Pick attack on cleans

I've tried to explain it he best I could.
I also stated that it doesn't really come through on mic'd recordings.
But thanks.
 
I've tried to explain it he best I could.
I also stated that it doesn't really come through on mic'd recordings.
But thanks.
If no one really understands what you're alluding to and you can't find any audio recordings that impart at least some modicum of the character you're referring to(though I understand it's more kinesthetic than audible), I suppose it's kind of a dead issue.
 
Last edited:
The point was in trying to find out if anybody else here is hearing/feeling the same thing.
So far, it looks like it's just me.

I guess it partially IS an "amp in the room" thing because I only really notice it when playing tube amps through real cabs.
But I was A/B'ing the Axe and the DRRI through the same cab(s).
DRRI into its own cab or one of my EV cabs.
The "pop" is there.
Axe into the GT1000 and into my EVs or the DRRI's cab (with a Jensen C12K).
The "pop" isn't there.
So it may have something to do with the lack of any real impedance back and forth between the GT1000 and the EVs (or the Jensen).
Or it might be something else.
Or, admittedly, it might just be psychological on my part.
No big deal.
Just wanted to know if anybody else felt the same way.

Also wondering if the III is any more accurate in this regard, assuming that the modeling in the II is less than optimal which remains to be seen.
Again, I love my tones as they are now.
 
In the preamp section, there is a "Pick" control, and "Dynamics". Also think about increasing MV (but not to the point of distortion) to increase the impact of SAG.
 
So it may have something to do with the lack of any real impedance back and forth between the GT1000 and the EVs (or the Jensen).
If this is the culprit, you should be able to dial it in using speaker resonance parameters.

Or might be a bunch of other things. Wonder what this "pop" might be, interesting. How loud are you playing?
 
Various levels.
But this is more noticeable at low levels.

Also... I've messed with all the Spkr Pg parameters to no avail.

Again, in my experience, most of the Advanced parameters seem to affect the characteristics of the hi-gain tones more than cleans.
 
Joe, I'm guessing that what I'm referring to as percussive "pop" in the attack of the notes in the little vid I linked to, is NOT what you're referring to?
 
Note to any Admin reading this.
This thread is going nowhere and will probably blow up into some sort of argument if allowed to continue.
Please delete.
I've learned what I needed to.
Thanks.
 
It seems to be going well *shrug*

Some things about audio are just tough to put into words. Yeah maybe you just miss a real cab? Hard to say.
 
Various levels.
But this is more noticeable at low levels.

Also... I've messed with all the Spkr Pg parameters to no avail.

Again, in my experience, most of the Advanced parameters seem to affect the characteristics of the hi-gain tones more than cleans.
Sorry @joegold, just find it interesting is all. You're obviously a long time user and certainly seem to know what you're doing, and hearing something that not many seem to hear. Hopefully it doesn't devolve into some sort of an argument.

A lot of the Advanced parameters dial in non-linear amp behavior, so it would make sense that they affect the cleans less so.

BTW, listening to your music via your sig, fantastic stuff!
 
The absolute best way to demonstrate this would be posting two recordings, where one recording represents the “real” amp through an IR, and the 2nd one is the amp model through the same IR. This could demonstrate the (alleged) difference in the attack. Not arguing here. You might be right. Personally I don’t experience any issues in this area.

Maybe.
But I don't have the DRRI anymore.
It was a rental.
And the thing I'm talking about doesn't seem to survive the mic'ing process let alone mimicking the mic'ing process with an IR.
So I'm not sure what this would really prove.
But if I still had the amp I'd definitely try it.
You never know till you try.
I suppose I could still try it with my Simul-Satellite though.
Not sure how to do it properly though.
I don't have a reactive load box or a separation room.
[Well I kinda do. It's a ancient Groove Tubes Speaker Emulator/Load Box and I believe it's supposed to be reactive.
But it hasn't been plugged in for decades and I'm afraid it'll blow up or blow up my amp.
I've also got an old Tom Scholtz Power Soak but it's not a reactive load.]
And then I'd have to pick an amp model in the Axe that's remotely similar to the Simul-Sat, and I don't think there's anything like that in there.
At any rate... I'm probably not going to do this, yek, because it'll just take too long and probably won't accomplish all that much.
But if I do, I'll let you know the results.
Thanks for the suggestion.

[I've done other experiments though comparing a mic'd signal I used to obtain an IR of my own speakers with the Cab Block signal using that IR, and I can hear no discernible differences.
So I'm quite convinced in the power of IRs to capture and fully reproduce a mic'd guitar cabinet.
I realize that that's a whole different issue and it's not why you suggested doing this.
Just wanted to say that I have no qualms using IRs to reproduce a mic'd cabinet.]
 
OK. Here's a clip of my friend Rob Piltch playing on a standard.
His solo starts around the 3:30 mark.


I can hear what I'm talking about in his tone, but again, I know what I'm listening for.
And again, this is a mic'd tone and in my experience this thing I'm talking about rarely survives the mic'ing process.

Rob is deeply into tube amps and I often find that there's *too much* of this "pop" happening in his electric jazz recordings, especially when he goes for such a dark tone like he's getting here.

But if you listen to that whole album you might begin get a sense of what I'm talking about from Rob's playing.
Dave Young - Fables And Dreams.
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=dave+young+phil+dwyer+fables+and+dreams
 
It seems to be going well *shrug*

Some things about audio are just tough to put into words. Yeah maybe you just miss a real cab? Hard to say.

I don't miss real cabs.
I use real cabs.
FRFR is just occasional for me.
 
I just remembered that one of the main reasons why I used to use a Bryston 2B LP Pro vs my Matrix GT1000 was that I thought the Bryston did a better job of imparting this "pop" I'm talking about when I am using my cabs and playing with a hyper clean tone.
I used to describe it as that the illusion of playing through a real tube amp was stronger with the 2B than the GT.

I abandoned the 2B mostly for form factor reasons and have been using the GT1000 exclusively for about a year now.
But while I found the 2B to be more satisfying to play through with clean tones, I also found that the GT sounds better to me for overdriven tones.
I'll have to crack a 2B open again and see what I'm hearing.
 
that pop is the fundamental of the note the guitar is playing, it's all mid range. need more mids. it sounds poppy because it's the meat and potatoes of what the string is giving the pickup, getting pushed out of the speaker without much being done to it. calculate the note center you're playing in Hz, then boost that freq with a wide Q till it gets to poppin. If you're playing on a clean amp you can boost it into the front of the amp and the amp will smooth it out really nicely.

depending on the amp you can just lower the bass knob and increase the mid knob, lower the treble knob, and the amp will do it for you. it sounds poppy because it's clean energy, pickup DI note fundamental, amplified without too much adulteration.
 
Last edited:
it doesn't survive recording well because the mic positioning does so much filtering depending on where you put the mic, unless you're looking for that 'pop' and you know what you're looking for, the mic positioning comb filtering will most likely miss it, gut it completely. You can hear the note the guitar is playing from the overtones you get, but that fundamental 'pop' lives in a specific place between speaker and back wall, sometimes in more than one spot in varying degrees of clarity. Using an IR, you're stuck with the mic positioning used when the IR was shot, just have to scroll scroll scroll till you find one that highlights the freq you need, otherwise if you try to boost freqs that aren't there it just makes a mess.
 
Back
Top Bottom