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Discussion in 'Axe-Fx II User Cabs and IRs' started by dtpancio, Dec 14, 2016.
Yeah. One sounds like dark muddy garbage.
My opinion. Cab Pack 7 ( (in particular SM57-MD421 #1) is very good for the early Petrucci's sounds but the guitar sound of his latest albums is more dark than any Mikko's IR and any EQ settings will not help to make the same sound.
let me go deep on your constructive comment with some yes no questions:
1. do you like the reference sound?
2. is it your favourite of the three?
3. do you think the one with petrucci v30 mix, aside from being dark muddy garbage, is farer from the reference sound? so the one with mikko's is closer?
I much prefer your second sample to the first. The first sample is obviously using the Petrucci V30 IR. The second is more balanced than the first but could still use work. We disagree that the Petrucci V30 IR is a well balanced IR. It is not. It would not be considered a very dark and muddy IR if it were balanced which even you agreed to earlier in this thread.
The tones in cab pack 7 are aimed at attaining tones from Dream Theater albums recorded in professional studios (which they do better than any other impulses I've ever tried). I am not a fan of the tone from the video, but the audio of the video may very well have been recorded from the cameras mic which is obviously not ideal.
We just gave you the keys to the car. CK USA TRAD SM57-MD421 01 If you refuse to drive it, that's up to you. But the answer to your question does not reside with any of the existing stock impulses in the Axe. If it did, you would have found it by now. If that's not the answer you're looking for, I'm sorry. If you're happy with the Petrucci V30 IR, then just use that one. The video I even posted states that the CK USA TRAD SM57-MD421 01 is not only one of the best impulses in cab pack 7, it is one of Mikko's best impulses ever and is one of the best impulses you can use for any circumstance. In my opinion, it is the best impulse I've ever used.
I've been chasing Petrucci tone ever since Images and Words. I've been doing this for a while. Cab pack 7 is where it's at for that task hands down. Btw... I also own a Boogie MKV and Mesa Cabs, and I prefer my Axe FX Boogie tones with cab pack 7 more than the real thing.
Cab pack 7 also has a large number of impulses with many different mics positioned all over the speaker which you can load up together into the axe and blend with a stereo cab or blend many impulses together with cab lab. There are endless possibilities using these tools together to nail the exact tone you're after. Just go and get them and go to work in tone bliss.
I don't want to post this, because I don't like engaging in these kinds of debates, just as well this particular tone chase I am not in favor of (I haven't been able to listen to the last few DT albums because the guitar tones hurt my ears so badly, and only the Suspended Animation record have I found JP's tones to be "good"), but here goes...
Objectively - as subjectively my opinions vary wildly from those in this thread as mentioned above - the most similar in sound, feel, and frequency response to FC108 are the V70 captures in the OH 412 MES-TR (single cabinet libraries section on the OH website), specifically, the OH1F and SP mixes in the latter half of the sweet spot sweep, the 7-10 position range being closest. I could post frequency response graphs and deviation plots to prove it, though I won't because I don't see that as anywhere near appropriate. These files will also be the most gear accurate as well, given the age and manufacturing period of the speakers compared to all other options.
All aftermarket products mentioned in this thread are great tools, and variety is the spice of life; all these flavors will have their proponents and preferences.
Hope that helps!
What is FC108 ?
I've always been a huge fan of Petrucci's guitar sound and it has definitely had a huge impact on me. However like many have said in this thread I don't think the latest tones have been his best tones. I do understand that fans of the latest albums are interested in achieving that tone but my humble opinion is that a dark guitar sound like that will cause the whole mix to lose its balance. Just listen to ALL INSTRUMENTS in these examples. Here's IMO one of Petrucci's best guitar tones:
You can hear everything clearly. Bass, kick, snare, overheads, leads and rhythm guitars have good separation and not only that.. everything sounds really "cool" and aggressive.
In comparison let's talk about the sound of "Astonishing":
That's one of the more energetic songs of that album. If we just start with comparing how well you hear the guitar there's an obvious difference but it's intentionally a very different sound that they're going for. The mix itself is very distant meaning the opposite of in your face. Lots of reverb (almost as much as in the 80s). It's easy to listen to but it's not as aggressive or cool sounding in my opinion. It sounds lush and beautiful but it doesn't give me stank face which is the only real way to determine whether a person likes a sound or not.
While a darker guitar sound can sound massive on it's own no one will ever hear that sound on it's own. It's all about how instruments gel together in a mix and for that use case I would not advice people to use IR's this dark. Even Petrucci's brightest guitar tones are nowhere near a bee sting in your ear.
I'm just trying to not waste my money..I like Mikko's IRs, as I said I use the F073 and F074 for a while right now and I'm willing to buy the Cab Pack only if it has different types of sounds that match a little bit more the Petrucci V30 Mix, in any other case I remain with the stock cabs. And now that OwnHammer showed up I can say that obviously I took a look at his IRs too, which are equally well captured and the cost half the price (no complaint here, just a practical fact).
In my country they say "the world is beautiful because it's various" I really enjoyed the Petrucci's tone in the last two albums, on the records and live.
In the last week I tried the free demo 412-MES-ST_V60 which I know it doesn't refer to the Traditional Cab but it's what you offered for free, so I tried that! And my conclusions are that the most similar are the OH2Fs in the farest positions from the corner, but I enjoyed the OH1F and SP mixes too.
I sent a couple of mail from the website form about the OH 412 MES-TR and I wait for an answer!
Factory Cab Petrucci V30 Mix
I like CP7 from Mikko because I like bright tone for my rhythm sound. But I prefer more dark sound for my lead and so I have to try OH MES-TR 70W.
Petrucсi uses SM57+KSM in your latest sounds. From the whole Mikko's mixes with SM57-R121 number 5 is the darkest IR
Mikko... We think alike. Couldn't agree more with your comments. 100% on point.
I ended up using them both
The latest JP tones are way too dark. I agree that the best JP tones are in Suspended Animation and those were kinda our reference tones when shooting CP7. Actually those tones are the reason I bought the Mesa Traditional cab.
The sm57-r121 mixes in CP7, r121 is pretty close to the center of the speaker because otherwise the mix would've been way too dark. We tried not to shoot useless IRs back then but obviously the not-so-good 57-121 mixes are now the latest Petrucci tones hahaha.
I'm sure many JP fans would like to have that dark tone just because. It would be super easy to shoot with 57 and 121, just move the r121 away from the center and find the right phase and that's it. I still have the cab in my studio so maybe some day we could shoot some dark 57-121 IRs just to nail that JP tone for fun. They might be great for jamming alone but in the mix, probably not.
Look at my homie @Irotlas joining the conversation!!!! This dude owns the cab we used for Cab Pack 7.
By the way... I'm glad to announce that I have now gone through Cab Pack 7 again (for the 4th time already) and the presets and updated them to work with the newest firmware and also AX8 versions of the presets are a part of the cabinet. They're getting a quick beta test run and they "should" be up for re-download through the Fractal store next week. Excited!!
I bought your library a couple of month ago and when I started trying the V60s I found myself a little upset because they were not even close with che FC108, even with the 9-10 positions. I think I lost the "V70" information you gave me at the time because I just tried the V70 SP2 in 5 position and man you're right! V70 sounds very similar!
Now I have a place to start for a similar midrangey sound, just less dark than the FC108. Thanks!
Hello everyone and thanks for your kind suggestion on how to get the Petrucci tone.
I see no one has spoken about the Shure KSM 313 yet, which is a very expensive microphone he's using in his latest recordings.
Should we get one Mikko to have some new IR with that mic in it?
Found a picture of the 2016 tour