thicker (the high notes too) without boominess. I'm setting it after the cab block to maintain the dynamic of the amp. So I get great sounding cleans, fat heavy licks and smooth soli.
 
Another thing it seems to be doing is producing a very "complete" guitar sound. I feel like with the MBC on (once I've dialed it in), the noise which comes out of my monitors is a much larger picture of a guitar sound. I can hear more bottom end (without making things boomy), a bit more top end sizzle (without making things fizzy) and I can have as much\little mids as I want.

The positive impact of an MBC is almost game-changingly good. That makes me wonder why its praises aren't sung from the heavens and what the negatives are.
 
If I need to compress certain frequencies or tweak dynamics in a given range, I'll use it. Otherwise, for general EQ'ing, I almost always use a PEQ. The right tool for the job and all.
 
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I don't really use MBC in the Axe, but I do use it in the DAW
my intention is that you never really hear it in the same way as you can hear a compressor as a guitar guitar effect
for example.. if the low end of in instrument is causing some strong peaks, I'd use an MBC to get them under control but allow the other frees to breath
also, MBC can tame aggressive hi's

I see it as a tool to mend thing things
 
Anyone have some general setting to try out? I have never used a MBC before but I tried it out last night after seeing some comments here and wasn't finding the same results. I would test it with it on and with it off and with it off sounded more clear and less clouded. I know its suppose to compress the sound but it seemed to make it sound smaller vs. bigger. What am I missing?
 
guitarfreak365 said:
Anyone have some general setting to try out? I have never used a MBC before but I tried it out last night after seeing some comments here and wasn't finding the same results. I would test it with it on and with it off and with it off sounded more clear and less clouded. I know its suppose to compress the sound but it seemed to make it sound smaller vs. bigger. What am I missing?
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I think the idea is to use it to tame some of the extremes once you've dialed in a good tone. Like a nice chimey high end, but don't want it to sound like a "ice pick in the forehead" when you dig in? Add a some compression on the higher frequencies. Want a chunky bottom end, but don't want it to flub out with palm mutes? Compress the bass frequencies. You get the idea.
 
guitarfreak365 said:
Anyone have some general setting to try out? I have never used a MBC before but I tried it out last night after seeing some comments here and wasn't finding the same results. I would test it with it on and with it off and with it off sounded more clear and less clouded. I know its suppose to compress the sound but it seemed to make it sound smaller vs. bigger. What am I missing?
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Do you understand what compression is and how to use it in general? By nature, compression is reductive; it reduces dynamic range. A multi-band compressor reduces dynamic range for a given frequency range set by the user. If the top end of your tone gets disproportionately louder when you play hard, multi-band compression can act as a buffer to lower the volume of the hi-end by a set amount any time it exceeds a specific threshold, whereas a standard compressor will compress the entire signal.
 
Jason Scott said:
Do you understand what compression is and how to use it in general? By nature, compression is reductive; it reduces dynamic range. A multi-band compressor reduces dynamic range for a given frequency range set by the user. If the top end of your tone gets disproportionately louder when you play hard, multi-band compression can act as a buffer to lower the volume of the hi-end by a set amount any time it exceeds a specific threshold, whereas a standard compressor will compress the entire signal.
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I do know that compressors reduce the sound, but after seeing comments in this thread, people were saying it created a bigger or wider sound by using it. I know this is counter intuitive but I know it can be true. I just haven't found these results and was wondering what settings were being used or what I might be missing.
 
guitarfreak365 said:
I do know that compressors reduce the sound, but after seeing comments in this thread, people were saying it created a bigger or wider sound by using it. I know this is counter intuitive but I know it can be true. I just haven't found these results and was wondering what settings were being used or what I might be missing.
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they reduce the dynamic range... the difference between the loudest and quietest sounds..
 
guitarfreak365 said:
I do know that compressors reduce the sound, but after seeing comments in this thread, people were saying it created a bigger or wider sound by using it. I know this is counter intuitive but I know it can be true. I just haven't found these results and was wondering what settings were being used or what I might be missing.
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Compressors reduce dynamic range. They actually boost the quieter parts of a signal while at the same time reducing the loudest portions. Compressors generally include some type of makeup gain, which is used to boost the signal after it's been compressed(because as you've observed it's often quieter after it's been compressed). In the case of the multi-band compressor block the makeup gain is basically the Level knob. If the signal sounds quieter after setting the threshold and ratio, try increasing the signal with the Level knob. Unless there are some really wild peaks, you don't need to set the ratio very high. Try setting the threshold for the middle band to around -20 dB, the ratio somewhere between 1.500 - 2.000 and the Level 2 knob to around 2dB.

I sincerely recommend reading up on and wrapping your head around compression first before trying to work with multi-band compression. The latter can be exceptionally useful, but you honestly need to understand compression first, otherwise it's just pointless knob twisting.
 
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Jason Scott said:
otherwise it's just pointless knob twisting.
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Good job I know the topic under discussion but then again... it probably still holds true.

On a more serious note, I keep reading up on various mixing techniques and how they apply to guitar. I know I might have learnt a bit, but I have learnt there is much more I need to learn. MBC is just part of the equation and I fully agree you have to understand compression first before jumping down the rabbit hole.
 
Slightly off topic, but I have found that the output compression in the amp block can seriously beef up the sound of a clean amp. It's often worth it to try boosting the dynamics of the preamp when you do this, then you can get some interesting break-up when you dig in but still keep the output volume fairly smooth.
 
guitarfreak365 said:
Anyone have some general setting to try out? I have never used a MBC before but I tried it out last night after seeing some comments here and wasn't finding the same results. I would test it with it on and with it off and with it off sounded more clear and less clouded. I know its suppose to compress the sound but it seemed to make it sound smaller vs. bigger. What am I missing?
Click to expand...

There aren't really numbers you can punch in for the MBC as it's really dependent on what's getting put into it. So here's how I set mine up:

1) I mute the bands and set the frequencies to be where the bass\mids\top are.

2) I look at the screen on the unit to see how much gain reduction is happening. I set the threshold so that it's just tickling each of the 3 bands. It's not really squashing the bass\mids\treble, rather it's taming them a bit and keeping it under control.

3) I keep the Attack\Release times nice and quick so that nothing's really getting flattened out and there's still some pump\movement.

Basically: I set it up so that you can't really hear the MBC in the first place. Then I set the gain levels on each of the bands to add more bass\mids\treble\whatever I want to add that last bit of sculpting.

I find that adding a TINY amount of compression to each band kinda brings out some of the details of each area, so I can spot more problems, but then I can really balance the tone by messing with the bands.
 
H13 said:
3) I keep the Attack\Release times nice and quick so that nothing's really getting flattened out and there's still some pump\movement.
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Interesting, I would have thought that having the attack time slow would keep the movement, as it would kick in after the initial pick attack.
 
H13 said:
There aren't really numbers you can punch in for the MBC as it's really dependent on what's getting put into it. So here's how I set mine up:

1) I mute the bands and set the frequencies to be where the bass\mids\top are.

2) I look at the screen on the unit to see how much gain reduction is happening. I set the threshold so that it's just tickling each of the 3 bands. It's not really squashing the bass\mids\treble, rather it's taming them a bit and keeping it under control.

3) I keep the Attack\Release times nice and quick so that nothing's really getting flattened out and there's still some pump\movement.

Basically: I set it up so that you can't really hear the MBC in the first place. Then I set the gain levels on each of the bands to add more bass\mids\treble\whatever I want to add that last bit of sculpting.

I find that adding a TINY amount of compression to each band kinda brings out some of the details of each area, so I can spot more problems, but then I can really balance the tone by messing with the bands.
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That's really helpful man! Thanks a ton!
 
The MBC works great with bass guitar too! I use it to smooth out the dynamics for when I switch playing styles from using a pick, fingers and slapping/thumping. For bass guitar I use the Low and High bands to tighten the dynamics but I use lots of compression on the Mid band, so it can be consistently heard through a dense mix or live band.
 
StickMan said:
Interesting, I would have thought that having the attack time slow would keep the movement, as it would kick in after the initial pick attack.
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I hear what you're saying, but I really only want the MBC to grab errant spikes. I also don't want it to flatten out notes when I'm picking things quickly. It's been working for me, I'll probably stick with the fast release time, but what you're saying is a good suggestion. I'll give it a crack later.
 
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