Lag on the AX8 when switching presets.

This is kind of an old school trick but can you uses a ducking delay that will spillover?

so basically when you come out of the heavy or clean you hit the threshold and the delay spills kinda like in Larry Mitchell vid

I know a lot of guys that are single guitar players used this when soloing ,at the end of the lead so the note trails and they make the switch
 
Barmaleus said:
Also, a wild idea - maybe it is possible to develop this: when you PRESS AND HOLD the switch, AX8 prepares something in background (your current preset and sound still stay intact) to make the preset change more seamless? Once you RELEASE the switch, system finalizes the preset change and switches to it with shorter lag.
Click to expand...
That would take memory and CPU cycles which in turn would affect overall CPU and memory usage. This would result in lower quality effects or less options (e.g. routing). There is no free lunch.
 
Chris@AxeFxTutorials said:
i'm working on your preset right now on my new live stream platform. the switching is actually faster using 2 presets vs switching XY in the same preset. i duplicated your preset and made each different sound Scene 1 respectively, and the switching was much faster, still a small gap as expected.

when i got the preset under about 75% CPU, the XY Amp switching was much faster, and around 70 or below was even faster. but that speed basically matched the 2 separate presets at their high CPU usage.
Click to expand...

Do you know how to copy a scene? For example I want scene 2 to reset so its the same as scene 1 again? Or say I want scene 3 to be the same as scene 2? Nothing in the manual and on the unit cant figure it out...
 
Feflicker said:
Do you know how to copy a scene? For example I want scene 2 to reset so its the same as scene 1 again? Or say I want scene 3 to be the same as scene 2? Nothing in the manual and on the unit cant figure it out...
Click to expand...

You have to use AX8Edit to do that.
-
Austin
 
Barmaleus said:
Just a few thoughts.

Afaik, there are currently two ways the button switches work:
1. It makes changes once you press AND RELEASE the switch.
2. It makes changes when you just press the switch.

Maybe it is possible to achieve lower switch latency using the 2nd switching option?
Click to expand...
I think this is not an issue when using a dedicated Scene button. There is no hold function so I think it engages on the downstroke. I'll check later.

Also, a wild idea - maybe it is possible to develop this: when you PRESS AND HOLD the switch, AX8 prepares something in background (your current preset and sound still stay intact) to make the preset change more seamless? Once you RELEASE the switch, system finalizes the preset change and switches to it with shorter lag.
Click to expand...

Everything already switches instantly. It can't switch any faster than that :) the delay for XY amp switching is a mute/audio gap. It is not lag, though very high CPU usage can introduce some lag in addition to the mute.

In order to keep your current sound intact, it needs to real-time process everything, which is basically the same thing as the current situation. So you're kinda just describing what already happens.
 
Feflicker said:
Bummer. This is needed on the unit, Im hoping to avoid having to connect a computer to edit, so far I had been succesful...
Click to expand...

I would say there are a few editing features that need to be on the unit including block recall and global blocks. I'm not holding my breathe though :D
-
Austin
 
Feflicker said:
Bummer. This is needed on the unit, Im hoping to avoid having to connect a computer to edit, so far I had been succesful...
Click to expand...
scenes are just statuses of on/off and x/y, so i don't think the hardware really stores anything the same way it stores a preset.

here's an excerpt of my live stream last night showing what i tried. it's real-time, not edited down, but i basically always doing something ;) i did a bit of work before that with scene controllers, without good results, because the Recto amp model won't clean up at all... as expected. and then i started eating pizza, so i started this video after that :)

switches 1 and 2 are changing presets.
switch 5 is switching Amp XY specifically
switches 3 and 4 are changing S1 and S2



i'm REALLY excited to be using Beam.pro as my livestream platform and glad i held off just a bit from declaring Hitbox as my new platform. Beam.pro is awesome, only 3 seconds of video delay, great features for streams, and they are working on a protocol with only 250ms of video delay! which is basically INSTANT. it's very new, but has been much more stable than Hitbox (also offers a 3 second only delay, but a bit buggy).
 
Chris@AxeFxTutorials said:
scenes are just statuses of on/off and x/y, so i don't think the hardware really stores anything the same way it stores a preset.

here's an excerpt of my live stream last night showing what i tried. it's real-time, not edited down, but i basically always doing something ;) i did a bit of work before that with scene controllers, without good results, because the Recto amp model won't clean up at all... as expected. and then i started eating pizza, so i started this video after that :)

switches 1 and 2 are changing presets.
switch 5 is switching Amp XY specifically
switches 3 and 4 are changing S1 and S2



i'm REALLY excited to be using Beam.pro as my livestream platform and glad i held off just a bit from declaring Hitbox as my new platform. Beam.pro is awesome, only 3 seconds of video delay, great features for streams, and they are working on a protocol with only 250ms of video delay! which is basically INSTANT. it's very new, but has been much more stable than Hitbox (also offers a 3 second only delay, but a bit buggy).
Click to expand...

This was ridiculously helpful :)

Ill lower reverb density, avoid changing states on the reverb (i can find a compromise), and lower the cab res since im playing live not tracking, and that helps immensely! Thank you!
 
Wow, I would never have imagined that switching scenes would be slower than switching presets.

Thanks for showing that scene switching can be faster, with slimmer presets.
 
RoshRoslin said:
Isn't it kind of simple? If the gear doesn't work for you, it doesn't work for you?

Just because a fender Bassman has the tone soooooo many players out there seek doesn't mean it'll work for me and what I want it to do. For the record, I can't get a usable tone (I like) out of a real one, in any year, any model. Is it fender's problem? Should I complain to fender? No, of course not, I just find something else that works for me.

If the audio dropout is a dealbreaker, so be it. Life's too short to complain about 10-20ms dropouts, find what works for you and play some guitar and write some great music :)
Click to expand...

It is simple once you know the gear works or doesn't for you... That's why i created this thread :)

I don't know how much of the thread you've read but i couldn't be happier with fractal; i find no issues with it (so far) apart from the lag. Obviously i don't own one yet.


What i'l just do is buy the Ax8. If within 15 days i find the lag bothers me i'l return it, buy the AxeII and use @jimfist proposed workaround; originally from @clarky.

http://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/lag-on-the-ax8-when-switching-presets.108343/page-3


Either way, getting my things together regarding fractal is always good. That's what the forum is for.
 
Ok, I was able to get some time today to work with the AX8 after watching Chris@AxeFXTutorials.com video. That video made me rethink a lot of how I naturally setup my presets, was very helpful. Thanks dude!

What I learned:
1) Almost all of my presets were in need of optimization/tuning. My initial approach was "Hey, if I don't hit 100% and get the warning I must be ok" wasn't the best idea. I recommend everyone keep their CPU below 90% as Chris suggested. The lag gets way worse if its over 90%.

2) NEVER do an X/Y state change on a reverb block at the same time as an amp block X/Y. Ever. Lol. That was the culprit. The reason I had done this was because I generally prefer more verb on my clean tone, than my dirty tone. What I did instead was set reverb to where I want it on dirty, then filled in the clean with more delay in the mix to create the same ambience I was trying to create with adding more reverb in the first place. Problem solved. (I also changed my verb to the small plate verb to squeek out more CPU).

3) Press/Hold for X/Y has to be set to "Disable" for me. I'm just to used to having an effect engage on the downstroke of pushing the switch (instead of the up). I believe when this is enabled you basically miss out on some time while you are waiting for your foot to come back up and it exaggerates the issue. It makes the fade between the amp block seem worse simply because it is starting later than you intend it to.

I'd still love for the change to be more immediate when switching amp X/Y, but it's pretty darn fast now, and without an audible drop in the signal. It is DEFINITELY workable now.
 
Feflicker said:
What I did instead was set reverb to where I want it on dirty, then filled in the clean with more delay in the mix to create the same ambience I was trying to create with adding more reverb in the first place. Problem solved. (I also changed my verb to the small plate verb to squeek out more CPU).
Click to expand...

you could also just use a Scene controller to change the Mix of the Reverb block up or down without changing XY state. same verb, just more mix (or some other parameter).
It is DEFINITELY workable now.
Click to expand...
awesome, that's good to hear!
 
Feflicker said:
Ok, I was able to get some time today to work with the AX8 after watching Chris@AxeFXTutorials.com video. That video made me rethink a lot of how I naturally setup my presets, was very helpful. Thanks dude!

What I learned:
1) Almost all of my presets were in need of optimization/tuning. My initial approach was "Hey, if I don't hit 100% and get the warning I must be ok" wasn't the best idea. I recommend everyone keep their CPU below 90% as Chris suggested. The lag gets way worse if its over 90%.

2) NEVER do an X/Y state change on a reverb block at the same time as an amp block X/Y. Ever. Lol. That was the culprit. The reason I had done this was because I generally prefer more verb on my clean tone, than my dirty tone. What I did instead was set reverb to where I want it on dirty, then filled in the clean with more delay in the mix to create the same ambience I was trying to create with adding more reverb in the first place. Problem solved. (I also changed my verb to the small plate verb to squeek out more CPU).

3) Press/Hold for X/Y has to be set to "Disable" for me. I'm just to used to having an effect engage on the downstroke of pushing the switch (instead of the up). I believe when this is enabled you basically miss out on some time while you are waiting for your foot to come back up and it exaggerates the issue. It makes the fade between the amp block seem worse simply because it is starting later than you intend it to.

I'd still love for the change to be more immediate when switching amp X/Y, but it's pretty darn fast now, and without an audible drop in the signal. It is DEFINITELY workable now.
Click to expand...

Well the workaround for all those workarounds without compensating here and there, having to cut things you don't want to; is the AxeII :)
 
Austin Quinn quickly pointed our my error. The AX8 was connected to my Mac because I was also showing AX8-Edit to my friend. No wonder I didn't notice it before...

I was showing the AX8 and Helix to a friend. I dialed up Mark Day's 80s preset to demo scenes and Amp X/Y. I haven't read this whole thread, but I was surprised by the audio gap when switching scenes. But stranger is that the audio gap seems to happen AFTER the sound changed to the new sound. Anyone else hear this?
 
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