PC Audio Interface: a li'l help

swass

Power User
With all that is on the market these days it's hard to sift through everything. I'm looking to buy an audio interface, (USB) for my PC. I was thinking of going to a Mac with an Apogee Duet II but that seems to be out of the question for now due to financial duress. So a little guidance from my forum brothers would be muchly appreciated. People are raving about the Duet II and from what I've heard myself... well anyways,... something in the same quality line that isn't going to kill me financially. I'm running Windows 7. Thanks people.

Peace,
 
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Budget?
PCI(e), USB, Firewire preference? Portability a concern? Use with multiple systems?
I/O numbers required? Desired?
Extra features required? Such as.. mic pre, headphone, etc?
Are you using Pro Tools, and if so, version? (PT is among the few that require their own hardware (PT8 and earlier), and do not work well with some models/brands (PT9 and up) )
 
As Niki asked-Your budget is needed. RME has a great little USB interface-superior latency stats, but it is $700.+ That's why we need your budget. He did say USB
 
Gotcha, missed the (USB). MIDI required? Other facilities?
True shame you did not include firewire... the Echo stuff is great in the ~$500 range.
M-Audio can be decent enough. Prosonus as well, though I have seen people report latency issues. RME is good stuff, but the price will be higher. Focusrite is another consideration. Once we get budget, needs, etc, it will be easier to slim down a list.

True shame on firewire... Echo would have been the single answer from me in the ~$500 range...
 
What will you be recording? If your planning on recording a whole band and are familiar with setting up a Digital audio Workstation then I would suggest Steinberg MR816 ($550) or focusrite saffire pro 40 ($400). These are firewire interface though.

If your only recording guitar and then want to use ezdrummer or addictive drums then the focusrite has smaller usb versions of the saffire with the same quality of conversion. If your using an axefx the conversion in the interface doesnt matter as much since your signal will already be digital via s/pdif. Unless of course you dont want to be stuck with 48k.

Please give more details in what you want out of the interface.
 
Stay away from maudio Profire series. They have a sample accuracy bug that not many know about.

Profire 610 serious recording bug. Not accurate

My choice with firewire would be as mentioned Steinberg MR816. This interface gets all great reviews for conversion quality and pres. Many say it is on par with RME fireface.

USB --Eleven Rack (with extra guitar bonus) or one of the Saffire usb models.

Mac -- Apogee Duet most likely or any of the others mentioned.
 
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Sorry for the neglect of info. My brain has been in scramble mode... just in the middle of selling my HD24XR to finance this... maybe I'll have to go back to the "Pop Tart thread" now to calm myself, relax and focus... :p ... there ... all better :D

I'm using Reaper currently but once I get past the learning curve I'll be looking to switch DAW's. I'll definitely will need midi. Great pre's and converters. Definitely headphones. Also 4x4 i/o ought to do. I'll be using SD2 so no need for anything more than that. I'd probably feel comfortable around the $600.00 range. Same as the Duet II.

What are pro's/cons with firewire/USB. USB just strikes me to be easier. Thanks for your replies. I'm dumping alot of gear to trim down for a home recording setup that will produce excellent results.

Thanks. Peace,
 
IMO, firewire is a "sturdier" *format* for audio/video production. Once again, IMO.
If firewire is a viable option, I will once again state but one option: Echo. In your case, for portability, the Audiofire 4 (~$250). Racked, but still able to be totted about (small rack, perhaps with your Axe? :D ), Audiofire 8 (~$500).
 
I will have to disagree with the echo. I have heard they have good conversion but have never heard anything special about the preamps.

If you need good preamps what will you be recording with them vocals?

You are correct in thinking USB is easier than firewire. Some get lucky with just hooking up their interface with the stock firewire that comes with your computer but its not the norm. Most folks choose to upgrade to a Texas instruments based chipset firewire card. There are lots of reasons why but just do a search and you should get plenty of stuff to read on it. Then there is the driver issues........

Not trying to scare you off of firewire because thats the way I would go if recording over 4 tracks at a time. It is also not a bad idea to get a interface with 8 pres in case you venture further into recording. In the case of wanting a interface to record vocals I would go with focusrite saffire 56 with liquid channel tech. look it up!

If you are not getting super serious USB is a great way to go. The only time I would be worried is if your recording 8+ tracks at one time and even then USB2 is fast enough.

If you want to stick to USB I would go with a two channel focusrite saffire pro...or scarlett .......run the axefx into the spdif connectors and then u would still have 2channels to record vocals, bass, or other instrument.

The reason I choose these over the echo is for one focusrite has been around forever and they make highend pres so they know how to design a preamp.
 
If you are good with a computer and setting it up to run as a DAW then Steinberg MR816. If I had to choose an interface with onboard pres and was not able to use my API mic pres it would be the Steinberg fo sho!!!!
 
I had a RME Fireface 800 that was stolen (borrowed :)) so i picked up the RME fireface UFX at his cost since he was so busy using the 800. Now I have both as he finally returned it. Ill be putting up the 800 for sale soon fairly cheap but not in your range sadly. I only mention this because when I built my DAW PC I had to make sure I had the Texas Instruments firewire chipset on the motherboard. There is a lot of discussion on the net about the problems arising without it. If not on the motherboard then a card will be needed to add it to your PC if you choose to go firewire.

For what it's worth, the UFX can run both firewire and USB. I have found the USB side to be a little more stable on that unit. I had no issues at all with the firewire 800.
 
I own an MR816, and would recommend it. I recommended the Echo (not the Pro, so no preamps), as the OP had not specified if preamps were desired or not. With the MR816, there is no way to *properly* defeat the preamps (Chan 1/2 insert, preamp gain at -min- are not *proper*.. IMO...). Otherwise, the MR are amazing units. Yamaha converters and preamps, plus Yamaha algo's for the onboard bits. I have seen some people have install issues, but I have not ever spoken to anyone with problems. I chose my MR over the comparable RME unit(s).

As for firewire, my bad for not qualifying that with "Must have a TI chip firewire."

As far as USB vs Firewire.. as stated, if 4 I/O max is all one is doing, should be okay.. so long as the dev codes up good drivers. There are far too many horrible drivers out there IMO.
 
Sorry for the neglect of info. My brain has been in scramble mode... just in the middle of selling my HD24XR to finance this... maybe I'll have to go back to the "Pop Tart thread" now to calm myself, relax and focus... :p ... there ... all better :D

I'm using Reaper currently but once I get past the learning curve I'll be looking to switch DAW's. I'll definitely will need midi. Great pre's and converters. Definitely headphones. Also 4x4 i/o ought to do. I'll be using SD2 so no need for anything more than that. I'd probably feel comfortable around the $600.00 range. Same as the Duet II.

What are pro's/cons with firewire/USB. USB just strikes me to be easier. Thanks for your replies. I'm dumping alot of gear to trim down for a home recording setup that will produce excellent results.

Thanks. Peace,

" I'll definitely will need midi. Great pre's and converters."
 
I own an MR816, and would recommend it. I recommended the Echo (not the Pro, so no preamps), as the OP had not specified if preamps were desired or not. With the MR816, there is no way to *properly* defeat the preamps (Chan 1/2 insert, preamp gain at -min- are not *proper*.. IMO...). Otherwise, the MR are amazing units. Yamaha converters and preamps, plus Yamaha algo's for the onboard bits. I have seen some people have install issues, but I have not ever spoken to anyone with problems. I chose my MR over the comparable RME unit(s).

As for firewire, my bad for not qualifying that with "Must have a TI chip firewire."

As far as USB vs Firewire.. as stated, if 4 I/O max is all one is doing, should be okay.. so long as the dev codes up good drivers. There are far too many horrible drivers out there IMO.

Right..... I wouldnt recommend the steinberg to anyone that was not kind of tech geeky..lol
 
Thanks guys... and Nikki, (only centered you out 'cause you're not a guy) for weighing in. At least I now know who are the reputable heavy hitters. That in itself helps a lot in sifting through what will best suit me. I'll probably wind up ponying up extra to get the best quality and bang for the buck. However I do think I'll be sticking to the USB approach. Seems to me that is the direction of things to come.

Peace,
 
Thanks guys... and Nikki, (only centered you out 'cause you're not a guy) for weighing in. At least I now know who are the reputable heavy hitters. That in itself helps a lot in sifting through what will best suit me. I'll probably wind up ponying up extra to get the best quality and bang for the buck. However I do think I'll be sticking to the USB approach. Seems to me that is the direction of things to come.

Peace,

Everyone is goin to have their "favorite" and most all devices will have some "bad stories" associated. The little rme babyface is a nice USB device, but pricey $700? Maudio and Roland make some good mid priced ($400?) USB-Roland has the octa capture-8 i\o and m audio has the Ultra pro(name is wrong) that has 8 i\o. Both have low latency.
Good luck in your quest
 
Hi there
I thought I'd add my own take. I've spent several months looking around at getting a decent audio interface, seeing whats available and how to go about picking the right one for myself. I have no personal experience, everything I've learnt so far has come from reading and discussion.

I'll use it for recording, re-amping and using a DAW for: Mobius looper; VST effects in the Axe's FX loop; MIDI synched sequenced backing; and sometimes to play live VSTi synth routing it through the Axe effects.

This means round trip latency is a big consideration. I'd like it rack mounted. Firewire. Minimum of 8 in 8 out analog, at least one of which is instrument input (preferably more), at least 2 mic pres ins, all balanced outs. ASIO compliant (ruling out Lexicon). SPDIF (not ART, Mackie Onyx nor MoTU 8Pre) and at least one MIDI 1x1 would be preferable. As would ADAT and Word Clock. Plus the ablity to work stand-alone, (which rules out Focusrite).

Apparently all USB audio interfaces use double buffering, with only a few (USB AIs) managing a reasonable level from RME and M-Audio only. Many Firewire AIs appear to have lower latency, so I'll stick with that and use a dedicated TI chipset port.

Turns out this is a tall order for someone on a budget. I started with a list of most of the products of reputable brands that fit most of my requirements. Then went looking around the net to find out as much as I could, reviews, manuals, forums, etc. The more I learn about audio latency, audio sync, round trip latency, along with many issues so many products out there have, the list has become very short.

Just before I read this thread, I was seriously considering the M-Audio Profire 2626. Thank you so much for pointing to that thread, yet another bullet I've dodged! It's something I've been experiencing quite a bit.

A recent example is the Echo Audiofire Pre8 which looked so good, in theory. The reviews were great, great sound quality for a reasonable price. It has most of the features I want. But sadly I discovered its round trip latency is not good at all as it uses a lot of buffering which doesn't stack up well against other products. I think if someone as only going to use the Audio Interface for recording, possibly using latency compensated backing for takes, it'd be really good. Also if you're going to use your computer all the time with the audio interface, the Focusrite Pro series seem good too. Sound on Sound have reviews on both. I have no experience, I'm just voicing what I've read and collated. Other brands that had products that fit my requirements I've looked into are: Alesis, Apogee, Art, Cakewalk, Mackie, MoTU, Lexicon, Presonus, Steinberg, TC Electronic.

With M-Audio Profire off the list, right now RME Fireface 800 is the last remaining contender on my list. I never considered spending that much money on an AI but now I can understand why its worth it. The Axe FX is a great sounding machine and I want to make the most of it. But if I'm going to sink that sort of money, I want to make sure it'll deliver and keep delivering for years to come.... like the Axe.

Firewire AI's on the whole have less latency than USB AIs, but you can't beat a decent sound card that slots into the machine. Because of this I'm now re-considering a rack PC with good audio PCI or PCIe audio card. However rack mounted PCs bring a whole bunch of other costs and headaches I'm learning about and want to sort out before I even consider which audio card.

I've learnt quite a bit from Vin/TAF KAT's posts recently. He resides on a few forums and appears to be heading a project to set a standard bench mark for on DAW/audio interface audio latency and get as much information as possible. Here's a recent thread with what he's measured to date:
Audio Interface - Low Latency Performance Data Base : - Gearslutz.com

I've found many DAW and audio related Forums are a great resources, but it's been very time consuming filtering through the vast amount of material.

Also solid MIDI sync is a high priority to me too; I use a Gordius midi controller as master midi clock. I'm also on the hunt for a decent Firewire multi-port MIDI interface. A good solid reliable one. I've only found USB MIDI adapters or 1x1 MIDI on an audio interface. There are many issues with MIDI jitter and latency which I want to mitigate as much as possible.
Finally I've found this site informative on the topic of synchronising MIDI hardware
Innerclock Systems - Precision Midi Clock Din Sync and Tempo Synchronisation Solutions
Some really interesting content.

I'm relying only on what I've read and discussions I've had, so I'm keen to hear from others who have experience. I just want to do my homework first and get it right first time around, I'm trying to avoid learning the hard way. :D

Cheers,
G.
 
Go with the RME babyface. Personal experience with the hammerfall chipset and RME products in general -- they have great mixing software (live mix routings galore!) and generally (former fireface 800 owner) great headphone preamps.

RME: Babyface

Just don't fall into the "192khz" sampling rate. What a crock. 88.2/96khz will do ya just fine (if you even need that high! we all know 48khz does us just fine eh? =P)
 
@ GfromHarpOn... great thread you linked. Very informative. A lot of effort and diligent work by Vin/TAF KAT. My RME's still stand up pretty well. :D
 
Yes... Thanks you GfromHarpOn.

I have been gravitating toward the RME Babyface and a little towards the Focusrite Sapphire Pro/ Scarlett stuff. It seems these little AI have more than enough of what I need... for now. I know these things all way around have great pres and converters from what I've been reading here and elsewhere. That is very important without really saying but do have to quibble now somewhat with the latency factors, options that suit (mainly i/o's), and a little on the ballpark price.

Also taking sound bites with grains of salt due to the host of variables that deplete or can deplete audio quality online to back here on my PC I'm not toooo concerned about. I trust my ears to catch the just. Not only do I practice this with any audio but also by what people here say and in other forums/reviews. Picking gnat shit outta pepper can be tough at times. Particularly when you have not owned any of these products prior. Then again I was in that boat when I bought the Ultra and the II. No regrets whatsoever. Just have to take my time, scope... then CONQUER!!.:D

Peace,
 
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