Presets kill inspiration......interesting take

L

lqdsnddist

Axe-Master
Just thought I’d share something I came across that kind of got me thinking a bit......

it was an interview about synths, and how some of them are totally analog, one knob per function, no patch recall etc. you want a sound, you dial it in.

now a lot of people want patch recall and a bunch of presets they can spin a knob and go through, BUT, the dude they were interviewing (sorry can’t find a link to it) said something interesting..... those kill his inspiration

Basically said what happens is you sit down at the synth and you go through a bunch of presets, and being presets are typically poor in most units, you end up spending half an hour playing these uninspiring and cliche tones and by the time you find something you like, you’ve lost the desire to play.

now FAS presets are pretty darn good, so it’s not exactly an apples and oranges comparison, but it really got me thinking about how many times I spent time trying a hundred different patches, because it’s easy, vs, just crafting one patch to the sound I’m after.

I don’t think there is any right or wrong opinions, but certainly interesting viewing machines with no presets, automation, recall etc as a real positive thing because of the forced way of working instead of what can be a crutch at times in having presets.
 
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He does have a point. But he's also mistaken. Presets can be inspiring. Take the Edge's funkwah sound of Mysterious Ways. That's a very recognizable sound that no other person can play because you immediately hear that sound and start playing it like The Edge. It's still a preset from the Korg A3. He didn't change thing and just used it as is. So they can be inspiring.

Thing with presets is, do you get a piece of gear for its factory presets, some of which can be inspiring, or do you get it to recreate your studio sound, after you've done your inspiration thing, and recreate that studio sound night after night after night on stage? I get it that by having to dial in analog knobs on synths and pedals on the road during your set you might hit upon a new inspiring sound. That's how David Gilmour's seagull Echoes screams came about. But most guys aren't playing in endless jam bands and audiences want to hear the songs as they sounded on the record. Presets are the tool that will help you nail that.

As for the Axe, any factory preset that revolves around an amp model to highlight I don't even bother with it. Most get replaced with my own. But presets that revolve around effects, especially ambiant stuff, I find them highly inspiring.
 
I agree, point taken, but not for everyone of course. The presets, for many of us, are truly helpful in learning "how" to create our own presets. Hearing what the specific combination of blocks sound like instead of trial and error.
For me, with my Ultra, 10 years ago, if it weren't for the presets helping me, I may have chosen a different path than fractal.
Of course, being the computer geek I am, I seriously doubt that.

Your post is well received and an excellent point..................For me, the presets make it easier to build my own.
Like you stated, which I agree with again, "I don't think there is any right or wrong opinions."
 
When I bought my Ultra, the first thing I did was to remove all of the presets.
That said, the presets are better than ever, and I am happy to have them!
 
This is something I have a fair bit of experience with :). With Omnisphere, we recognized that there are several paths people take to finding the tone they want. It's not even a matter of each person has a single path that is best for them. Their choice of path may vary with their mood or project. There is no single answer like "use presets" or "don't use presets". It's important to offer a variety of ways to explore sounds.

1) Good templates. For those who want to start from scratch, provide a good starting point that can easily be used as a jumping off point. Sometimes people have a specific sound in their head and just need a template that can be used to get there quickly.

2) Provide a huge library of tagged and categorized presets. On the other hand, someone may have just a vague idea of what they want. So it's important to offer a library of presets that are tagged so the user can provide a brief description of what they want, and browse through a variety of presets that match that. This way you can narrow your search to only show sounds that match what you're looking for. The key here is to offer a tagged browser that allows you to quickly audition a large number of tones so you don't get bogged down in the browsing experience. And, once you find something, make it easy to tweak and save a unique version of that preset, which then becomes a part of the preset library.

3) Search based on similarity. Sometimes, you've found one sound that's pretty much what I want. But what if there are other, very similar sounds, that would be even better? Provide a way to say: find me other sounds that are very similar to this one.

4) Surprise me. I'm stuck right now and I'm looking for a spark of inspiration. Omnisphere has an Orb with a dice button that you can used to take a preset in unexpected directions. That can be a great way to get to be inspired to create something cool and unique that nobody has never heard before.

Plus there are many other techniques, like shuffling the raw preset list so you can look at it with a fresh perspective. And attribute locking, so if you like one aspect of a preset, you can lock that part of it while you continue searching. Etc.


The point is there are a number of ways to get to a sound that is fresh and unique. As modelers mature and more and more of them have great tone, it will be features like this that sets the top rank aside from the others.
 
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I actually use presets specifically to inspire me when I’m not feeling overly enthused about playing, but know I have to write something. (I get in a funky mental state, depressed and anxious when I don’t write for long periods at a time) I do it with software synths all the time. I’ll come across one sound and next thing you know, there’s 20 tracks of synths stacked up and a whole song is born from it.

When I first got my G-Force back in the day I wrote a TON of riffs/sections from doing the exact thing. I’ve barely done it with my AxeFX, I have a couple sessions I saved that have some interesting stuff going on that I’ll probably revisit in the future. Mainly because I had ‘work’ to do when I got it. I’ve had songs kicking around for 1-5 years that I wanted to re-track all the guitars for and I was so excited to start making my own presets that I just got right to it and after a couple months, I’ve got enough variations of hi-gain presets that I can just start blasting through everything.

I can see where it could be an issue with some people, which is why it’s good to spend some time getting your basic, usable tones set up and THEN go meandering around.
 
I suppose there is a certain mindset pertaining to the gear in question too. With traditional analog style synths, I would guess the knob per function nature is what attracts the user. If you weren’t into patching modulates, turning knobs etc, you’d probably use some sort of vst or sound module, so perhaps the process itself dictates a bit of a mindset, though there are analog synths with patch recall and presets etc

a lot of presets have been pretty awful on many synths for decades too, either sounding totally dated or hopelessly cliche and or both lol. I remember back in the virtual analog heyday stuff like the Roland jp8000, Novation stuff etc being just awful..... We got stuck with hearing “sand storm” because it was a preset......

I do remember back in those days you’d select a preset, hit some keys, move to the next one and then you went through them all and though “this isn’t worth $1000”

now the opposite can be true with something like a Moog (Behringer) model D..... turn the knobs and you get sound, maybe, and maybe it sounds cool. Set the knobs right and it can sound awesome, but you have to have some clue what your doing....

that process though of having to create the sound as your playing can certainly take you in some interesting ways.... I know my modular stuff is also just blindly patching stuff together and sometimes it’s pretty cool sounding lol

great presets like FAS or AB stuff is certainly a bit of an exception though..... maybe a synth with all great stuff, like a Richie Hawtin TB303 already loaded with sweet patterns would be cool, but still though, if it sounds cool from the box does something go missing in that creation process ?

Is too much goal with presets, sharing patches etc all about duplicating something that already has been done ?

lots of people want Gilmour patches, and yeah, David has an awesome tone, but he didn’t try to copy anyone’s tone, he took gear that was new at the time and created something unique and now timeless..:

Are we still seeing people create unique stuff because there is no other way of working ?
 
Everyone's different, no right or wrong answer. Some people find inspiration when scrolling through presets and find "that" tone. Others find it by turning knobs, looking for "that" tone. Personally, the latter is more inspiring to me and has caused more epiphanies than scrolling through presets. IMO, the thing that those who prefer to scroll through presets miss out on are the tones that are stumbled upon during the process of dialing in a particular tone or sound. It would be interesting to find out how many of the tried and true tones and sounds are actually happy accidents; not the intended tone or sound but turned out to be iconic.
 
It really depends for me on the context. Guitar tones, I'm pretty good at dialing in, so I can get there much faster. Then like Muad'zin said, some of the ambient ones in the AFX can really inspire me - I've created songs just from Choral Canyon, or A Kind of Dream, some of Simeon's patches, etc.

With synths, it's a totally different thing because I'm not really a keyboardist or synth wiz. I got to learn on a Moog back in high school, but modern soft synths - and there are so many - it's way easier to have a general idea in my head, flip through presets to find something in the ballpark, and I know enough to tweak from there. If I had to start from scratch with a synth, then I'd spend way too much time creating a tone and probably would lose the inspiration, unless the original ideas was just to see what comes out.
 
For anyone who wants to learn about synth programming check out the app called Syntorial and is associated synth app Primer.

It's a tutorial app that teaches you about synth tones from the ground up with lessons, tests, etc.

The first 30-40 lessons are free.

I did a bunch of them a while back and found it pretty cool and educational.

I didn't know much about the topic beforehand.
 
Kamil Kisiel said:
Another good way to learn about synths is to buy simple analog monosynth that has no preset capability. I got into analog synths by buying an Arturia Microbrute a number of years ago. Now I work for a synth company...

dangerous path I guess :)
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I bought a Korg MS20 because I thought it looked cool once, didn't know how to use it, but dangerous path indeed because like guitars and pedals, no one can have just one synth lol

analog monosynths are a nice way to learn though as typically every single control is in front of you, unlike many more modern synths that have lots of pages of hidden features, shared knobs etc, which kind of creates confusion.

When you have an ASDR for the filter, and you turn that attack knob and you can hear how its affecting the filter sweep, and then how a second ASDR affects the VCA and how one is filter, one is shape of the note, how sustain vs decay knobs affect key on vs key off sound and it all starts to make sense. Then you start thinking about what an LFO does, and realize you can patch it to a given input, such as cutoff, and instead of turning that knob, the LFO does it automatically at the rate and shape its assigned and before you know it, your knowing what to reach for to accomplish a given sound, such as making a cool analog kick drum sound. Its all rather logical, for the most part, but you need to kind of see how all the knobs relate to the whole, unlike guitar pedals where you can kind of treat each pedal on its own.

Great change of pace from guitar stuff for me, as I make different music, different way of working, creating etc. The Axe is an awesome synth processor too!
 
lqdsnddist said:
I bought a Korg MS20 because I thought it looked cool once, didn't know how to use it, but dangerous path indeed because like guitars and pedals, no one can have just one synth lol
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Yeah, now imagine being both into synths and guitars... it hurts. Fortunately I don't have kids or loans or anything like that, otherwise I'd really be in trouble.
 
I think it might kill inspiration if your trying to write your own music. But if you just like to rock out in front of a mirror, than presets can be real fun.
Wait, am I the only on the plays in front of a mirror? Awkward
 
socalguitar said:
I think it might kill inspiration if your trying to write your own music. But if you just like to rock out in front of a mirror, than presets can be real fun.
Wait, am I the only on the plays in front of a mirror? Awkward
Click to expand...
Well, like I said, a lot of Edge's tones on Achtung Baby are straight up factory presets of the Korg A3. And that is considered U2's best album where they sonically stepped out of the box. So I reckon that presets don't have to kill inspiration. And when I write my own music 99% of the time I'm just playing things unplugged on my guitar anyway.
 
Presets are everything though. right? Once you have that tone you need to play that part or song, the inspiration follows. The problem i have is all the amps and cabs sound good and can be dialed close to that sound you need, and so i get stuck on the same preset for hours. Like the amps are local minima, or little pleasure traps, in your quest for that tone. And there are so many combinations of EQ setting with pedals engaged, that a target tone or attitude you're after can be elusive. But therein lies the magic.
 
What kills inspiration for me is realizing that I absolutely can't get the tone I want, even after screwing around with the hardware a while. I've just lost the time I had to be creative, and now I'm in a worse mood.

If I had all the free time in the world, I'd love to sit around all day and mess with guitar tones, synth tones, and how to do interesting things with them. I'm lucky if I have an hour a day. All I wanted to do yesterday was play, and I didn't get to do more than look at a wall of guitars. So I guess I can see it either way. For me now, at this point in my life, I just want something that sounds good out of the box. It's one reason I pay for presets. I still occasionally buy cabs, but I never have time to go through new ones anymore, any more than revisit old cab packs I have. That's time consuming on a whole other level.
 
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