Plexi 2204 Question

T

Thenewexhibit

Experienced
Hello! I had a question about the Plexi 2204 model. I seem to remember it sounding really nice and midrangey, chunky, and fluid under the fingers, and Leon Todd's video of it seems to be in line with what I remember, but yesterday when I tried it out, it was very bassy, stiff, not fluid, and nothing like what I remember. I was using a York Audio IR of the black jack, which sounds really great with other marshall style amps. The last time I really tried this model out was probably pre cygnus. Is that just how this model sounds, or am I doing something wrong? I noticed it said in the wiki about turning everything on 10; this resulted in it sounding almost like a fuzz pedal where the notes collapsed on themselves. Turning the bass down to 2 or 3 is just lost body, turning the gain down made it less fluid, and turning the treble and midrange up just highlighted what was already there in my experience; sizzly and stiff, not chunky and smooth, slow to respond, and boomy.

What are your guys' experience with this model? Am I missing something here?
 
Budda said:
Try the master volume on 4.
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I just tried that, and it doesn't seem to make that big of a difference. It sounds kind of like how a fender that's farting out sounds; loose in the low end, brittle on top and no detail. Is this how this model is supposed to sound? I turned the bass down to 3, everything else is on 5, gain is around 8.
 
The model has changed a lot from firmware to firmware. My impression of the changes is that it's gotten tighter and brighter over time.

The Wiki says this is based on a '79 2204 I think? I own a '79 2204 and it does not sound like any version of this amp sim IMHO. The amp sounds like Brit 800. Not sure what amp this sim is supposed to replicate.
 
cardinal said:
The model has changed a lot from firmware to firmware. My impression of the changes is that it's gotten tighter and brighter over time.

The Wiki says this is based on a '79 2204 I think? I own a '79 2204 and it does not sound like any version of this amp sim IMHO. The amp sounds like Brit 800. Not sure what amp this sim is supposed to replicate.
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There haven't been any changes to that model since it was introduced.

The model is based on the Hi input of a 1981 50W Master Volume "2204" Plexi.

There were two versions of the 2204. One was essentially a Plexi with a Master Volume. Similar to a 1987x but with some different values and voltages in addition to the MV. The other was virtually identical to a JCM800. The model is the Plexi version.
 
FractalAudio said:
There haven't been any changes to that model since it was introduced.

The model is based on the Hi input of a 1981 50W Master Volume "2204" Plexi.

There were two versions of the 2204. One was essentially a Plexi with a Master Volume. Similar to a 1987x but with some different values and voltages in addition to the MV. The other was virtually identical to a JCM800. The model is the Plexi version.
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Got ya! Thanks for chiming in! I must have remembered it differently or confused it with another amp model. This one seems a little more on the bassy and less gainy side.
 
FractalAudio said:
There haven't been any changes to that model since it was introduced.

The model is based on the Hi input of a 1981 50W Master Volume "2204" Plexi.

There were two versions of the 2204. One was essentially a Plexi with a Master Volume. Similar to a 1987x but with some different values and voltages in addition to the MV. The other was virtually identical to a JCM800. The model is the Plexi version.
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Thanks! I heard a big difference in the model from Ares to Cygnus, but could be my imagination.

The '76 2204 didn't have the cascaded gain stages (which is unlike the 2203), but by '81 they would have been cascaded like the JCM versions. At least of the ones that I've owned (two JMPs and two JCMs).
 
cardinal said:
Thanks! I heard a big difference in the model from Ares to Cygnus, but could be my imagination.

The '76 2204 didn't have the cascaded gain stages (which is unlike the 2203), but by '81 they would have been cascaded like the JCM versions. At least of the ones that I've owned (two JMPs and two JCMs).
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Mine is an '81 and doesn't have cascaded gain stages.
 
FWIW this is the actual amp used for the model:

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It's a 1981 "CSA" 2204.
 
FusionFanatic said:
I really like this model. Lower the bass a bit, turn the mid and treble up a bit, drive about 7. Try different cabs. I personally like Greenbacks with a Marshall.
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That's roughly wear I arrived at while messing with it this afternoon. The tones with the volume rolled
back on the guitar using a neck pickup selection are Ahhhhhh-mazing! :)
 
FusionFanatic said:
I really like this model. Lower the bass a bit, turn the mid and treble up a bit, drive about 7. Try different cabs. I personally like Greenbacks with a Marshall.
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How do you find the gain on it? It seems like there isn't much to me, and if you turn it all the way up, it almost sounds like a fuzz pedal. Is that the characteristic of this amp in your experience?
 
That version of the 2204 does not have a ton of gain. The later JCM 800 style version of the 2204 has the two input channels running in series with the preamp volume between them so there's a lot more gain on tap when plugged into the high sensitivity input. This older version of the 2204 has the input channels in parallel instead, so when plugged into the high sensitivity input, you're only getting one input gain stage. It's a tamer beast compared to the JCM 800 version for sure and less bright.
 
Thenewexhibit said:
How do you find the gain on it? It seems like there isn't much to me, and if you turn it all the way up, it almost sounds like a fuzz pedal. Is that the characteristic of this amp in your experience?
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I have the gain ‘drive’ on about 7.5... leave the master alone. Also, what mr_fender said. Personally, I never ‘dime’ (crank the drive on anything. YMMV.
I get a nice Plexi tone out of it.
If I want, say a ‘hell beast’ sound (lol) from a Marshall (which I also dialed in) I use the JMV orange channel... drive a bit below 5, with factory 2 cab 1022 (greenbacks) To get more of a Marshall/Boogie... try factory 2, cab 1013 maybe. I’m also running it thru the Atomic CLR’s as my FRFR.
 
Yeah when the gain/volume is dimed, the treble bypass or bright cap is basically shorted out of the circuit so you can lose some of the brightness and detail you get a lower gain/volume settings. Sometimes it's better to leave the gain/volume set a little lower than full up and use a boost out front instead.
 
This is all great information! Thank you all for this! I think for these kind of rock type tones, I might like more of the brighter plexi style amps; I assume those are the more Treble style amps and not the Bass style ones.
 
In engage the 'input boost' on any of the old Marshall amps. I use 'FAS Boost', set the gain low. It tightens it up and adds a little more sponge.
LOVE the FAS Boost on the Marshalls.
 
TheElabortateDream said:
@FractalAudio any chance of a 2203 JMP 100w version coming?
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Shouldn't really be needed, as they are essentially identical pre-amps all the way to the phase inverter. The big difference is that the 2203 has 4 output valves and a big chunk of iron in the output transformer. You should be able to get pretty close to a 2203 "feel" by playing with transformer matching and impedance curve.

I have an Axe FX III, and I also have a 1980 JMP 2203 and a 1979 1960A 4 x 12. So I guess what I really ought to do some time is to see if I can tweak the Fractal 2204 model to behave exactly like my favourite old Marshall. I have some time booked off work over Christmas, so I'll try to make a project of it.

Liam
 
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