Is the AX8 very susceptible to induced noise?

Gene

Inspired
Hi, I recently bought an Ax8. I have an Axe Fx 2 XL in the studio also but it never leaves it.

I was playing at a wedding last night in Ireland and using the Ax8 main out 1 - L sent to the front of house PA via XLR. Out 2 was sent to an RCF Art 715 A mk II active cab for on stage monitoring. Both out 1 and 2 set to L&R sum and out 2 echo set to out 1 to mirror.

I was using a new Godin xtSA guitar which has H S H configuration.

When I opened up the volume on the guitar I was getting a bad hi freq interference in both FOH and monitor. I tried the following to get rid of the noise.

I tried the following to get rid of the noise:

A different lead between the guitar and the input of AX8
A humbuster cable between the out 2 and the RCF, I tried it with both the TRS in the AX8 out and the TRS in the RCF in.
Different XLR from out 1 to mixer.
Plugged in different IEC mains chords and swapped out mains extension leads for different ones and ran the power from different sources.
But alas, all to no avail.

I took the guitar and plugged it into a keyboard amp running from the same mains source and went through the various HSH combinations with no hiss or hum at all.

I had to run with it in the first half but changed to my Tech 21 Fly rig plexi for the 2nd half of the show and got it done. Still a little bit of noise but not NEAR the same as with the Ax8 and........... the Dr z preset was relatively clean whereas the FlyRig was a plexi running hot with loads of overdrive.....

So, I am wondering what is the story here are these units very prone to induced noise, do I need a power conditioner? The venue has good electrical wiring and no other gear on the stage (there were six of us) was making any weird sounds. A few other presets I auditioned in the AX8 last night had the underlying noise too.

My AXE FX 2 XL is only used in studio and never leaves, this is why I went for the AX8.

I am a little disappointed by this to tell the truth. Our other guitarist using his Marshall stack and intellifex had no issues at all.
I am gigging 25 years and normally this kind of noise can result from the amp or something in the signal chain being plugged into the same mains plugboard that is also supplying power to stage lighting etc but this was not the case here.

Any ideas what is wrong here?
 
When I opened up the volume on the guitar I was getting a bad hi freq interference in both FOH and monitor. I tried the following to get rid of the noise.
That means the interference was getting in through your guitar.


I took the guitar and plugged it into a keyboard amp running from the same mains source and went through the various HSH combinations with no hiss or hum at all.
The keyboard amp has a lot less gain and a much lower input impedance.


...are these units very prone to induced noise...
No. Quite the opposite.


...do I need a power conditioner?
A power conditioner won't help, because the noise is coming in through your guitar.


Our other guitarist using his Marshall stack and intellifex had no issues at all.
Different guitar, different guitar cord.
 
I don't have any noise problems with my AX8 and sometimes we're forced to run stage lights and PA using the same phase.
 
Once in a while I encounter some noise. It is more pronounced with single coil guitars. It is typically the result of a large number of par can stage lights and a low ceiling.
 
I'll just share my own experience, which - based on comments in this forum and in a support ticket - seems to be exceptional. Nevertheless, it is my experience, and it's persistent.

My AX8 exhibits high noise floor. This is in comparison to my Pod HD500 (not a great piece of hardware). It exhibits as hiss or static when I touch the strings - the noise gate chokes it off otherwise. It happens regardless of patch, guitar, environment, lighting, cord, or power supply. I've tried various combinations including:

  • Guitars
    • Line 6 Variax with piezos (DEAD silent in all other applications)
    • EMG-SA active pickups
    • Kinman noise-cancelling pickups
    • Humbuckers
    • Shielded and non-shielded pickguards
  • Environment
    • Different rooms (away from electronic/computer equipment)
    • Different buildings (at church, at home)
    • Different power outlets / circuits
    • Different power cords
    • Added power supply filter
    • Different (and new) guitar and speaker cables
    • Floor wedge vs. headphones
No combination tested provided meaningful reduction in the noise I was hearing. I've been convinced to accept it as a unique problem I face, and a cost that's worth it for the amazing power of the unit. That said, it's my #1 wish of things I could change in my AX8 experience, and despite significant time (and reasonable $) investment, I haven't yet solved it.
 
I'll just share my own experience, which - based on comments in this forum and in a support ticket - seems to be exceptional. Nevertheless, it is my experience, and it's persistent.

My AX8 exhibits high noise floor. This is in comparison to my Pod HD500 (not a great piece of hardware). It exhibits as hiss or static when I touch the strings - the noise gate chokes it off otherwise. It happens regardless of patch, guitar, environment, lighting, cord, or power supply. I've tried various combinations including:

  • Guitars
    • Line 6 Variax with piezos (DEAD silent in all other applications)
    • EMG-SA active pickups
    • Kinman noise-cancelling pickups
    • Humbuckers
    • Shielded and non-shielded pickguards
  • Environment
    • Different rooms (away from electronic/computer equipment)
    • Different buildings (at church, at home)
    • Different power outlets / circuits
    • Different power cords
    • Added power supply filter
    • Different (and new) guitar and speaker cables
    • Floor wedge vs. headphones
No combination tested provided meaningful reduction in the noise I was hearing. I've been convinced to accept it as a unique problem I face, and a cost that's worth it for the amazing power of the unit. That said, it's my #1 wish of things I could change in my AX8 experience, and despite significant time (and reasonable $) investment, I haven't yet solved it.
That's really weird, I had the Pod hd500 too a few years ago and it had a lot of hiss/noise issues compared to the ax8 which for me is dead silent.
I think you should contact support at this point but first I would check a few things: when I built pedals and amps years ago I learned that hiss is often caused by a bad ground connection so check that all the nuts of the jack connectors on the back are well tightened, and if you have a multimeter ensure that there's continuity between all the ground points (eg: between sleeve of jacks and the metal casing of the ax8).
 
Thanks, I did contact Support, and they were responsive, but ultimately unable to help me resolve the issue. I tried disabling the power amp emulation, which immediately caused the noise to cease. Matt (Fractal Support) wrote:

"The virtual power amp is a huge component of the AX8. I don't think we can learn much by comparing how things sound with it disabled.
If anything it just confirms that the present noise is being amplified by the presence of a virtual tube amp, as you'd expect."

In short, Support believes the problem is introduced before the unit, not in the unit. Despite many attempts to isolate causes outside the AX8 (including new and different cables, both for the guitar input and the speaker output), I've not been successful.

I agree that it's odd that the POD HD500 shows less noise. I since sold it - even with the noise I have, the value proposition of the AX8 is far, far greater. But it was notable, to the point that when I started using the AX8 instead of the HD500, the worship leader noted both the improved tone but also increased noise. It drove me to alter how I muted during times I wasn't playing as a result.
 
I will try to get time to upload the main Dr. Z patch I was using one but it was doing this with others presets too. The unit with same guitar was not doing this at home where I programmed the unit . But as I explained the other guitarist had no issues with his HSH strat. The pickups in my Godin are HSH wax potted from research I did online.
 
That means the interference was getting in through your guitar.



The keyboard amp has a lot less gain and a much lower input impedance.



No. Quite the opposite.



A power conditioner won't help, because the noise is coming in through your guitar.



Different guitar, different guitar cord.
The Peavey KBA/300 amp I plugged into has a channel with HiZ switching which I engaged to check the Godin xtSA. It gave no noise. THe Dr.Z patch was a cleanish country tone.

I guess it could be a problem with the wiring in the venue but when I replaced the AX8 with the FlyRig Plexi running clean and with heavy plexi distortion I had very little interference, a wee bit but nothing compared to the AX8 and I was using the same guitar etc. This is what led me to believe the AX8 could be susceptible to noise.
 
I'll just share my own experience, which - based on comments in this forum and in a support ticket - seems to be exceptional. Nevertheless, it is my experience, and it's persistent.

My AX8 exhibits high noise floor. This is in comparison to my Pod HD500 (not a great piece of hardware). It exhibits as hiss or static when I touch the strings - the noise gate chokes it off otherwise. It happens regardless of patch, guitar, environment, lighting, cord, or power supply. I've tried various combinations including:

  • Guitars
    • Line 6 Variax with piezos (DEAD silent in all other applications)
    • EMG-SA active pickups
    • Kinman noise-cancelling pickups
    • Humbuckers
    • Shielded and non-shielded pickguards
  • Environment
    • Different rooms (away from electronic/computer equipment)
    • Different buildings (at church, at home)
    • Different power outlets / circuits
    • Different power cords
    • Added power supply filter
    • Different (and new) guitar and speaker cables
    • Floor wedge vs. headphones
No combination tested provided meaningful reduction in the noise I was hearing. I've been convinced to accept it as a unique problem I face, and a cost that's worth it for the amazing power of the unit. That said, it's my #1 wish of things I could change in my AX8 experience, and despite significant time (and reasonable $) investment, I haven't yet solved it.
What happens to the noise when you open the noise gate, and then unplug your guitar cord from your AX8?
 
...when I replaced the AX8 with the FlyRig Plexi running clean and with heavy plexi distortion I had very little interference, a wee bit but nothing compared to the AX8 and I was using the same guitar etc.
This was with noise gates disabled on all rigs?
 
Ok, if im understanding correctly, you have already tried your AX8 in 2 different locations.

Does the unit produce the noise with out anything plugged in the input?

Have you tried plugging just a short cable in the input? does the same noise comes up?

Have you tried a simple preset with just a strait input to output connection? does it still sounds the same?

Can you route your output signal to output 2 and test it if this still sounds the same?
 
What happens to the noise when you open the noise gate, and then unplug your guitar cord from your AX8?

It's been a while since I tested it, and it's worth another try. I did check my support ticket, and found I tested something similar:

What's interesting to me is that the noise is present when I have no cable attached to the AX8 for any inputs (Instrument, In 2) when the FX Loop is added and enabled. This is the same noise I'm trying to eliminate.

To avoid hijacking this thread, I'll likely open another about my problems. I really do appreciate the help this forum continues to provide.
 
What happens to the noise when you open the noise gate, and then unplug your guitar cord from your AX8?
Didn't do that on the night. But , the AX8 was quiet with no guitar plugged in....... noisy with guitar plugged in.......same guitar leads with FlyRig a little bit of noise. To give you an idea the 'interference' I would call it when the guitar was plugged into the Ax8 on scale 1-10 on a cleanish preset - an 8. Same guitar and leads etc into Fly rig clean sound - a 1 and with hefty plexi distortion engaged - a 2.
 
Ah, I will get to the bottom of it hopefully, but if it continues I will sell it on. I have always managed to eliminate these things until that night.

When I play with this group we get to a wedding and after the wedding party are up from their tables following their meal we have to go 'hell for leather' to get on and ready to start to play as the venue staff are clearing the floor of dining tables for dancing later, there is no time to sort problems out we just have to do the load in, plug in and sound check as you go ..thats it. Most of the time you are half way there as we use a digital mixer with recallable scenes that get you close.
Any problems get sorted an hour and a half later when tea and sandwich come out for audience and we get to take a short break. That when I did all the changing of leads, trying different power sources etc, after exhausting all that I hadn't any more time but had to put the FlyRig in instead of the ax8 to get the gig finished. In the first half the noise was masked while playing but I'd have to turn guitar off to keep the noise down when announcements been made between dance selections.
We will see if this continues with different venues and guitars etc..........

I'm sure I will get it resolved though I hope as I love the Fractal stuff, I will take my Axe FX 2 XL next time too in case..........
 
Last edited:
D...the AX8 was quiet with no guitar plugged in....... noisy with guitar plugged in.......same guitar leads with FlyRig a little bit of noise.
Same stage location, too? The fact that it goes away when nothing is plugged into the input means that the interference is getting in through your your guitar or cable. Silence in that situation means that the AX8 isn't generating the noise by itself. Something before the AX8 is causing interference. Maybe a neon light gets switched on (they're one of the nasty parts of playing guitar in a bar), or there's a difference in gain, or there's a dodgy connection...
 
Back
Top Bottom