Preset advice needed for studio vs live

Etudica

Inspired
I just got back from my first rehearsal using the axe at serious volumes, and it didn't go as well as I hoped.

I have spent the last 2 years learning and loving the Axe in my home studio where it never left my desk rack, so all my patches were designed for recording straight into my DAW, and they sound amazing at low monitoring levels. Having said that, I cranked it up tonight to compete with a live drummer at gig volumes. Holy crap - uncontrollable feedback and the fx were insanely overwhelming. I basically had to go through every patch and cut the mix/level in half for each fx block (even more for comp block) in order to get that home studio sound while playing live.

So what does everyone else do? Do you simply have two copies of each preset, one for recording and one for live? Kinda scratching my head right now trying to figure out the best way to approach this.
 
I know that's what I used to do. You need to have presets dialed in for how you are going to be using them Live, recording, Amp and Cab or FR. Once you there all you nee to do is use global EQ to add or subtract what you need or don't need for the mix and stage.
 
Basically, yes. I have 2 sets of presets, or at the very least, my 'live sounds' and the rest are my studio tones. I've found almost nothing I do in my studio translates live. For one, my studio monitors aren't what I play thru live so there's a huge gap there. Also, playing in a controlled setting at home has very little to do with playing with a bass player and drummer at stage volume. FX mix has to be totally different for live use if you want things to cut thru the mix. For instance, my delay setting at home is much more subtle, live I need a lot more otherwise it just gets buried by the other guys. YMMV.

The fly in the ointment for me is every firmware update lately usually makes me almost have to start over, which I hate. And is generally why I don't update my firmware. Maybe 2x a year. it takes me a month of gigs to get back to where my levels are what they need to be. I mix with my feet. Every tone and every subsequent effect is dialled in for every situation I may need. The latest update completely changed my cleans in regards to everything else. So for the last 2 weekends I've gone from being very happy with how the update sounds sonically, to a minute later wanting to throw my rack into the ocean because so many of my levels aren't balanced anymore. I am not someone who 'sets everything at x.xx' level. That doesn't work. Clean needs to be dynamic and loud, heavy needs to be louder, solo needs to be loudest. Drive blocks need to break up cleans, but not send them over the edge so that the patch is too loud. It's been a nightmare, and means I've been spending a lot of time with my back to the audience between songs trying to go back to patch X and edit it in the 10 second break I have every 4 songs. It sucks ass. It'll prob take me another month of gigs before everything is back to where it needs to be. At which point they'll be another update that changes things dramatically. I really, really wish the updates didn't do this. The sonic benefits for me rarely outweigh the headaches of level changes, clipping etc.

It's almost like if every time there was a Pro Tools update, your previous mixes all were thrown in the trash and clipping and needed to be re mixed. To me, I don't care what improvements were made, but it trashes the months of patches I've built up, who cares. Just my take.

So in conclusion - 2 sets of patches, live and studio. And choose your updates wisely. I choose to update when I had some low pressure gigs where I could basically 'take the night off' and keep my back to the audience half the night. The band hates me for it, but I have no choice. But this is also why this will be my last update for prob the next 6 months. The stress of getting up there and having shit all messed up is not fun.

I just got back from my first rehearsal using the axe at serious volumes, and it didn't go as well as I hoped.

I have spent the last 2 years learning and loving the Axe in my home studio where it never left my desk rack, so all my patches were designed for recording straight into my DAW, and they sound amazing at low monitoring levels. Having said that, I cranked it up tonight to compete with a live drummer at gig volumes. Holy crap - uncontrollable feedback and the fx were insanely overwhelming. I basically had to go through every patch and cut the mix/level in half for each fx block (even more for comp block) in order to get that home studio sound while playing live.

So what does everyone else do? Do you simply have two copies of each preset, one for recording and one for live? Kinda scratching my head right now trying to figure out the best way to approach this.
 
I suspect there are a lot of users who have a love/hate relationship with upgrades. You love the improvement, but hate the rigmarole of readjusting presets/parameters. Fortunately, not all upgrades require that level of involvement. Sometimes, it's just bug-swatting and the addition of some new/improved feature(s) or new amp models. Those updates are easier to take. Then, there are those like the upcoming G3 update that might be a whole paradigm shift.
 
Just out of curiosity, what is it that you find that you change for studio vs live sound. I have not recorded much yet.
 
Grab your manual and read up on Global Effects Mix. It lets you adjust all your effects at once with a single twist of the knob.
 
Grab your manual and read up on Global Effects Mix. It lets you adjust all your effects at once with a single twist of the knob.

That's what I was planning on experimenting with this week. Haven't had time to read up on the global mix yet but the first question that comes to mind is can you tie the compressor to a global mix parameter as well?
 
I tweak my presets at gig volume and then don't adjust when I'm playing at lower volume.

I love big reverb and delay but I dial it in dark so it doesn't overwhelm the main sound. But my taste for reverb mix is high.

I do have to tweak between wedges and in ears. For in ears I lower the efx level and put a small bump at 2.5K and maybe a low mid push at 200 or remove 200 depending on the patch. 4x12 IR's can get weird when using in ears for me and I might dump 200 for those.
 
In general I find things are either usually too bright at concert volume or way too bass heavy/boomy. What may sounds great at bedroom studio levels playing with some tracks generally doesn't work on a stage with shit acoustics and tons of bass build up, kick drum etc. Every room is different obvi. But going for a more balanced tone live is what you want. I find it's easy for things to get abrasive live that in the studio may sound just fine.

Just out of curiosity, what is it that you find that you change for studio vs live sound. I have not recorded much yet.
 
eq and gain are the 2 things I change most between live, bedroom, recording. global eq is a great tool.
 
Grab your manual and read up on Global Effects Mix. It lets you adjust all your effects at once with a single twist of the knob.

From Wiki: "Note that adjusting this control may not have the desired effect when the preset contains a Reverb block in a parallel routing with Mix set to 100%."

This pretty much eliminates that approach for me. I'd say about 50% of my patches have 2 reverb blocks with at least one routed in parallel. It looks like making a second "live" copy of each patch is the quickest way to go at the moment without redesigning each preset layout . I've only got ~40 or so to do and it's really just the effects that need toned down or eq'd.
 
From Wiki: "Note that adjusting this control may not have the desired effect when the preset contains a Reverb block in a parallel routing with Mix set to 100%."

the global control will still work, but since the mix is 100%, the global control simply won't have the same range when compared to blocks in serial at say, 30-50%.
 
the global control will still work, but since the mix is 100%, the global control simply won't have the same range when compared to blocks in serial at say, 30-50%.

Ok, but when in parallel the "mix" is controlled by reverb block level, no? With the mix at 100% and say level -4, then adjusting -30% global mix, the level will remain unchanged, so really I'm just leaking more of the dry signal through which could affect other blocks down the line and change the overall preset feel/volume. Please do correct if I'm mistaken.
 
Ok, but when in parallel the "mix" is controlled by reverb block level, no? With the mix at 100% and say level -4, then adjusting -30% global mix, the level will remain unchanged, so really I'm just leaking more of the dry signal through which could affect other blocks down the line and change the overall preset feel/volume. Please do correct if I'm mistaken.

yeah that too :) but reducing the mix parameter in that parallel block will still reduce the amount of reverb heard, but not by much.
 
I too discovered this quite early on.

95% of my Axe-FX use is live so my setting are geared towards that setup. What I've also noticed is a significant difference when the volume is high. My default "dirty" tone cleans up at hi volume yet has more distortion at low volume.
 
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