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Is it me or the sound guy?

vika12

Inspired
I've been gigging with the FM3 into a Xitone 12" Active Wedge (which I use a my monitor) linked out to FOH. Usually, my volume and headroom are fine. At this last gig, however, I could hear myself fine, but as far as the audience was concerned I got lost in the mix. I had Output 1 at 3 o'clock (3/4 up). The sound guy disappeared sometime during the first set and returned later and, in between sets, he said he had turned me up. Very frustrating. My question is what can I do to build in more volume on my presets so I can adjust more readily on the fly if this happens again? This may be a basic question, but my presets have seemed adequate at other gigs. Thanks.
 

vika12

Inspired
sounds like he wasn't taking his jobbery seriously, so I doubt that he was worried about where your guitar was in the mix.
No doubt, but I can't afford to rely on these jamokes -- some I know and they're great, others are _________ (you know)
 

REDD

Fractal Fanatic
If he couldn't take care of it at FOH then I would think you need a hotter signal or more mids? If your output configuration is on -10 you might switch it to +4.
 

brianv4

Fractal Fanatic
If i know i'm going to be in that situation, like at a casino gig where the tech disappears because he has other things to do once we're setup, i turn down my output knob to the FOH during the line and sound check so I have a way of turning up if needed. I must say though, 90% of the techs I deal with in AC are damn good.

And like @REDD just said, make sure your output is at +4
 

fcs101

Experienced
My question is what can I do to build in more volume on my presets so I can adjust more readily on the fly if this happens again?
I think your only viable option to do this is to rely on a volume pedal. I would suggest setting your min vol at whatever you typically have the preset level and conduct your sound check here, then allow yourself some margin of adjustment upward.

PS-If the sound guy were for some reason a sound girl and you were married to her, then it's definitely your fault!
 
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GiRa

Power User
If the person at the desk did a decent gain staging and then you boost your signal, you're gonna get distortion from the desk, not the good one.
There could even be a compressor or limiter which will actually lower your volume if the signal is too strong.

I think talking with them and listening from the PA is much easier and more effective than sneaking in a boost.
 

vika12

Inspired
If the person at the desk did a decent gain staging and then you boost your signal, you're gonna get distortion from the desk, not the good one.
There could even be a compressor or limiter which will actually lower your volume if the signal is too strong.

I think talking with them and listening from the PA is much easier and more effective than sneaking in a boost.
I agree. But this guy split ... so I need an escape hatch from my end
 

chrisjnyc

Power User
I've been gigging with the FM3 into a Xitone 12" Active Wedge (which I use a my monitor) linked out to FOH. Usually, my volume and headroom are fine. At this last gig, however, I could hear myself fine, but as far as the audience was concerned I got lost in the mix. I had Output 1 at 3 o'clock (3/4 up). The sound guy disappeared sometime during the first set and returned later and, in between sets, he said he had turned me up. Very frustrating. My question is what can I do to build in more volume on my presets so I can adjust more readily on the fly if this happens again? This may be a basic question, but my presets have seemed adequate at other gigs. Thanks.
I would setup a null filter block at the end of your chain. I would normally set it to default on with -3DB, and off at +3DB, and a press and hold to 0DB. This give you a few options for more volume that you can quickly do with your feet (ie: while you are playing).
 

Rex

Legend!
I keep my FM3’s Output knob at noon. That’s what FOH gets. If I need more volume, I have room to turn it up. The knob lets you adjust levels in measured amounts across all scenes presets at once. Fortunately, I almost never have to do that.
 

Moke

Axe-Master
Vendor
We got so tired of this, and the monitors/side-fills not being what we had at sound check for House of Blues shows where we were the opening act... That we started using our mixer. Gave them three monitor sends to be routed to the three wedges in front. Our drummer uses headphones, so he already has his own mix from our mixer. Then a Left and Right main mix out for FOH.

They didn't like the idea at first. Made a couple of tweaks at sound check, and saved that mix for future shows. But it worked great. Did it that way every time since. The best monitor mix and FOH sound that we ever had there. And I had total control...
 

chris

Legend!
It doesn’t matter how much level you send. They can reduce it to 0 at the board if they want. The mix is the job of the mixer (gear) and the person operating it.

If you suddenly send more level during the gig, you can clip the mixer making it sound worse.
 

la noise

Fractal Fanatic
I kind of feel like this has become endemic in live settings. FOH has changed so much in the past 20 years or
so. I loathe the bass heavy mixes that are now very much the norm. Guitar gets drowned out and dumbed down
at the board.

The popularity of EDM, Hip-Hop, and Pop Music Production has changed what we hear in live settings and the
way FOH engineers literally "hear" music and how they mix the house.

Am I wrong?
 

chris

Legend!
I kind of feel like this has become endemic in live settings. FOH has changed so much in the past 20 years or
so. I loathe the bass heavy mixes that are now very much the norm. Guitar gets drowned out and dumbed down
at the board.

The popularity of EDM, Hip-Hop, and Pop Music Production has changed what we hear in live settings and the
way FOH engineers literally "hear" music and how they mix the house.

Am I wrong?
I still the think most “engineers” put vocals 5 to 10 dB above the instruments. It’s so irritating. Why even have a band at that point.
 

Rex

Legend!
It doesn’t matter how much level you send. They can reduce it to 0 at the board if they want. The mix is the job of the mixer (gear) and the person operating it.

If you suddenly send more level during the gig, you can clip the mixer making it sound worse.
True. But at some gigs, there are realities that must be faced and dealt with. Inattentive sound people who don't care about the band, the sound or the audience, for instance. In those cases, boosting a feed by a few dB can make all the difference, and there's often enough headroom to do that. It's not mixing the way it should be, but sometimes it's the only available solution.
 

RoshRoslin

Experienced
I've been gigging with the FM3 into a Xitone 12" Active Wedge (which I use a my monitor) linked out to FOH. Usually, my volume and headroom are fine. At this last gig, however, I could hear myself fine, but as far as the audience was concerned I got lost in the mix. I had Output 1 at 3 o'clock (3/4 up). The sound guy disappeared sometime during the first set and returned later and, in between sets, he said he had turned me up. Very frustrating. My question is what can I do to build in more volume on my presets so I can adjust more readily on the fly if this happens again? This may be a basic question, but my presets have seemed adequate at other gigs. Thanks.

I will add one thing that I think is very important. Take feedback from audience members with a grain of salt unless they're musicians or live sound engineers. Even well meaning friends have a skewed perspective on what a mix should sound like. They can also be influenced by where they are in the room or who they're there to see etc. I have a couple regulars who see different bands I play in who insist that the guitar is never loud enough. Most of the time I have to respectfully disagree. As much as I want to crank up and go crazy I also want to be respectful of the gig.

What you can do is use a separate output to your wedge to just have more volume coming off the stage if needed without affecting the FOH signal.
 
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