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Need Help using Axe III through EFX Loop of Mesa TC-100 (the problem is with the Axe III, not the amp)

DFauvre

Inspired
I want to use the Axe III through the EFX Loop of a new Mesa Boogie TC-100 head.

1. I'm getting normal guitar volume, etc., through the amp when when the EFX Loop is turned OFF
using the Mesa Boogie TC-100 foot controller FX button to turn the EFX loop on the TC-100 on and off.

2. When I turn on the EFX Loop with foot controller or from the back of the TC-100, there is NO guitar volume at all.
If I turn off the EFX Loop on the TC-100, , the guitar volume is normal.

3. I've doubled checked that the cables are correctly going out of the Send on the TC-100 EFX Loop to Input 3 L on the Axe III and out of Output 3 L on the Axe III, to the EFX return on the TC-100. Per the manual, I've set input of Channel 3 on the Axe III to Left ONLY.

4. If I pull the cables out of the Axe III, and plug them into a pedal flanger, the EFX Loop on the TC-100 foot controller works fine.
So the problem is a setting in the Axe III

I've read the instructions 10x. No idea why there is no guitar signal at all when I turn not the EFX Loop on the TC-100 with the Axe III in the loop for effects only.

I've isolated the problem to a setting on Axe III. The problem is NOT the TC-100, as I said, the EFX loop works fine with pedals.

Please advise ASAP!

Thank you!
David
 

MicroMort

Inspired
did you turn up the outputs on the front of the AF3 ? I've had that a few times where I forgot to turn up the output vol on Out 2 or Out 3 of my FX loops.
 

MicroMort

Inspired
sorry to double post but just to clarify I am talking about the physical knobs on the front... not the output or levels within axeEdit or whatever you're using.
 

jlynnb1

Axe-Master
also, are you trying to go 4 cable method or post and pre fx or just post fx in the loop? Page 29 of the manual covers how to do it post only, which sounds like what you are after.
 

DFauvre

Inspired
did you turn up the outputs on the front of the AF3 ? I've had that a few times where I forgot to turn up the output vol on Out 2 or Out 3 of my FX loops.
Yes, the physical knobs for output on the front of the Axe are all straight up so they should have output.

Yes, I read the manual on how to set up the Axe III for use in an EFX loop, see above.

As to if the loop is 'serial or parallel' I don't know what that means. Can you explain?

Not sure what you mean by '4 cable method'. There is a cable from the guitar to he amp head input, and two cables being used the for EFX Loop Send and Returns on the TC-100 to the Axe III.

I've followed the instructions on page 29. I'm somewhat new to using an EFX Loop on a real amp. What do you recommend I do in regards to 'pre and post'?

I appreciate that above, however, none of it resolves the issue. As to posting the preset, I will do that in the next comment, however, there is nothing in the Fractal manual that I could find that mentions any settings in the preset itself. I created a new one with an input, output, shunts between them and put in a flanger, chorus, and delay.
 

DFauvre

Inspired
As requested, attached is the preset I created for use with the EFX Loop on the TC-100 amp head.

I've tried both with each effect block instantiated and bypassing each one, makes no difference, if the EFX Loop on the TC-100 is turned on, there is NO volume at all coming out of the amp. If I turn OFF the EFX Loop, the amp volume is normal again.

I've isolated the problem to the Axe III.

Again, if I unplug the cables from the TC-100 EFX Loop send and return, that were plugged into the Axe III, per the manual, and use the same cables with a real pedal flanger, the EFX Loop on the TC-100 works fine.

1. Would greatly appreciate any suggestions on why this is not working.

2. Would also greatly appreciate any tips and tricks on using effects blocks in the Axe III when using the Axe III in an EFX Loop with a real amp. For example, any preferred settings, effects blocks, etc.

Thanks!
 

Attachments

  • Mesa TC-100 Rock Effects.syx
    48.2 KB · Views: 2

Paulg2uk

Power User
If you want to for example put wah, drives etc in front of the amp before the preamp and then your modulation effects like chorus, delay etc after the preamp so in your FX Loop you'll need to use the 4 cable method that would be p27 of the manual. P29 refers to just putting the axe in the front end of your amp not the FX loop.

Screenshot 2020-05-30 at 17.31.32.png
 
Last edited:

Bakerman

Axe-Master
Your preset has an Input 1 and Output 1 block. Change those to Input 3 and Output 3 blocks if your amp's loop is connected to Input 3 & Output 3 as stated above.
 

DFauvre

Inspired
Wow that was easy, and it obviously never occurred to me that for example Input block 1, is for input 1...I thought they were labeled with different numbers to tell them apart like the other blocks, for example, Reverb 1,2,3 etc. So thank you!

When I turn on the EFX Loop on the TC-100, it works now through Axe III.

However, there's a HUGE drop in volume.

Why?

And what setting do I adjust so the amp volume is the same with and without the EFX Loop on or off?

Thanks again!
 

DFauvre

Inspired
There is also a big change in EQ, right now, I ONLY have the Delay block on in the preset, and it's set to Analog Mono. Why is all the high end disappearing when I turn on the EFX Loop? I tried turning up the Axe III front knob Level Out 3, that helped some with the volume drop, but did not fix the dull sounding EQ tone change when I turn not the EFX loop...ugh. Something that sounded so easy to do has turned into an all day project!
 

Brian Angiel

Inspired
I believe you’re supposed to turn volume 3 all the way up for unity gain on output 3. That could be part of the reason for the drop.
 

Bakerman

Axe-Master
Out 3 level knob at 100% should provide unity gain (same level out as in) with shunts from In 3 to Out 3 block.

The preset you posted has delay mix at 58%, which will mean you're hearing about the same or more delayed signal than dry, and the dry level will be reduced slightly. Try removing all effect blocks for now (or at least switch delay bypass mode to "thru" and bypass it) while troubleshooting the level/tone issue.

Is Input 3 level adjusted as described in the manual? (Don't set so high that it lights the In 3 meter's red LED excessively.)

Also check the In 3 block's noise gate settings. It's best to disable it for now (threshold knob fully CCW) and you probably won't want to use the noise reducer type in a post-fx scenario.
 

bdrepko

Fractal Fanatic
I would turn off all effects (drives, chorus, reverbs, etc) until you get the volume to unity gain. Once you have this then add effects one at a time checking as you go unitl you have all enabled.
 

DFauvre

Inspired
I believe you’re supposed to turn volume 3 all the way up for unity gain on output 3. That could be part of the reason for the drop.
I've turned Output knob for volume on output 3 all the way up. This helped with unity gain.

'


Today at 11:32 AM
Out 3 level knob at 100% should provide unity gain (same level out as in) with shunts from In 3 to Out 3 block.

The preset you posted has delay mix at 58%, which will mean you're hearing about the same or more delayed signal than dry, and the dry level will be reduced slightly. Try removing all effect blocks for now (or at least switch delay bypass mode to "thru" and bypass it) while troubleshooting the level/tone issue.

"Is Input 3 level adjusted as described in the manual?"
I think the only thing in the manual is to set it to 'L' for left input only, yes, it's set to this setting.

"Also check the In 3 block's noise gate settings. It's best to disable it for now (threshold knob fully CCW) and you probably won't want to use the noise reducer type in a post-fx scenario."

Will do.

Any other suggestions on why the tone is changing so much when I instantiate effects blocks?
 

DFauvre

Inspired
Just looked under Setup>I/O>Audio to get to Input for channel #3. It's set to 'LEFT ONLY' please advise on how to disable the 'noise gate settings' for input 3, not sure where this is done in the Fractal.

Last, a BIG thank you to everyone here who has taken the time to respond to help me out! I love the Fractal community!
 
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