Matrix GT1000/Q12 vs Atomic CLR Active Cab Comparison

One more thing to keep in mind.

I am not using it to "monitor" myself. I am using it as my only source of amplification at a gig at a club/restaurant or bar.


Not sure if this makes any difference -- but I think it is important to note
 
This is technical discussion above my pay grade -- but why would I buy something for guitar if after I get it -- I have to adjust highs/lows etc etc etc to make it sound like a guitar cabinet?

why not buy something that works better with your guitar/modeler and gets you closer to a guitar/cab tone right out of the box?

Just say'n

I want my monitoring system to faithfully recreate what I feed it. If a trustworthy monitoring system sounds "boomy", I need to adjust my presets.
 
This is technical discussion above my pay grade -- but why would I buy something for guitar if after I get it -- I have to adjust highs/lows etc etc etc to make it sound like a guitar cabinet?

why not buy something that works better with your guitar/modeler and gets you closer to a guitar/cab tone right out of the box?

Just say'n

Beacuse I
- can use the same presets I used in the studio
- hear that in the monitor what is in FOH
- when I share presets it would be useful for others

I want my monitoring system to faithfully recreate what I feed it. If a trustworthy monitoring system sounds "boomy", I need to adjust my presets.

I second levipeto's and Richard_G's replies and will add another reason:
because I use my Axe with electric guitars AND acoustic guitars AND bass guitars.
I don't want my acoustic to sound like it's going through an amp made for electric guitars.
 
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I really enjoy learning how folks use all of this great gear in different ways and for different applications.

Great stuff!


I second levipeto's and Richard_G's replies and will add another reason:
because I use my Axe with electric guitars AND acoustic guitars AND bass guitars.
I don't want my acoustic to sound like it's going through an amp made for electric guitars.
 
Before I get into my post, just want to say that folks should not take the Matrix/Atomic thing too personal. There are folks here on the forum that own both and love both so I know this is no different than Gibson versus Fender or Marshall versus Mesa. Just personal preference.

Your post is perfect timing for me. I have been considering selling my Matrix GT1000FX and Marshall cabs to get an Atomic CLR or similar "all in one" solution. After reading your post, I realize that I don't need to sell my Matrix (really love it!) and just need to get a passive FRFR wedge, cab, etc.

I have no dealings with Atomic but have heard great things. As far as Matrix goes, they called me at home one day when I thought I was having an issue with my Matrix, which ended up being nothing and was a normal, expected thing. They make great products.
 
I use two QSC K12's and I A/B that with my marshall stack....marshall on stage and axe fx front of house or the QSC's...I can't imagine it getting any better tone wise than this... works for me. cheers
 
I think the two should be really close - maybe LVC is more sensitive to a certain low frequency. I havent played a CLR - though Im interested (in a passive) along with the Matrix. I have played through the Matrix and also with acoustic and program music - sounded fine to me, not "guitar cab" flavoured at all. I can say after hearing the Matrix against some other floor monitors (including the RCF, but not an Atomic) - and my own studio monitors in the same room, the Matrix was much much closer to the studio monitors than any other solution. Of course not all studio monitors are the same either - so maybe my Events also have slightly cut bass?

Either way, I dont think the CLRs would be boomy given the amount of positive reviews and by Jays expertise here, nor do I think the Matrix are overly mid hyped from my own experience with them v studio monitors. I just think its horses for courses - some prefer one some prefer the others which is cool.

I had assumed the Atomics would be more pricey than the Matrix in the EU (well the UK to be precise) so my choice would be the Matrix (in Jul/Aug when I have the funds) - but from the pricing released and a quick £/$ conversion there actually about the same price - almost to the penny, which makes the choice that much harder.
 
It is possible what I perceived as Boomy with the Atomic Active CLR Cab has nothing to do with the cab itself but how it is being amplified?

Remember I do not use the cabs as monitors I use them as my only source of amplification at gigs. No FOH --

If the cab designs are both equally flat then the variable between them is the amp source.

I used two amp sources

1. The built in one in the Atomic CLR
2. The Matrix GT1000

The Matrix amp is designed to drive monitors as well as standard guitar cabs.

Have we been focusing on the wrong thing to nail down the source of the boom I experienced with the CLR?

Again --- I am not using my cabs as monitors. I am using as only source of amplification (at gig volume) for shows.

Could it be that the amp in the CLR works well as a monitor and at moderate volumes but not as well when used as a sole source of amplification with a full band in a club/bar setting?
 
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I love reading these threads....better than watching TV.

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Before I get into my post, just want to say that folks should not take the Matrix/Atomic thing too personal. There are folks here on the forum that own both and love both so I know this is no different than Gibson versus Fender or Marshall versus Mesa. Just personal preference.

Your post is perfect timing for me. I have been considering selling my Matrix GT1000FX and Marshall cabs to get an Atomic CLR or similar "all in one" solution. After reading your post, I realize that I don't need to sell my Matrix (really love it!) and just need to get a passive FRFR wedge, cab, etc.

I have no dealings with Atomic but have heard great things. As far as Matrix goes, they called me at home one day when I thought I was having an issue with my Matrix, which ended up being nothing and was a normal, expected thing. They make great products.

Copy that. I thought I was having a problem with my Q12a and I had Matt and Andrew on the phone over the weekend. Matt was on vacation at Disney with his family and called me at 10pm at night to reassure me that the problem would be addressed. I treat my customers the same way, and it's very reassuring to know that these guys deeply care about their reputation and the players who use their products. Their gear may not be for everyone's taste, but they are an awesome group of folks.

And, considering the topic of this thread, I'll also say that Tom's responses to my questions about the CLR have been lightning fast as well. It's nice knowing that the key products in the Axe ecosystem are very well supported.
 
By the way, anyone in the Washington DC area who wants to try one or both of these can email me to set up a time to come by and give them a whirl. The only caveat is that I live in a townhouse so you can't play at gig volumes.
 
It is possible what I perceived as Boomy with the Atomic Active CLR Cab has nothing to do with the cab itself but how it is being amplified?

If the cab designs are both equally flat then the variable between them is the amp source.

I used two amp sources

1. The built in one in the Atomic CLR
2. The Matrix GT1000

The Matrix amp is designed to drive monitors as well as standard guitar cabs.

Have we been focusing on the wrong thing to nail down the source of the boom I experienced with the CLR?

Again --- I am not using my cabs as monitors. I am using as only source of amplification (at gig volume) for shows.

Could it be that the amp in the CLR works well as a monitor and at moderate volumes but not as well when used as a sole source of amplification with a full band in a club/bar setting?

Before going into my post, I'd like to say that you should go with what you feel more comfortable and content with.
I've not had the opportunity to try a CLR yet. But I just "can't believe" (if that makes any sense) that they're boomy. I'm sure Mr. Mitchell has put all his skills into designing them, and they're duly manufactured and, while I don't like at all his Internet persona, I believe he knows what he does. Having said this, I can believe even less that it's CLR's amp fault, for the same reasons.

Just to specify, "boomy" means overly present in some bass frequency range. AFAIK, the CLRs (both active and passive) exhibit an astonishing -2.5 dB @ 70 Hz, exceptional for their class and outstanding overall. From what I've seen and IIRC, there's no peak below that freq point.

The so called "boominess" might be a perception that comes from the other speaker not being able to go as down (i.e., user not accustomed to hear certain freqs from their rig; patches made via a different monitoring system need to be tweaked); or from a resonance mode of the room (also related to the previous point); or from a resonance of the stage, a wooden floor or the like.

Just my cent :)
 
I often cut a little around 240... To much around 240 makes big boom on certain notes. Especially with a bass guitar around.
 
I think the two should be really close - maybe LVC is more sensitive to a certain low frequency. I havent played a CLR - though Im interested (in a passive) along with the Matrix. I have played through the Matrix and also with acoustic and program music - sounded fine to me, not "guitar cab" flavoured at all. I can say after hearing the Matrix against some other floor monitors (including the RCF, but not an Atomic) - and my own studio monitors in the same room, the Matrix was much much closer to the studio monitors than any other solution. Of course not all studio monitors are the same either - so maybe my Events also have slightly cut bass?

Either way, I dont think the CLRs would be boomy given the amount of positive reviews and by Jays expertise here, nor do I think the Matrix are overly mid hyped from my own experience with them v studio monitors. I just think its horses for courses - some prefer one some prefer the others which is cool.

I had assumed the Atomics would be more pricey than the Matrix in the EU (well the UK to be precise) so my choice would be the Matrix (in Jul/Aug when I have the funds) - but from the pricing released and a quick £/$ conversion there actually about the same price - almost to the penny, which makes the choice that much harder.

Paul,
This is the best, most balanced and thoughtful post I've ever seen from you, I commend you for it.

It is possible what I perceived as Boomy with the Atomic Active CLR Cab has nothing to do with the cab itself but how it is being amplified?
........

No Laz, the active wedge and cab are both measured as a "package", so the combination of the cab and amp is flat, objectively measured.
That you prefere another solution is entirely your prerogative, and I'm glad that you found something that really works for you - doesn't make the CLR boomy though.
I suspect that it is your presets that have more low end contend in them than you like and thus are responsible for the boominess you're hearing.
You've come a long way with your Axe in a short time, but - and I mean this in the best and most friendly way possible, not in the slightest in a parental way - when you have lived with it a bit longer, and have gotten to know it even better and have had a few more aha-moments with it to fully understand what it is and what it can do, then I think you'll realize that the Axe II + a flat FRFR system has a lot of advantages over a traditional head and cab combination, and has a lot more range and frequencies that it can and does reproduce, thus you have to approach it a bit more in like a engineer would in regards to what frequencies you'll want reproduced from your guitar to get the absolute most of it, this is the way Scott, myself and quite a few other long time Axe users approach it.
It becomes second nature at some point, and although I had a lot of studio experience before I got into the Axe, this approach has thought me so much, and I benefit from these lessons each and every time I hit the stage or the studio and each time I interact with an engineer, a band member or a sound tech.
Also this approach allows me to get perfect representation for both my electric and my acoustic guitars through the same system live and in the studio and for my bass guitar in the studio. That's really a big deal to me.

By the way, anyone in the Washington DC area who wants to try one or both of these can email me to set up a time to come by and give them a whirl. The only caveat is that I live in a townhouse so you can't play at gig volumes.

guitarjim, I salute you, that is an extremely generous offer by you.
I'll pass since I'm located in Europe :) but I'd love to audition the CLR and Matrix side by side.
I've never heard the Matrix gear, but I'm sure it is great and I'd love to review it.
 
@guitarjim could you maybe do a video for us?

Just got back from my first gig with the CLR. I found it to be quite boomy on stage:lol

I'm sorry, I couldn't resist. I mean no offense to any of the posters, I'm just trying to lighten the mood and it's 5am here so I'm a little groggy.

Seriously though, I'm still high from the gig. I'm a mediocre player and play in a wedding/dance band. I've been through too many amps in my life to list and I have never had tone like this before. We played a small club tonight and I used the CLR cab as backline and only added a touch through the FOH. Most of the sound came from the cab and it was every bit the amp as any tube rig I've ever played. Granted, I'd notice a difference between this and a couple of 4x12s, but it gave me plenty of air movement and it sounded huge. Several guitar players in the club commented on how kick-ass the tone was. I've only had the Axe for a couple of months and I'm still tweaking presets, but the CLR performed perfectly from jazz, to country, to disco, to hard rock. The clarity of every preset was nothing short of stunning. No coloration at all, just an absolute pure articulation of what I programmed the Axe to do. On several songs, we walk through the audience and I went to the back of the club and was blown away by how big the amp sounded all around the room. I can't stop smiling.

I've been playing the CLR for a couple of weeks now, but this is the first time I got to crank it (I live in a townhouse) and it REALLY opened up at louder volumes. On several occasions, I forgot what I was doing because I was admiring the sound of the amp so much.

I'm not ready to say that I like it "better" than the Matrix, because I worked on my presets a lot since I last gigged with the Q12a, but I don't have a single complaint about the CLR. I need to find a room where I can crank both up a bit and do a side-by-side.

@budda007, I can probably put a video together, but frankly I think we've all learned in the last day or two that a preset might sound better on one versus the other. That's why I made the offer to folks that are local to me so that they can bring THEIR axe over and try each one out. I'll do an A/B test in the next week and report back, but regarding the CLR, I would think that that vast majority of the players who are inclined to like FRFR are going to love this amp.
 
I am glad to hear this, I have a CLR on order and my main use will be as backline.
I am use to an amp behind me.
 
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