Key change in pitch

[andyp13]

I have a solo that requires the use of harmony using the pitch in 3rds. Towards the end of the solo there’s a few quick modulations from F (Dm) - C - A can I change keys of the pitch block via CC or PC so I can write the info into a MIDI track So the Axe changes automatically etc or do I have to do duplicate scenes each with different keys - if so will they change quickly and seamlessly enough - changes are for one bar each and quite a quick tempo..

 

[Ugly Bunny]

Yep. You'll have to add a Modifier to the parameter(s), and then link the Modifier to an External Controller, and then attach the External controller to a CC.

This is what I do with my virtual capo so I can use the same preset for a number of songs that drop 1/2 step, full step, etc. Just be aware that if you attach a modifier to it, and you use the preset for other songs, you'll need to set up the CC that you attached to the External Controller individually for each song. Or at least make sure you set the default value of that External Modifier. Just play with it; it's not too intimidating to figure out, but it's definitely possible.

 

[andyp13]

Yep. You'll have to add a Modifier to the parameter(s), and then link the Modifier to an External Controller, and then attach the External controller to a CC.

This is what I do with my virtual capo so I can use the same preset for a number of songs that drop 1/2 step, full step, etc. Just be aware that if you attach a modifier to it, and you use the preset for other songs, you'll need to set up the CC that you attached to the External Controller individually for each song. Or at least make sure you set the default value of that External Modifier. Just play with it; it's not too intimidating to figure out, but it's definitely possible.

Iv never used a modifier before (not overly sure how to)…so I take it that the keys are not assignable to CC…what about using pitch blocks on ABCD across 4 scenes each one set to a different key…would that work?

 

[unix-guy]

Yep. You'll have to add a Modifier to the parameter(s), and then link the Modifier to an External Controller, and then attach the External controller to a CC.

This is what I do with my virtual capo so I can use the same preset for a number of songs that drop 1/2 step, full step, etc. Just be aware that if you attach a modifier to it, and you use the preset for other songs, you'll need to set up the CC that you attached to the External Controller individually for each song. Or at least make sure you set the default value of that External Modifier. Just play with it; it's not too intimidating to figure out, but it's definitely possible.

Changing the tuning of the Virtual Capo is not the same as changing the key. There's no modifier possible for that as the key doesn't currently support it.

 

[unix-guy]

Iv never used a modifier before (not overly sure how to)…so I take it that the keys are not assignable to CC…what about using pitch blocks on ABCD across 4 scenes each one set to a different key…would that work?

You don't even need to change scenes - just change channels.

Of course, you can also do it with scenes.

 

[andyp13]

You don't even need to change scenes - just change channels.

Of course, you can also do it with scenes.

Hi, Change channels? How do you mean….I’m aware of Presets and scenes but what do you mean by channels? Is that not the same as scenes?

 

[Ugly Bunny]

Hi, Change channels? How do you mean….I’m aware of Presets and scenes but what do you mean by channels? Is that not the same as scenes?

Each block has 4 channels. You can have, say, channel A assigned to Scene 1, then Channel B assigned to Scene 2, or have Channel A on all scenes, or Channel A on Scenes 1 & 2, Channel B on Scenes 3 & 4, Channel C on Scenes 5& 6, etc. It's very handy. And yes, you can assign a CC to switch channels (which is what I should do, actually lol). But setting it up to the modifier and External controller is another way. Essentially, right click the little circle on the parameter, set the modifier to External 1, then go into the MIDI menu and assign a CC to External 1.

With the Channel method, you'd go into the MIDI menu and assign a CC to the Pitch Block's channel selection, then set up each channel as you like and recall them with MIDI. (see page 75 of the manual) You won't need to switch scenes just to switch channels if you do it with MIDI.

A third way would be to use scene controllers, but then you'd basically need 4 scenes for those 4 keys. Each scene could effectively change the pitch block's parameter as you like. See page 62.

 

[unix-guy]

Hi, Change channels? How do you mean….I’m aware of Presets and scenes but what do you mean by channels? Is that not the same as scenes?

ABCD are channels of the blocks.

You can change them with the FC or via midi.

If you're using midi, the process is similar to scenes: you send the CC# with a CC data value of modulo 4 (scenes uses modulo 8). In simplest terms, these will work:

0 == A
1 == B
2 == C
3 == D

 

[andyp13]

ABCD are channels of the blocks.

You can change them with the FC or via midi.

If you're using midi, the process is similar to scenes: you send the CC# with a CC data value of modulo 4 (scenes uses modulo 8). In simplest terms, these will work:

0 == A
1 == B
2 == C
3 == D

Ah, gotcha, I was getting a bit confused between them as I was thinking A on scene 1 B on scene 2 C on scene 3 etc…which is why I was thinking whats the difference . I didn’t know that the channels could be set to a CC#
however arnt the scenes set to 0=scene 1, 1=scene 2 etc?

 

[unix-guy]

Ah, gotcha, I was getting a bit confused between them as I was thinking A on scene 1 B on scene 2 C on scene 3 etc…which is why I was thinking whats the difference . I didn’t know that the channels could be set to a CC#
however arnt the scenes set to 0=scene 1, 1=scene 2 etc?

They use different CCs (just like pretty much everything else in there).

Typically CCs are just on/off (except for expression pedals)... But scenes and channels use the CC plus the specific value to select which one.

 

[andyp13]

They use different CCs (just like pretty much everything else in there).

Typically CCs are just on/off (except for expression pedals)... But scenes and channels use the CC plus the specific value to select which one.

Is there a list of CC# for the Axe III… I can change presets and scenes by selecting the Preset with PC then the scenes are just 0 to 7. how do I select for example Scene 1, pitch change bank B.? Scene 1, pitch change bank C etc..

 

[unix-guy]

Is there a list of CC# for the Axe III… I can change presets and scenes by selecting the Preset with PC then the scenes are just 0 to 7. how do I select for example Scene 1, pitch change bank B.? Scene 1, pitch change bank C etc..

Scenes aren't "just 0-7". You have to send a specific CC and the value (the 0-7).

Also, not to muddy the waters, but 0-7 is just the first set of values that works. It could just as easily be 8-15 or 16-23, etc.

One other thing I forgot about the Channels is that you need to assign a CC per block instance you want to change on (such as the Pitch block 1).

Unlike the Axe Fx II, there are not predefined CCs on the Axe Fx III.
Here's some relevant manual pages:

 

[Moke]

Since you already have the scene change commands figured out, the easiest way would be to use a different scene. Copy the scene to another scene, then just change the Pitch block channel, rename that scene, and save the preset.

 

[Ugly Bunny]

Is there a list of CC# for the Axe III… I can change presets and scenes by selecting the Preset with PC then the scenes are just 0 to 7. how do I select for example Scene 1, pitch change bank B.? Scene 1, pitch change bank C etc..

No, you can assign CCs freely to any function as you need them. I keep a spreadsheet. I made a whole video series on YouTube for working with the Axe Fx III and Behringer FCB1010 MIDI pedal, so I needed to keep organized.

So to answer the second half, what I do is this. The example song is Undone by Weezer:
1) Send PC #1 - this takes me to the preset; it defaults to scene 2 (dirt).
2) Send CC #34, value 0 - this takes me to scene 1 (clean)
3) Send CC #36, value 127 - this turns on my Pitch Block
4) Send CC #38, value 59 - this tunes the Virtual Capo down to down 1/2 step. This is accomplished, as mentioned above, by the CC controlling the External Controller, which is assigned as a modifier in the Pitch Block's Shift parameter.

Now, I'm on a clean scene, downtuned 1/2 step.

What you could do is (assuming your pitch block is already on), is replace step 4 with:
4) Send CC #?? (whatever you assigned to the pitch block's channel function) with a value of 0 for Channel A. Then, when you need to switch pitches, send CC #?? (the same value as before) with value 1 for Channel B, etc.

 

[jamongrande]

While I haven’t played with this, couldn’t you use the step sequencer and the new functionality to step through the harmony roots, programmed as needed, with one button?

 

[Bakerman]

The pitch block's "key" parameter is modifiable. If adjusting only the key gets the harmonies you need, you don't really need multiple channels or scenes for this.

 

[andyp13]

The pitch block's "key" parameter is modifiable. If adjusting only the key gets the harmonies you need, you don't really need multiple channels or scenes for this.

How do I do that? I just need C major (Ionian), Bb major and A Dominant.
I just had a play and copied the Pitch to B C & D and changed the key etc on each one then assigned to a different scene..then I need assign each scene a CC# (not done that yet)

 

[Bakerman]

How do I do that? I just need C major (Ionian), Bb major and A Dominant.

Navigate to the key parameter and push C knob (hardware) or right-click in Axe-Edit, choose any External # as source.

In Setup: Midi/Remote: External, set that External # to the CC# you want to use.

The CC value will determine the key. Each key corresponds to roughly 1/12 of the (0-127) value range. You can just remember 10 = A, 20 = Bb, etc. in this case.

Note that "A Dominant" probably wouldn't sound good with key = A while scale is Ionian/major, but key = D might work there. Can you link a recording of the song?

 

[unix-guy]

The pitch block's "key" parameter is modifiable. If adjusting only the key gets the harmonies you need, you don't really need multiple channels or scenes for this.

I don't know why I was thinking it wasn't... Thanks for correcting me on it.

 

[andyp13]

Navigate to the key parameter and push C knob (hardware) or right-click in Axe-Edit, choose any External # as source.

In Setup: Midi/Remote: External, set that External # to the CC# you want to use.

The CC value will determine the key. Each key corresponds to roughly 1/12 of the (0-127) value range. You can just remember 10 = A, 20 = Bb, etc. in this case.

Note that "A Dominant" probably wouldn't sound good with key = A while scale is Ionian/major, but key = D might work there. Can you link a recording of the song?

Hi Bakerman, the solo comes in at 7:55

in the vid I played the harmony as I couldn’t quite get the harmoniser correct.
It’s mainly a II-V in C (Chords are Dm9 - G13 so tonal centre of C Ionian works…(when the sax comes in with the guitar) it goes Dm - C - Bb - A 7 and this is the part I need the changes in the harmony. The guitar plays an arpeggio of each chord sliding down/up a semitone…