NASA intruige and the mother of all Conspiracies?

It's hyper advanced technology! They traveled unfathomable distances using technology we can't grasp! ...to crash into a desert in nevada, or a forest in Rendlesham?? They are conducting advanced experiments on us, and we know this because we have so many experiencers waking up on the operating table even tho this is rare in modern anesthesia. They frequently describe being measured and prodded by advanced technology even tho we can study DNA with a Qtip swab. I'm not prepared to say everyone who claims an experience is lying, but boy this subject gets funnier the more you consider it.

Humans say a lot of things. Because some guy says so is no evidence, that's hearsay. That's why sexual abuse cases are so hard, it's he says/she says. Pick one that sounds the most believable. Give me evidence. Hard evidence the results of which can be replicated under critical study. You are the people who claim that aliens exist and and cattle prodding hillbillies up their bums. It's not on me to disprove a negative. You make the case, show the evidence. Don't hide behind ph, it's a scientific conspiracies. In which case again, proof it. In the justice system its not up to the criminal to disprove he is a criminal, it's up the prosecutors that he is. If you make the claim, the burden of proof is on you. It's not up to the atheist to disprove God, it's not up to the non-believer in flying saucers to disprove them.

What I do know is that human beings are beings that seek to explain things and discern patterns in everything. That's why we have big brains. This pattern discerning ability is a survival mechanism. Hmm, eating these red berries cause Nghmn and ArGjH to become sick and die. Maybe red berries bad? And when bad things happen like a member of the tribe not returning to the cave it might be best to become highly alert because either a predator or another tribe is nearby. We like to explain things, even when we are not equipped to explain them. That's why religions have creation myths. Where do we come from, why are we here, what is responsible for that. In the absence of hard science we came up with stories of great Sky Men. And women. And we see that creation myths are formed by the environment that the culture lives in. Water features prominently in the stories of cultures that don't have much of it. A culture that is martial will have a different sort of afterlife then a culture that is peaceful. In the Middle Ages there were a lot of people who witnessed being visited by angels or demons. Around 1900, when science was being pushed forward almost every day and flight became a reality people saw inventors in the skies. Now we have stories of flying saucers and big grey aliens with big eyes and as a consequence we hear and see those a lot.

The human brain is a marvelous thing and still much misunderstood. We like to think we are rational beings, but we're not. We don't make rational decisions, we make emotional decisions, then rationalize them afterwards. We say we are going to stop smoking, or quit drinking as a new years resolution, but most of us don't. We talk about things like common sense, and are then bewildered that there is so little of it. Either common sense is not as common as we like to think, or its different from everyone else. Reality may even not exist as we like to think. There are scientists who say that the world that we see is not the world as it is, but a recreation of the world by our brain. We are basically all the stars of a movie that plays in our own minds. And everyone's movie is slightly different. And some people experience glitches in their play back. I'll buy that explanation ANY time over aliens travelling the vast cosmos just to anal probe some hillbillies.

I did not say they are aliens... 😉

But these aircrafts were and are still ununderstable with our knowledge.
Please, don’t write a book on my ignorance. It’s also the ignorance of the F-16 pilots sent for interception and the ignorance of the Belgian army.
So I’m just an Ufologist (that I am not) because there are facts and witnesses of aircrafts flying that we cannot explain ? And I must rule out the extraterrestrial explanation just because I can’t explain how they could do that ? Take the problem the other way, no known aircraft can’t explain the phenomenon...if it’s not E.T then what is it and where does it come from and how does it fly ? I’d be intellectually happy to have a logical explanation and that’s because I can’t have one and because I can’t deny the reality of what happened that I’m pissed with the phenomenon.

You certainly know what Einstein thought about the quantical intrication...

To conclude, if what you can’t explain does not exist, you certainly do not believe in the existence of women. 😉

Peace

I'm Dutch so claiming the Belgian air force as a source of authority is not a plus. Half of our jokes are about Belgian intelligence. And I don't mean the spy variety of intelligence.

So, because so many people see things, therefore something exists, we can't explain it, therefore....... (drumroll) ALIENS!

Actual proof please. And if you think you can't explain women you've clearly never read Rollo Tomasi or seen a red pill website.

I saw a UFO when I was a kid. Clear as day. Big, black saucer. Flew right over my head and then shot up into the sky at a tremendous speed. I was supposed to be buying milk but got so excited I ran home to tell my mother and lost the money somewhere along the way. She was angry and I didn't understand because, damn, I just saw a flying saucer.

So she yells at me and tells me to go outside and play. I go out back and a few minutes later there are fighter jets flying around. Coincidence?

I'm not saying you didn't see a UFO. All I'm saying is that UFO =/= aliens. It's just something that cannot be explained yet. And humans have always tried to explain things that they don't understand in terms that they are familiar with. It's possible you saw what you saw. It's also possible you saw something and interpreted it as what you think you saw.

Just because our current understanding of how the universe works says that we can't go faster than the speed of light, doesn't mean that it can't be done. Remember, it was once thought that you couldn't fly faster than the speed of sound.

They broke the sound barrier within a couple of years, it was just a fairly simple engineering challenge of brute force engine power and aerodynamics. So far the speed of light speed has remained fairly unbreakable to even the smartest human minds and even approaching fractions of that speed require so much power you could power the entire Earth with it. Also equating breaking the sound barrier with the speed of light shows thinking that is heavy on having seen too much sci fi and not enough science books. There's a reason why FTL travel is a regular staple in sci fi, and one that gets pretty much glossed over. Because 'and it took them centuries to travel between the stars' doesn't make for a highly interesting weekly sci fi show, and because so far no one has come up with a working FTL method. So if you want to advance the plot of your story some handwavium is required.

Some things cannot be explained. It's simple as that. Some things have been explained, some things stand a good chance of getting explained, and some things will probably never be explained. I for one am perfectly content with that. Just as I will be perfectly content with hearing from NASA that aliens do exist and that they will be landing on the White House lawn tomorrow. Although I will still be nervous about that invasion fleet on the dark side of Jupiter. I don't think that aliens visiting us is very probable. We have seen or noticed any signs of an interstellar civilization out there. And its not like in a 100 lightyear radius around Earth they won't notice that we exist either. Our radio and TV signals are out there. If we can detect planets around stars that are hundreds, or even thousands of lightyears away we can also detect Dyson swarms and other alien mega structures that come with a Kardashev 2 or 3 civilization. All the evidence points to no intelligent life in the surrounding area. The theory of relativity holds firm. But I'll gladly be wrong when aliens do land tomorrow on the White House lawn.
 
And our jokes are about Dutch people...

Ok, my point is : Hundreds of people saw an aircraft that can’t be explained.
This aircraft did exist. It was not hallucinations. It was not mass hysteria.
I did not tell that this was alien. But I have no reason to rule out this hypothesis.

So, as you are a level above Belgian people ;-) , please, explain me what it was. A Dutch secret plane ? I have to speak with my private spy in NL ;-)

I don’t want a forum word fight with you and I don’t necessarily want you to adopt my point of view. I just want to point out that there are ununderstable aircrafts flying in our sky. And before looking for bacteria on Mars, I’d like an explanation about what was seen.

There is no reason to rule out an extraterrestrial explanation just because we can’t explain how they could be there. We can’t explain quantical intrication but we can observe it. Does it mean that it does not exist ?

Sorry guy, an open mind to what is not explained is what makes science to move forward.
If you just stick with what science believes to actually know, you’re just bogged.

Are you working in a scientific domain ?
 
So far the speed of light speed has remained fairly unbreakable to even the smartest human minds and even approaching fractions of that speed require so much power you could power the entire Earth with it.
We know there are particles such as neutrinos that can surpass the speed of light. The speed of light barrier is a barrier for objects that have mass... at least to our current understanding and mathematics.

Travelling vast distances can be accomplished via other mechanisms such as folding space and worm holes. Faster engines are just the “brute force” method, folding space and worm holes is finesse that requires advanced technology and know how. There could be other mechanisms that we are unaware of. Some of the major challenges in folding space and worm holes involves the amount of power needed (which is a technology problem) and our incomplete understanding of these mechanisms. Solve those problems and long distance space travel becomes a realistic possibility without requiring eons of travel time.

We do not even understand how gravity works. Is there a graviton particle? Is there an anti-graviton particle. Is it the warping of space/time that occurs when an object with mass occupies space/time? We have ideas yet we don’t truly understand it, but that does not prevent us from accepting that gravity is real and exists and using gravity in subsequent theories. The gravitational constant is a huge “spherical chicken in a vacuum” that pervades much of our modern science. We have figure out that it is correct and that it works, but our understanding of gravity is woefully incomplete.

We have only recently verified the existence of the Higgs boson but we have strongly suspected it was there and have built a lot of scientific theory that we use IRL based on the existence of this suspected particle. Is the graviton/anti-graviton a boson that we have not yet verified? If graviton/anti-gravitons exist that will probably be the key that unlocks vast opportunities for long distance space travel for us.
 
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Ok, my point is : Hundreds of people saw an aircraft that can’t be explained.
This aircraft did exist. It was not hallucinations. It was not mass hysteria.
I did not tell that this was alien. But I have no reason to rule out this hypothesis.
I think you really nailed it with this. We can neither prove nor disprove the origin of an unknown craft. It is possible that such a craft is of terrestrial origin. It is also possible that such a craft is of extra-terrestrial origin.

In the realm of probabilities it is more likely that the craft is of terrestrial origin based on our current knowledge base. But it is not a 100% likelihood that is terrestrial in origin. Our calculations of probability are biased by the limitations of our own knowledge. Such a craft is unexplained. As such it is unreasonable to discount either possibility.
 
an open mind to what is not explained is what makes science to move forward.
If you just stick with what science believes to actually know, you’re just bogged.
Agree with this. Just because something isn't possible now, and we can't conceive of how it could be possible, doesn't mean it won't happen in the future. Look at how many "known facts" have been overturned by new minds approaching something from a new mindset. The earth was once the center of the universe. It was once thought to be flat. Man did not think that we could ever fly, or go to the moon. There were once only 4 "elements": earth, air, fire, and water - there was no concept of an atom, much less string theory and the multiple dimensions it implies. etc...

As to not having any evidence of aliens 'out there' - we've mostly looked for radio signals (i.e. electromagnetic wavelengths). Why isn't is possible that another civilization might use something completely different for communication? It's another sign of the limited human mind that we assume that since we use electromagnetic waves, that anyone else would too.
 
I think you really nailed it with this. We can neither prove nor disprove the origin of an unknown craft. It is possible that such a craft is of terrestrial origin. It is also possible that such a craft is of extra-terrestrial origin.

In the realm of probabilities it is more likely that the craft is of terrestrial origin based on our current knowledge base. But it is not a 100% likelihood that is terrestrial in origin. Our calculations of probability are biased by the limitations of our own knowledge. It is unexplained. As such it is unreasonable to discount either possibility.

20 years later, there are still no known planes with the flying possibilities of what was observed. The aircraft could have been US, but why flying all lights on a secret plane above a friendly country...It could have been russian...more worrying.
Two F-16 were sent for interception (because the UFO seen by people was confirmed by ground military radar), and the aircraft made evasive actions that cannot be made by aircrafts today.
Based on our current knowledge, the opinion is rather that the craft is not of terrestrial origin :-(
And if it is of terrestrial origin, NATO should be very, very, worried....
I’ve also read that Navy recently acknowledged that they can’t explain UFOs.

It’s irritating my logical mind. I’d like to know what it was :)
 
20 years later, there are still no known planes with the flying possibilities of what was observed. The aircraft could have been US, but why flying all lights on a secret plane above a friendly country...It could have been russian...more worrying.
Two F-16 were sent for interception (because the UFO seen by people was confirmed by ground military radar), and the aircraft made evasive actions that cannot be made by aircrafts today.
Based on our current knowledge, the opinion is rather that the craft is not of terrestrial origin :-(
And if it is of terrestrial origin, NATO should be very, very, worried....
I’ve also read that Navy recently acknowledged that they can’t explain UFOs.

It’s irritating my logical mind. I’d like to know what it was :)
I think that while probability would place odds on such a craft being terrestrial, intuition would lead some to conclude that it is extra-terrestrial. So it really comes down to a persons bias for interpreting information. Are they ok with non-deterministic outcomes (e.g. it could be either, we just don’t), do they desire proof (e.g. it is probably terrestrial so it is not extra-terrestrial), or do they follow intuition (e.g. we cannot explain it, therefore it cannot be us).

One thing I believe, we have had a lot of armed conflict over the past 20 or so years. At this point the technology would be old. I have a hard time fathoming how a terrestrial owner of such technology would not have tilted their hand at this point. What good is the capability if you are not strategically leveraging it?

We had stealth technology for years before the public was aware of it. Armed conflict where the technology was used eventually blew the lid off the technology. Unless this technology is used strictly for spying or end game scenarios, I would think it would have become obvious that we had such capability after 20 years.

Russian and Chinese military have also disclosed similar unexplained encounters. So if the three major world powers are experiencing this phenomenon and say it is unexplained, who could responsible and why hasn’t the responsible party used it to their advantage? This would be such a game changer that the country possessing such capability would have a huge strategic advantage.
 
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