Is anyone else not blown away by the rotary speaker in the AXE?

REDD said:
I love it. It does what I need. I use the thing sparingly but it seems fine to me.
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I've done shows where the thing is on almost the whole time - just a little bit of it in the background, as if the cabinet was one stage but not mic'ed. it's glorious. You have the be a little creative in the routing and mix/panning of the thing and it blows away the in-line pedals.
 
I'm three months into my Fractal experience (AX8) and IME; the rotary is excellent: In addition to adjustments other posters have recommended: Mic Spacing and Distance and Stereo Spread are masterful at creating all manner of perceptual spaces. Rotor length and the other controls adjust the focus, sense of movement, and tonal balance.

What I came up with (probably SOP for experienced users) is to assign a footswitch (via control switch 1) to the rate and set a low eg: 2.2 hz and a high eg: 6.8hz, the slope to 75% and the dampening to about 700ms: that way you get that ramping up and down in speed when you switch between between the two rates. Adjust to taste. Or you could go with setting up X/Y each with a different rate, and turn on the auto engage (fast): that way when you step on the switch it ramps up to speed from the off position, ramps back down to off from on.

What I find particularly useful is that you can adjust this (more than other rotary sims I’ve come across) to really fit a particular guitar tone: Lets say you have a cleanish tone that calls for a large space and a softer quality so the harmonics poke through rather than getting muddy: you can do that. Conversely, a more sustaining lead tone might benefit from a rotary setting with more definition and a tighter sense of space: A few adjustments - and you’re there.

Weird warbly sounds are possible by assigning a second LFO controller to mix and using a triangle or sawtooth wave: or use the random and a low LFO rate and a medium damping etc. to get either subtle or pronounced drift, depending on what you set for the high and low mix parameters. I spent a couple of hours coming up with all the above, which suit my needs and compulsion to screw around, but there are other frontiers to explore when the need arises.

It's probably in there: start spinning the knobs! :D
 
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From my experimentation, the latest Rotary algorithm is technically accurate. The pitch shift to speed ratio (both approaching and retreating) and LFO shape of pitch change are dead nuts on (maximum pitch change when the horn is at 90 and 270 degrees, zero pitch change at 0 and 180). All parameters work exactly as I would expect. But for some reason, it doesn't have the vibe of a Leslie. I use a bullshit word like "vibe", because I am incapable of quantifying exactly why the Rotary does not move me as much as other simulators. Same for the phase shifters and Univibe. My Roland Univibe model is more enjoyable to use, for reasons unknown.

The Rotary and Phasers sound great, but no matter how I adjust them, they sound clinical (yes, another bullshit term). And I've dived in deep. No real complaints though. I use them without incident or comments from listeners.
 
i love the rotary, but i also think its a little sterile. when compared to other rotary pedals, you can hear that it lacks grit on the top end and some woody-ness in the midrange. turning up the drive parameter helps a lot (and i always add some), but i think it would really help if there was at the very least a tone control for the drive, so we could shape the frequency response.
 
The tube amps in the real Leslie 122 are really a big part of the real Leslie tone.

Pedals all have their various takes on an idealized sound and to me aren't authentic to the real 122 Leslie. But I do like the tone of various pedals. Authenticity is not something I have to have to enjoy a sound.

Modeling the Leslie 122 amp would probably get the current rotary all the way there. Would be a cool amp model addition. Maybe using 2 amp blocks it could work in a preset that way too?

I believe there is a conflict with an efx block and amp block in regards to what DSP they run on so the rotary effect and leslie amp model would have to be separate blocks?
 
Sleestak said:
I use a continuous controller for this purpose. I have played and recorded through actual Leslie speakers, and I know that's not their behavior, but sometimes I like to set the rotary speed in the middle of the range.
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Hi, what is a "continuous controller?"
 
lqdsnddist said:
Sometime I think effects like the vibe and/or fuzz aren't ideal, but then I hear guys like Tyler Grund just kill it (with a pretty old firmware version at that)

Listen around the 1 minute mark.... great uni-vibe "throb" even with some dirt, which is actually pretty rare for a lot of vibe pedals I've owned. My Sweetsound Mojo vibe for example sounded super thick and lush totally clean, but add some dirt and it was very muddy. Others like my Roger Mayer vibe handled dirt really well, but just didn't have that nice asymmetrical throbbing effect. The Axe actually sits in a pretty nice middle ground, especially with Tyler's chops

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I just bought a MXR Uni Vibe. I tested out a few, and the MXR was my fav. Sounds killer
 
I wonder how much things like changes in room reflections as the speaker moves on a real rotary play into the vibe and perception. It seems like some kind of IR process (not the existing one obviously) could maybe capture some of this. Just a layman's thought, but it seems like there are so many changes that occur in a room as a speaker spins, it would be hard to capture in a single stereo algorithm and have it be 100% accurate.
 
haffner1 said:
I wonder how much things like changes in room reflections as the speaker moves on a real rotary play into the vibe and perception. It seems like some kind of IR process (not the existing one obviously) could maybe capture some of this. Just a layman's thought, but it seems like there are so many changes that occur in a room as a speaker spins, it would be hard to capture in a single stereo algorithm and have it be 100% accurate.
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Its a huge part of the done. I used to have a Vibratone cabinet (like a Leslie without a horn) which SRV used, and it sounded awesome down in my basement, sound bouncing off all the walls, but on a big outdoor stage, totally lost its mojo. Even mic'd with 2 mic's it didn't sound quite as good as it did in a room.

Just the nature of the thing. A true spinning speaker (or baffle) physically spreading sound around an enclosed space just is going to be hard to beat
 
Part of the Leslie's unique character is the way the two change speeds at different rates, creating all the unique shimmers and swirls as they do so. The horn is smaller and lighter and changes speeds fairly quickly, only around 100-200 ms or so. The bigger, heavier wooden drum ramps up much slower in comparison, taking up to a few seconds. They also spin in opposite directions and at slightly different speeds. The slow speed called chorale is around 50 RPM ( ~0.83 Hz) for the horn and 40 RPM (~0.67 Hz) for the drum. The fast speed called tremolo is around 400 RPM (~6.67 Hz) for the horn and around 340 RPM (~5.67 Hz) for the drum. I usually use somewhere in the ballpark of 0.65 Hz for slow and 6.5 Hz for fast for more traditional Leslie sounds, but you could just as easily set them to some meter of the song tempo as well. Here's a handy online converter for tempo in BPM to rate in Hertz: http://testtone.com/calculators/lfo-speed-calculator

If you use modifier dampening to slow the rate transition, you affect the horn and drum speed transitions equally. To control them separately, use the Hi Time Constant and Lo Time Constant parameters in the rotary block.
 
lqdsnddist said:
Its a huge part of the done. I used to have a Vibratone cabinet (like a Leslie without a horn) which SRV used, and it sounded awesome down in my basement, sound bouncing off all the walls, but on a big outdoor stage, totally lost its mojo. Even mic'd with 2 mic's it didn't sound quite as good as it did in a room.

Just the nature of the thing. A true spinning speaker (or baffle) physically spreading sound around an enclosed space just is going to be hard to beat
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Agreed. A mic'd Leslie sounds cool, but it pales in comparison to hearing one in person. Sort of like the difference between a mic'd piano and actually sitting at a Steinway grand. The recording still sounds good, but it's just not the same impact.
 
mr_fender said:
Agreed. A mic'd Leslie sounds cool, but it pales in comparison to hearing one in person. Sort of like the difference between a mic'd piano and actually sitting at a Steinway grand. The recording still sounds good, but it's just not the same impact.
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Sounds like the amp in the room versus mic'd amp discussion.
 
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