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Metallica uses Axe Fx

Ben.Last

Experienced
Did I miss it or has no one pointed out that in the new Stern performance they're on in ears? There's almost certainly nothing coming out of the cabs or monitors.

And, actually, at the 5:07 mark, when the AFXs are visible, you can also see that at least 3 of the monitor wedges are teleprompters.

There's most likely no volume or low volume in the room they're playing in.
 
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CrosleyPop

New Member
Somewhat off-topic. I've noticed that there is something that seems to be said a lot about "Sad But True", both by the band and others involved with the production of the album, that makes no sense. Howard Stern mentions that it was a big deal that the song was tuned down, because they had never done that before. Similarly, Bob Rock makes a comment in some video (it's not "Year and a Half...", but I don't recall which one it is) that when he heard the band's demo for the song, he suggested they lower the tempo and tune it down from E to D to make it sound heavier. He claims the band didn't understand his suggestion at first; he makes some comment about James asking, "isn't E the lowest note?"

That doesn't make sense for two reasons. First, they had tuned down before--"The Thing That Should Not Be" from Master of Puppets is in D standard. It's also always been in D when they've played it live. Even if Flemming told them to do it in the studio, they still would know they had gone below E standard before. Secondly, the recently released black album boxset has their personal riff tapes on it, and the first riff demo of "Sad But True" is in Eb. That likely predates them even meeting Bob Rock.

A minor thing, but still strange to me. It kind of paints James and Kirk in a light that implies they don't understand the basic mechanics of their chosen instruments--i.e. tuning to something other than concert pitch--which I highly doubt is the case in reality.
 

unix-guy

Legend!
Somewhat off-topic. I've noticed that there is something that seems to be said a lot about "Sad But True", both by the band and others involved with the production of the album, that makes no sense. Howard Stern mentions that it was a big deal that the song was tuned down, because they had never done that before. Similarly, Bob Rock makes a comment in some video (it's not "Year and a Half...", but I don't recall which one it is) that when he heard the band's demo for the song, he suggested they lower the tempo and tune it down from E to D to make it sound heavier. He claims the band didn't understand his suggestion at first; he makes some comment about James asking, "isn't E the lowest note?"

That doesn't make sense for two reasons. First, they had tuned down before--"The Thing That Should Not Be" from Master of Puppets is in D standard. It's also always been in D when they've played it live. Even if Flemming told them to do it in the studio, they still would know they had gone below E standard before. Secondly, the recently released black album boxset has their personal riff tapes on it, and the first riff demo of "Sad But True" is in Eb. That likely predates them even meeting Bob Rock.

A minor thing, but still strange to me. It kind of paints James and Kirk in a light that implies they don't understand the basic mechanics of their chosen instruments--i.e. tuning to something other than concert pitch--which I highly doubt is the case in reality.
Kirk was a Satriani student. He most definitely HAD to be aware of this...
 

wolk

Member
Somewhat off-topic. I've noticed that there is something that seems to be said a lot about "Sad But True", both by the band and others involved with the production of the album, that makes no sense. Howard Stern mentions that it was a big deal that the song was tuned down, because they had never done that before. Similarly, Bob Rock makes a comment in some video (it's not "Year and a Half...", but I don't recall which one it is) that when he heard the band's demo for the song, he suggested they lower the tempo and tune it down from E to D to make it sound heavier. He claims the band didn't understand his suggestion at first; he makes some comment about James asking, "isn't E the lowest note?"

That doesn't make sense for two reasons. First, they had tuned down before--"The Thing That Should Not Be" from Master of Puppets is in D standard. It's also always been in D when they've played it live. Even if Flemming told them to do it in the studio, they still would know they had gone below E standard before. Secondly, the recently released black album boxset has their personal riff tapes on it, and the first riff demo of "Sad But True" is in Eb. That likely predates them even meeting Bob Rock.

A minor thing, but still strange to me. It kind of paints James and Kirk in a light that implies they don't understand the basic mechanics of their chosen instruments--i.e. tuning to something other than concert pitch--which I highly doubt is the case in reality.
Maybe you don't really understand your instrument until you are able to make jokes about it and about yourself ...

But maybe it's also the cleaning lady's fault ... :tonguewink:
 

My name is mud

Power User
Lars was 100% right about Napster. You have to give your music away now in
hopes you can sell a coffee mug, T-shirt, sticker, or a meet and greet VIP
ticket pre-concert.

Discuss. :)
Exactly. Ok now with internet you can show your songs to the world but internet completely kill the business even for small bands. No one buy cds anymore, they stream your song and you have 0,01 ct by click …
You see huge bands begging to release a new album, patreon, guitar lessons , selling puzzles … coffee … even beard lotion (petrucci)
That’s really sad to see this when you know an era so much different than that…call it progress 😔
 

State of Epicicity

Experienced
Kirk was a Satriani student. He most definitely HAD to be aware of this...

Disclaimer: No fan of the band will want to read what thoughts this sparked. I don’t want to fight anyone about this, but I also don’t want to hold back just because they are such business juggernauts, and this is the internet. And I don't mean any of what I say as a personal slight to any fans of Hammett; these are just one weirdo's personal thoughts.

I know it’s the case, but I’ve never heard it in Hammett's playing that he was a student of Satriani. I used to read Satriani‘a columns in Guitar for the Practicing Musician religiously. To me, no one was more respectful to the listener, more thoughtful in general, although I never understood his decision to sing haha, and I've always loved the EP Dreaming #11 best. Now, Jeff Tyson on the T-Ride album, that performance I can really hear as the work of a Satriani student. I can even hear how Satriani was the person who convinced the guys in Forbidden where to sign for their second album (a fact I only learned recently via a Locicero interview via podcast), but I feel like it’s a stain on Satriani for Hammett somehow to have been the most successful one.

I remember I felt like it was the cruelest thing when Chuck Schuldiner died; he had directly criticized Hammett’s playing as “safe,” and I had read separately that Schuldiner had always dreamt of being on the cover of Guitar World. When the next issue of Guitar World came out after his death, it had Hammett on the cover. I saw it at the bookstore, and I distinctly remember feeling this sick, sick feeling in the pit of my stomach. I know intellectually it’s a fluke, but that, I guess in my own mourning, hit me very hard, like it was a cosmic statement about how much guitar playing is existentially worth.

Obviously I’m not a fan of Hammett as a player (although as a person he seems like a guy who's really nice). To me, much of his small contribution to …And Justice for All is criminally lazy, and directly weakens otherwise painfully crafted and orchestrated writing and performance. I've felt strongly about this for a long time, and honestly, I don't think either guitarist's overall sense of overall tuning is something they thought much about. Hell, they might just been stinking drunk and not realized they were handed a downtuned guitar for a demo.

I remember seeing a news story about a sense of arrested development in baseball players when I was pretty young, and I would sometimes link that to what I saw in some bands who put out particular work that I worshipped. I know these guys were all just kids, and they toured and recorded ferociously to get where they were, but still, just kids. I don't see anything slipping though the cracks of musical education as a big deal or a big surprise, and weirdly, I say that without harsh judgment haha.

I used to teach guitar when I was in high school, and for some years following, but, of course, there's always one student you always marvel at, why they show up to lessons, because they don't listen, no matter how damn hard you try. I know it's the case that Hammett was a student; I feel like he was just not a sponge for whatever it was Satriani was imparting.

Satriani was a guest on That Metal Show, and was asked whether Dave Mustaine or Kirk Hammett was a better player. I was cringing before he responded, because I knew this bit of trivia that he was a teacher to Hammett, but I still couldn't deal with his response, that Hammett is more "mature" of a player. I had the impression right then he had no idea what kind of creative force Dave Mustaine was as a player, that he had no basis of comparison. It would have been way better to say sheepishly, "I don't really listen to either band," which would have been totally fine. Satriani's main inspiration was Hendrix, and I'd understand and respect having no gut response to thrash, or to metal generally. But to speak thoughtlessly about it just felt like a weirdly defferential nod to someone I always imagined was his worst student.
 
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My name is mud

Power User
you don’t know how many lessons did he takes. being a “student” for ? 4 lessons ? A month ? More ? We don’t know … in guitar lessons you can Have questions and other things other than just “skills”. Playing justice solos … that’s not easy . They are well built globally .
chuck lead are ugly to me, they are not fluid at all . He is more a rythm guitar player to me .

kill em all got physical solos , like hit the light . He played fast in that era .

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.gu...tallicas-kirk-hammett-he-was-very-eager-learn
 

State of Epicicity

Experienced
you don’t know how many lessons did he takes. being a “student” for ? 4 lessons ? A month ? More ? We don’t know … in guitar lessons you can Have questions and other things other than just “skills”. Playing justice solos … that’s not easy . They are well built globally .
chuck lead are ugly to me, they are not fluid at all . He is more a rythm guitar player to me .

kill em all got physical solos , like hit the light . He played fast in that era .

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.gu...tallicas-kirk-hammett-he-was-very-eager-learn

Thanks for posting that article. That was interesting. I do respectfully disagree with your assessment.
 

yoitsmegabe

Inspired
you don’t know how many lessons did he takes. being a “student” for ? 4 lessons ? A month ? More ? We don’t know … in guitar lessons you can Have questions and other things other than just “skills”. Playing justice solos … that’s not easy . They are well built globally .
chuck lead are ugly to me, they are not fluid at all . He is more a rythm guitar player to me .

kill em all got physical solos , like hit the light . He played fast in that era .

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.gu...tallicas-kirk-hammett-he-was-very-eager-learn
According to Kirk in an interview or was "a year or so."
https://loudwire.com/metallica-kirk-hammett-first-guitar-lesson-joe-satriani/

To your point about Kill em All, Kirk played a bit of Dave Mustaine's solos, so he ran with whatever energy was already there. One of my favorite solos is all Kirk though and that's the middle section they added to Four Horsemen.
 

la noise

Power User
Disclaimer: No fan of the band will want to read what thoughts this sparked. I don’t want to fight anyone about this, but I also don’t want to hold back just because they are such business juggernauts, and this is the internet. And I don't mean any of what I say as a personal slight to any fans of Hammett; these are just one weirdo's personal thoughts.

I know it’s the case, but I’ve never heard it in Hammett's playing that he was a student of Satriani. I used to read Satriani‘a columns in Guitar for the Practicing Musician religiously. To me, no one was more respectful to the listener, more thoughtful in general, although I never understood his decision to sing haha, and I've always loved the EP Dreaming #11 best. Now, Jeff Tyson on the T-Ride album, that performance I can really hear as the work of a Satriani student. I can even hear how Satriani was the person who convinced the guys in Forbidden where to sign for their second album (a fact I only learned recently via a Locicero interview via podcast), but I feel like it’s a stain on Satriani for Hammett somehow to have been the most successful one.

I remember I felt like it was the cruelest thing when Chuck Schuldiner died; he had directly criticized Hammett’s playing as “safe,” and I had read separately that Schuldiner had always dreamt of being on the cover of Guitar World. When the next issue of Guitar World came out after his death, it had Hammett on the cover. I saw it at the bookstore, and I distinctly remember feeling this sick, sick feeling in the pit of my stomach. I know intellectually it’s a fluke, but that, I guess in my own mourning, hit me very hard, like it was a cosmic statement about how much guitar playing is existentially worth.

Obviously I’m not a fan of Hammett as a player (although as a person he seems like a guy who's really nice). To me, much of his small contribution to …And Justice for All is criminally lazy, and directly weakens otherwise painfully crafted and orchestrated writing and performance. I've felt strongly about this for a long time, and honestly, I don't think either guitarist's overall sense of overall tuning is something they thought much about. Hell, they might just been stinking drunk and not realized they were handed a downtuned guitar for a demo.

I remember seeing a news story about a sense of arrested development in baseball players when I was pretty young, and I would sometimes link that to what I saw in some bands who put out particular work that I worshipped. I know these guys were all just kids, and they toured and recorded ferociously to get where they were, but still, just kids. I don't see anything slipping though the cracks of musical education as a big deal or a big surprise, and weirdly, I say that without harsh judgment haha.

I used to teach guitar when I was in high school, and for some years following, but, of course, there's always one student you always marvel at, why they show up to lessons, because they don't listen, no matter how damn hard you try. I know it's the case that Hammett was a student; I feel like he was just not a sponge for whatever it was Satriani was imparting.

Satriani was a guest on That Metal Show, and was asked whether Dave Mustaine or Kirk Hammett was a better player. I was cringing before he responded, because I knew this bit of trivia that he was a teacher to Hammett, but I still couldn't deal with his response, that Hammett is more "mature" of a player. I had the impression right then he had no idea what kind of creative force Dave Mustaine was as a player, that he had no basis of comparison. It would have been way better to say sheepishly, "I don't really listen to either band," which would have been totally fine. Satriani's main inspiration was Hendrix, and I'd understand and respect having no gut response to thrash, or to metal generally. But to speak thoughtlessly about it just felt like a weirdly defferential nod to someone I always imagined was his worst student.

10 bonus points for the T-Ride mention. :) That band was so far ahead of its time.

Who knew Eric Valentine would go on to become a world-class producer (which you
can kind of imagine after hearing the production on the T-Ride album). Stellar!

You may be the only other person I have seen on the Internet mention that band. :)
 

la noise

Power User
My biggest beef with Kirk (other than over-reliance on the Wah) is his horrendous sense of pitch.
His intonation is so off. I don't know if he frets too hard, or what, but he always sounds sharp to
me when he solos.

You can hear the contrast when Hetfield solos. His sense of pitch (maybe from being a singer) is far
better than Kirk's.
 

Andrew Male

Experienced
Uhhhm, so anyway, back on topic.

Looks like the debate is over, looks like they're back to their regular powered cabs/axe fx only setup as of yesterday.

 
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biggness

Power User
Lars was 100% right about Napster. You have to give your music away now in
hopes you can sell a coffee mug, T-shirt, sticker, or a meet and greet VIP
ticket pre-concert.

Discuss. :)
I personally believe that he was fighting the inevitable. Akin to Blockbuster fighting streaming services.

The decline of music sales is really just a culmination of:

-Ease of sharing. The internet opened the whole world up to bootlegging with each other. Before the internet, you'd have communities sharing cassettes, and later burnt cd's. You can argue the ethics of that, but you can't argue that it's ever going to end.

-Tonaly pleasing music scales of the western world. There's but a few scales and chord progressions available that we can play with before sounding too similar to someone else. If you veer to far out of this, you enter jazz territory, which never sold anyways lol

-The ease of DIY recording, with the added ease of sampled and programmed drums. Now with the constraints of originality due to only so few notes, the market is flooding more and more with each passing moment. Evvvverryyyone is making and promoting their music, most of which sounding similar. Musicians are having to venture into to electronic elements to bring some sense of originality to their sound that hasn't been done before. I'm not saying originality equates to success, but you do need something to differentiate yourself to garner success.

When someone captures lighting in a bottle nowadays, they have to move quickly to captilize on their success before being copied ad infitium. A great example of this is Misha Mansoor/Bulb. He blew people's minds with his recording techniques, and original sound and tone. He took advantage of this and set himself up for success with charging for producing, and endorsement deals for some stuff that was sorta viewed as necessary to achieve his sound. He/they are still making great music, but that new genre is heavily heavily populated now.

Edit: I'll also add the culture aspect of it. Used to be that being a rockstar was the coolest gig on the planet. Hetfield, Dimebag Darrell, Axel Rose, Scott Weiland, Anthony Kiedis, any of the big hair bands, David Lee Roth/Eddie Van Halen, Jimmy Page, Robert Plant, Ozzy... the list goes on, but it ends. We currently have nothing even close to that in the rock/metal world. Cultural icons. The closest is Post Malone, but he's not even in the genres I speak of. Right now, all the success is focused in pretty much every area but rock and metal.
 
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