NAD - Diezel VHX

Thomas Obester said:
Thanks !
Actually, I have found out that for me, out of all those diezel models, dizzy silver v3 and herbie 3 sound better than real herbert/vh4/vhx 🙈
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Having AB tested that I can say that you must have done something wrong ( played the amp turned down ?). The axe pre amp in to the VH4 power stage is incredibly close but in any other amplification situation of FRFR it just isn't. Axe needs better live FRFR solutions because it's not the reason that the real amp is bigger sounding . Recorded and AB played back through the same monitors you can't tell which is which.
 
Andy Eagle said:
Having AB tested that I can say that you must have done something wrong ( played the amp turned down ?). The axe pre amp in to the VH4 power stage is incredibly close but in any other amplification situation of FRFR it just isn't. Axe needs better live FRFR solutions because it's not the reason that the real amp is bigger sounding . Recorded and AB played back through the same monitors you can't tell which is which.
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Well, the only variable in this comparison was axe as preamp vs diezel vhx preamp modes.

I am pretty familiar with diezels (played them for ca. 10 years) and have fractal products for 7-8 years.
I went through all solutions including FRFR systems, fryette ps-2/matrix gt1000 with 2 different 4x12, everything except in-ears :)

I woud say I know how to hook things up and do this test properly :)

again, that´s just IMHO, but out of dozen or so axe diezel models, those 2 (dizzy silver v3 and herbie 3) sounds/feels better than the real deal.
The rest of the model sounds subjectively worse that those inside vhx.

What´s better on dizzy silver v3 and herbie 3 you may ask ?

Again, IMHO, the sound of those axe models is :

  • more homogenic, tone is morphed or somehow glued together better
  • feels better under the fingers
  • tighter response
  • has better clarity
  • it´s not so cold (it´s possible to make it colder like real amp with advanced settings ..bias etc.)
  • gain structure stays together a lot better, it´s somehow more compact (some may say that it´s more compressed and if that´s the thing, I like it that way)
  • the frequency is not all over the place, like wall of sound but precise (so the vhx might sound a bit bigger, but not for better IMO)
  • those 2 fractal models has a lot more gain available, the vhx is a lot drier.
  • volume wise, I played both at 75-80dbs and around 105db (diezels are known for sounding pretty good at bedroom levels)
If somebody prefer bigger, wall of sound, more raw type of a sound, I can clearly see that the VHX would be winner here...BUT...you can tweak AXE to sound it like that, while the VHX to sound other way around ? ...not so much.
 
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Thomas Obester said:
Well, the only variable in this comparison was axe as preamp vs diezel vhx preamp modes.

I am pretty familiar with diezels (played them for ca. 10 years) and have fractal products for 7-8 years.
I went through all solutions including FRFR systems, fryette ps-2/matrix gt1000 with 2 different 4x12, everything except in-ears :)

I woud say I know how to hook things up and do this test properly :)

again, that´s just IMHO, but out of dozen or so axe diezel models, those 2 (dizzy silver v3 and herbie 3) sounds/feels better than the real deal.
The rest of the model sounds subjectively worse that those inside vhx.

What´s better on dizzy silver v3 and herbie 3 you may ask ?

Again, IMHO, the sound of those axe models is :

  • more homogenic, tone is morphed or somehow glued together better
  • feels better under the fingers
  • tighter response
  • has better clarity
  • it´s not so cold (it´s possible to make it colder like real amp with advanced settings ..bias etc.)
  • gain structure stays together a lot better, it´s somehow more compact (some may say that it´s more compressed and if that´s the thing, I like it that way)
  • the frequency is not all over the place, like wall of sound but precise (so the vhx might sound a bit bigger, but not for better IMO)
  • those 2 fractal models has a lot more gain available, the vhx is a lot drier.
  • volume wise, I played both at 75-80dbs and around 105db (diezels are known for sounding pretty good at bedroom levels)
If somebody prefer bigger, wall of sound, more raw type of a sound, I can clearly see that the VHX would be winner here...BUT...you can tweak AXE to sound it like that, while the VHX to sound other way around ? ...not so much.
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Couldn't disagree more. What cab where you mismatching with it.
 
JiveTurkey said:
These things look amazing. The price and available clips on the net are a dealbreaker for me. You should throw some good clips up somewhere on this. The ones out there now are terrible.
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@JiveTurkey @ESW - there you go guys, 1st video of my VHX.
Excuse my sloppy playing, I was literally shaking, because I have unlocked VHX to sound really good.
My preamp shape was always set to 2, which is settings for Diezel Hagen, which I don´t like at all. Once I have set it to 0 (VH4), there it was :)
The video is only to show Diezel VH4 ch.3 settings without effects. All EQ at noon, ch. volume 10 o´clock, master 9 o´clock.

and.... I have to correct myself @Andy Eagle, because of that shape set to hagen voicing, it sounded worse that fractal models.
Now it kills it ! :D

Enjoy and don´t forget to listen in 4K 👌

 
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Thomas Obester said:
@JiveTurkey @ESW - there you go guys, 1st video of my VHX.
Excuse my sloppy playing, I was literally shaking, because I have unlocked VHX to sound really good.
My preamp shape was always set to 2, which is settings for Diezel Hagen, which I don´t like at all. Once I have set it to 0 (VH4), there it was :)
The video is only to show Diezel VH4 ch.3 settings without effects. All EQ at noon, ch. volume 10 o´clock, master 9 o´clock.

and.... I have to correct myself @Andy Eagle, because of that shape set to hagen voicing, it sounded worse that fractal models.
Now it kills it ! :D

Enjoy and don´t forget to listen in 4K 👌

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The thing about the VH4 is almost any setting sounds good at worst and incredible at best and I have to mess about for ages to get the fractal close. The VH4 is very hard to beat.
 
Andy Eagle said:
The thing about the VH4 is almost any setting sounds good at worst and incredible at best and I have to mess about for ages to get the fractal close. The VH4 is very hard to beat.
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yes. I was totally confused with this hagen voicing...it sounded very strange. Once I corrected this, buuum, there it was....like the 2018 VH4 I had.
there is difference in gain pot though...vh4 with gain on 65% is like vhx gain on 100% - that´s blue ch. and shape 0 (VH4 settings).
 
Thomas Obester said:
If somebody prefer bigger, wall of sound, more raw type of a sound, I can clearly see that the VHX would be winner here...BUT...you can tweak AXE to sound it like that, while the VHX to sound other way around ? ...not so much.
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Just to confirm, you're saying you can tweak the Axe to sound like the VHX....ONLY if you use the VHX power amp, correct?
 
BBN said:
Just to confirm, you're saying you can tweak the Axe to sound like the VHX....ONLY if you use the VHX power amp, correct?
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yes, kinda (with vhx as power amp).
but later I have found out that my vhx preamp type was set all time to diezel hagen voicing.. so I should correct myself and say, that you can tweak axe to sound more like a hagen. as soon as I used correct preamp shape for vh4 sound, the difference between axe models and vhx got bigger.
 
Does anyone else feel like the Dizzy Silver 2 and Silver 3 models are not accurate and should be swapped? I'm on the FM3 latest firmware.

Silver 2 sounds like a subdued version of a real Channel 3, and Silver 3 sounds like a different version of the Das Metal model, or a real Channel 2 but being boosted by a treble peaker circuit. They don't match up with the real amp. The Blue model channels sound closer to my silverface VH4, but are darker, which makes sense.
 
pipboy90 said:
Does anyone else feel like the Dizzy Silver 2 and Silver 3 models are not accurate and should be swapped? I'm on the FM3 latest firmware.

Silver 2 sounds like a subdued version of a real Channel 3, and Silver 3 sounds like a different version of the Das Metal model, or a real Channel 2 but being boosted by a treble peaker circuit. They don't match up with the real amp. The Blue model channels sound closer to my silverface VH4, but are darker, which makes sense.
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not sure about fm3, but on axe 3, they are as they should be.
 
I haven't really touched the diezel model much but after watching that Tim Pierce vid , wow its a surprisingly versatile amp. Then again Tim can make a cactus sound good.
 
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