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Kemper DSP vs FM3

Fractalist

New Member
simple question, even if profiling is different from modeling approach, how many times FM3 horse power is higher compared to 400mHz Freescale NXP chip found in 7 years old Kemper?
Is that comparable to iPhone one -> iPhone XS?
Is that 2X? 1000x?

I mean Kemper is still much more expensive than FM3 will be... despite having old hardware.
 

Petr Bachan

New Member
This is still remarkable re Kemper - with such an old hardware and such good sound.
I am on wait list for FM3 and really looking forward, but I owned Kemper and liked it a lot.
 

Fractalist

New Member
To me my choice is done =

Amp quality = Kemper/FM3 (#AxeIII block) 1/1
FX quality =. 0/1
Audio USB. =. 0/1
Size-Form factor 0/1
New-hype excitement. 0/1
Famous users that have better ears than me 1/1
Screen-editor on the go. 0/1
Money to spend for profiles. 0/1
Forge your own sound and learning. 0/1
Dev leppard/Mayer (0/1)

FM3 10/10
Kemper 1/10

But things may change if Kemper announces a KII with big step up and smaller form factor.
 

BBN

Fractal Fanatic
To me my choice is done =

Amp quality = Kemper/FM3 (#AxeIII block) 1/1
FX quality =. 0/1
Audio USB. =. 0/1
Size-Form factor 0/1
New-hype excitement. 0/1
Famous users that have better ears than me 1/1
Screen-editor on the go. 0/1
Money to spend for profiles. 0/1
Forge your own sound and learning. 0/1
Dev leppard/Mayer (0/1)

FM3 10/10
Kemper 1/10

But things may change if Kemper announces a KII with big step up and smaller form factor.
Only thing I'll correct you on is 'Money to spend for profiles'.
Kemper comes with free profiles and there are thousands of free ones available from their community.
Yes there are people who sell well groomed Kemper profiles, same way there are people who sell well groomed Axe FX presets.
So it's a tie there.....IMO.
 

crdark

Inspired
That's one thing I dislike about the Kemper: if you want to start from scratch, you'll need an amp and the possibility to mic it properly.

With the Axe FX you have everything ...
 
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BBN

Fractal Fanatic
That's one thing I dislike about the Kemper: if you want to start from scratch, you'll need an amp and the possibility to mic it properly.

With the Axe FX you have everything ...
Or download one of the thousands of free Kemper profiles that someone already created.

I'm a die hard Fractal user - but I also own a Kemper.
They both have their pros and cons.
Find a 'good amp profile' for the Kemper is just as fast as dialing in a good preset on the Axe.
They're both amazing solutions, they just go at digital reproduction a different way.
 
I have bought so many presets from kieth marrow and Lars lamassse and all of em
Hundreds of dollars in kemper
That’s why I’m thinking I might just buy from a used seller because for 1000 it’ll sound as good as the fm3
All fx and other options are limited , fm3 is better all around

But. Yeah that’s on top of some incredible recording presets...well whatever, just kinda down if I gotta wait past July now
 

hippietim

Fractal Fanatic
Or download one of the thousands of free Kemper profiles that someone already created.

I'm a die hard Fractal user - but I also own a Kemper.
They both have their pros and cons.
Find a 'good amp profile' for the Kemper is just as fast as dialing in a good preset on the Axe.
They're both amazing solutions, they just go at digital reproduction a different way.
The difference is that with the Kemper you have to try dozens of profiles to find a good one. With the Fractal, you just choose the amp you want and the knobs work like you expect.
 

BBN

Fractal Fanatic
The difference is that with the Kemper you have to try dozens of profiles to find a good one. With the Fractal, you just choose the amp you want and the knobs work like you expect.
As with anything, it depends on the pilot.
I can spend as much time finding an IR in the Axe as I would finding a good profile in the kemper.

I was skeptical of the Kemper for years....then I borrowed one and found it was quick and painless to get amazing tones.

Only point I'm making is that 'time it takes to get a good tone' is quick with either, and for me is in no way a decision factor in which I would chose to fire up on a given day.

There are many other things I could say could be improved (like lack of editor), but finding tones is easy.
 
Computers are about software, not hardware.

Hardware only becomes interesting when we consider two computers running the same software.
 

Jason Scott

Power User
The difference is that with the Kemper you have to try dozens of profiles to find a good one. With the Fractal, you just choose the amp you want and the knobs work like you expect.
Unless you're connecting the Axe to a real cab, you still have to find a suitable IR.
 

Rex

Legend!
Computers are about software, not hardware.

Hardware only becomes interesting when we consider two computers running the same software.
Ooh, I can’t resist...


You can build a machine to do anything in hardware.

The best software in the world is useless without hardware.


Hardware just got interesting. :) (Sorry for the hijack.)
 

FreeMind

Power User
I guess profiling/taking an Amp snapshot is far more CPU friendly than modelling each component of a tube head.

Anyway, one thing that Kemper has over Fractal products is that they have a powered version.
I think a powered Axe FX would tottaly be a winner. A powered lunchbox kemper is all that is needed to get a show going, while the Axe FX has to be placed inside a rack with a power amp, which makes it lose the form factor/portability competition here. Not as much of a deal with FM3 tho, as it is just a small pedalboard thing...
 
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flying_walrus

Experienced
I guess profiling/taking an Amp snapshot is far more CPU friendly than modelling each component of a tube head.

Anyway, one thing that Kemper has over Fractal products is that they have a powered version.
I think a powered Axe FX would tottaly be a winner. A powered lunchbox kemper is all that is needed to get a show going, while the Axe FX has to be placed inside a rack with a power amp, which makes it lose the form factor/portability competition here. .
in theory, yes. fractal could ship a powered version and have more check boxes filled...

but in practice every fractal product is on a waitlist for months or years, so they seem to be selling OK
 

hippietim

Fractal Fanatic
Unless you're connecting the Axe to a real cab, you still have to find a suitable IR.
It's never been an issue for me. I just pick a cab that seems like it ought to match the amp I'm using fairly well. It never takes more than a couple attempts for me and this is easily done from both the front panel and from the editor.

When I had a Kemper, finding a suitable profile was an endless search that was just a pain in the ass. So many of the profiles were terrible. I have two friends that use Kempers, they both gave up on free ones and bought profile packs. And even then it's a pain in the ass. I did a recording session a while back with one of them and we flipped through a bunch of profiles to find the right amp with the right EQ and gain structure because the Kemper controls don't work like real amps. The guy I did the recording session with is now on the FM3 wait list.

Just my experience.
 

Ghost_of_Cain

Inspired
I don't get it. Why Kemper didn't release any kind of floor unit, based on the toaster? That would be something! If they could squeeze it into enclosure about the size of their dedicated floor controller and pack it all together...

I love Kemper's simplicity, but the fact that it's doing perfect snapshots of specific amp/cab settings instead of meticulously simulating amp components and interactions between them - makes the EQing and adjusting to different playing situations - for me - a bit of PITA. You basically have to create a profile for every different sound, every different purpose, every different playing environment you're in.
 

benvigil

Experienced
I still don't understand the whole "Kemper EQ doesn't work like the real amp" argument. I've never played 99% of the amp models/profiles in the AxeFX or the Kemper. And I never will. Ever.

When you tweak a preset in the Axe, do you avoid the bright cap settings or never touch the GEQ because "it's not like the original amp"? That's just as ridiculous an idea in my opinion.

The parameters in the KPA can take an amp profile places the original amp could never go (just like the deep parameters in FAS products). People act like you have to scroll through millions of profiles to find "the one" with the perfect EQ. You don't. Some of my favorites profiles are ones where I liked the gain "structure" and then tweaked the gain level, added amp compression, GEQ, etc. There are a bunch of "best of" threads on the Kemper forums with truly incredible profiles.

The most famous KPA profile ever (the profile that Cliff was asked by a customer to duplicate on the AxeFX), is a profiled Morgan AC20 with a number of parameters changed drastically from the original profile that take it into a territory the original amp could never go. And it's glorious.

Yeah, I wonder if SRV plugged into a Dumble and complained about it not being a Fender Vibroverb . . .
 

Jason Scott

Power User
It's never been an issue for me. I just pick a cab that seems like it ought to match the amp I'm using fairly well. It never takes more than a couple attempts for me and this is easily done from both the front panel and from the editor.
The cab is only half the story. The mic and its position play a pivotal role as well, and add another layer of complexity to the search.

When I had a Kemper, finding a suitable profile was an endless search that was just a pain in the ass. So many of the profiles were terrible. I have two friends that use Kempers, they both gave up on free ones and bought profile packs. And even then it's a pain in the ass. I did a recording session a while back with one of them and we flipped through a bunch of profiles to find the right amp with the right EQ and gain structure because the Kemper controls don't work like real amps. The guy I did the recording session with is now on the FM3 wait list.
Not sure why you had such a difficult time finding profiles. If you sort profiles by their rating on the Exchange, there are countless great profiles to be had, in my opinion, and many of the free Rig Packs that are included with Rig Manager are frightfully good, as well. Further, there are so many good, free profiles offered by commercial vendors that the choices are virtually limitless. Personally, I much prefer sorting through profiles than IR's any day of the week. When auditioning profiles, the amp and its settings often change from profile to profile, so on the whole there's often a lot more tonal variety when sorting through profiles.
 
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