My Dear Double Verb is Dead

mrstrat

mrstrat

Experienced
Ok, if it's possible to be in love with an inanimate object, I was in love with V9 Double Verb. There, I admit it. The best damned clean tone I've ever had in any of my rigs, ever. I put a little Esoteric RCB in front of it, a little bit of compressor before that, a touch of delay and reverb, and BAM! What a beautiful clean bell-like tone, with just a hint of squshy-ness.

That Double Verb setup is the basis for all of my clean presets. Gaaaaahhh.

Don't get me wrong, I'm loving V10. Some amazing, amazing tones. HBE, Dumble, TriAxis Yellow Channel (yahoo!). And the new cabs..wow! But they drove a stake through the heart of my beloved Double Verb.

I think I remember reading that Cliff used a different Twin to create the new model? Anyway, the new model is thin and lifeless compared to V9. I've tried tweaking but something tells me there's no getting that tone back.

I've tried all the tricks, system reset, rolled back to v9, reinstalled FW, used MIDI-OX to install V10 Presets, played with the MV, Drive, Level, etc.

Anyone else cracked this nut? Help me get my groove back on with DV! :D
 
mrstrat said:
Ok, if it's possible to be in love with an inanimate object, I was in love with V9 Double Verb. There, I admit it. The best damned clean tone I've ever had in any of my rigs, ever. I put a little Esoteric RCB in front of it, a little bit of compressor before that, a touch of delay and reverb, and BAM! What a beautiful clean bell-like tone, with just a hint of squshy-ness.

That Double Verb setup is the basis for all of my clean presets. Gaaaaahhh.

Don't get me wrong, I'm loving V10. Some amazing, amazing tones. HBE, Dumble, TriAxis Yellow Channel (yahoo!). And the new cabs..wow! But they drove a stake through the heart of my beloved Double Verb.

I think I remember reading that Cliff used a different Twin to create the new model? Anyway, the new model is thin and lifeless compared to V9. I've tried tweaking but something tells me there's no getting that tone back.

I've tried all the tricks, system reset, rolled back to v9, reinstalled FW, used MIDI-OX to install V10 Presets, played with the MV, Drive, Level, etc.

Anyone else cracked this nut? Help me get my groove back on with DV! :D
Click to expand...

I'll check it out for you. How did you run it before? And what IR did you use? I'm not to crazy about many of the IR's but I also didn't like them before! The Scumback H75 and M75( OH ) are really nice now. But I have to find a good 2 x 12
 
mrstrat said:
I've tried all the tricks, system reset, rolled back to v9, reinstalled FW, used MIDI-OX to install V10 Presets, played with the MV, Drive, Level, etc.

Anyone else cracked this nut? Help me get my groove back on with DV! :D
Click to expand...
Have you tried reselecting/resetting the amp and cab block and dialing them in again?
Taking over presets from FW9 to FW10 screws some advanced settings up.
 
eljodon said:
I'll check it out for you. How did you run it before? And what IR did you use? I'm not to crazy about many of the IR's but I also didn't like them before! The Scumback H75 and M75( OH ) are really nice now. But I have to find a good 2 x 12
Click to expand...

Hey George! Just running compressor => esoteric RCB => Double Verb => 2x12 Doubleverb D120 (RW) AND => 2x12 Blue => Delay => Reverb


Thanks for the help!! Where did you get the (OH) Scumback IRs?
 
Zwiebelchen said:
Have you tried reselecting/resetting the amp and cab block and dialing them in again?
Taking over presets from FW9 to FW10 screws some advanced settings up.
Click to expand...

Yup, was the first thing I tried. But I also copied over the V10 presets, and noticed the same behavior in the V10 Double Verb preset. Low volume, thin sounding, no life.
 
Try switching off the Bright switch.
Keep Drive under 2. MV full.
Try the new twin cab.
 
mrstrat said:
Yup, was the first thing I tried. But I also copied over the V10 presets, and noticed the same behavior in the V10 Double Verb preset. Low volume, thin sounding, no life.
Click to expand...

I tried it and the only thing I hear is a bump at around 2.5 kHz. Also remember that all the amps start at main volume at -12 db were as before it was 0 db a huge difference.Also try other Fender amps like the 65 or other ones. I used to use the Plexi Brown but now I like the 100w and 50w Marshall better. I don't like many of the 2 x12 Ir's they sound honky to me. Also go to the Amp graphic eq and lower 2 kHz or 1kHz by 2db and see if that works
 
Maybe not youre solution but i found my fender love :) on the vibroverb on fw 10.
Can, t stop playing, really dynamic and rich sounding.
 
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Have you used Axe-Edit to save presets? I was having all kinds of problems until I did a complete reset of the Axe (started 100% from scratch), re-installed everything via SysEx Librarian and stopped saving or installing things with the Axe-Edit.

That solved my problems.

It seems that folks are all over the place with the results of their installs and almost all (at least in the threads I have read) lead back in one way or another to Axe-Edit.


Dialing in presets with Axe-EDit is a hit or miss --- and I do not save through Axe-Edit anymore (very good chance of screwing everything up again).


That being said -- the behavior you are describing on the Twin is inconsistent with my experience and other folks in the Fender thread who own vintage Fender amps. They are dead on and a monumental improvement over v9..

What are you using to amplify your AF2?



Try installing the attached preset (with SysEx) and see if it results in any improvements


*******

Quick demo before I go to work of the basic preset with both a an SSH guitar (Tyler Burning Water 2K) and one with Humbuckers (Suhr Antique Korina Tele with humbuckers - both neck/bridge).

Nothing fancy just a couple of chords and strum patterns

SSH used (Neck as well as 2nd and 4th positions on blade) HH (used neck and middle positions on blade)

Recorded it direct into GarageBand


 

Attachments

  • Twin_Reverb.syx
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My Favorite Clean has Changed from FW to FW, but always stayed a Fender. FW5 & 6 it was Deluxe Verb, FW7 & 8 it was the Vibroverb, FW9 it was the SuperVerb.
Now FW10 it has Gone back to the Deluxe Verb.

If your not getting there with tweaks, You can setup the Y Amp as another one of these Fenders and see if you can find something good there.
I like using X/Y cause I can go back and forth and see which is better, additionally sometimes I end up with a Dual Patch, where I can X-Y my Amp Live for different tones if I end up liking both X and Y.
 
LVC said:
Have you used Axe-Edit to save presets? I was having all kinds of problems until I did a complete reset of the Axe (started 100% from scratch), re-installed everything via SysEx Librarian and stopped saving or installing things with the Axe-Edit.

That solved my problems.

It seems that folks are all over the place with the results of their installs and almost all (at least in the threads I have read) lead back in one way or another to Axe-Edit.


Dialing in presets with Axe-EDit is a hit or miss --- and I do not save through Axe-Edit anymore (very good chance of screwing everything up again).


That being said -- the behavior you are describing on the Twin is inconsistent with my experience and other folks in the Fender thread who own vintage Fender amps. They are dead on and a monumental improvement over v9..

What are you using to amplify your AF2?



Try installing the attached preset (with SysEx) and see if it results in any improvements


*******

Quick demo before I go to work of the basic preset with both a an SSH guitar (Tyler Burning Water 2K) and one with Humbuckers (Suhr Antique Korina Tele with humbuckers - both neck/bridge).

Nothing fancy just a couple of chords and strum patterns

SSH used (Neck as well as 2nd and 4th positions on blade) HH (used neck and middle positions on blade)

Recorded it direct into GarageBand


Click to expand...


That not thin.. for sure...... IMHO..... Nice LVC. Your amp is it not?
 
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Sounds beautiful LVC! Now with everyone chiming in, I will definitely revisit this amp.
Wanted to add that my Double did not sound like LVC's recording either. I am going to download his attached preset and see how it compares to what I am hearing in my new Axe-Edit installed bank. (I have been using Axe-Edit since the FW10 release as well, and am sort of befuddled at its behavior. Think I will stick with the front panel... for me, not worth the quirkiness. No complaints, just sayin.)
 
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MarkShrader said:
Sounds beautiful LVC! Now with everyone chiming in, I will definitely revisit this amp.
Wanted to add that my Double did not sound like LVC's recording either. I am going to download his attached preset and see how it compares to what I am hearing in my new Axe-Edit installed bank. (I have been using Axe-Edit since the FW10 release as well, and am sort of befuddled at its behavior. Think I will stick with the front panel... for me, not worth the quirkiness. No complaints, just sayin.)
Click to expand...

Axe-Edit is the root of all evils and the source of all the "ghosts in the machine"

I recommend treating Axe-Edit as cautiously as you would a drunk knife wielding ex-girfriend who knocks on your door at 3 AM in the morning.
 
Hey Guys!

Thank you sooooo much for your thoughtful replies, and all of the advice.

So, I think I know what's going on here...it appears as though we have another situation where the underlying tonal characteristics of the amp have changed. I've read all the threads about folks who aren't happy about this amp or that amp that has changed. Users flaming FAS about it. That's not my intention here.

LVC, your sound clip really hit it on the head for me. Your sound clip IS what I'm hearing now and it's WAAAAY different than the old Double Verb. It probably sounds much closer to a REAL Twin, and that's great. But it's DIFFERENT, and not in a good way for me. I appreciate everyone's opinion about what sounds good, it's just not the tone I am after in my clean presets.

Below is an example of the tone I'm looking for, any ideas about what amp I might be able to use now to re-create it would be really, really, really appreciated. Thanks again guys!!



BTW, I recorded this direct via USB, no tweaking...
 
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I gave it a try and it sounds really nice. I tried re creating the way it used to be as far as master and volume, and it doesn't sound thin an wimpy. It did sound dirty because either the drive or because the master is set at 10.
 
eljodon said:
I gave it a try and it sounds really nice. I tried re creating the way it used to be as far as master and volume, and it doesn't sound thin an wimpy. It did sound dirty because either the drive or because the master is set at 10.
Click to expand...

Yes, I was finding the same thing. In order to get the volume up, you have to bring the MV level up to the point where it starts to get dirty, which is not what I want.
 
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