IR trouble? Forget all the commercial IRs... !!!

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DM45110

Guest
I recently hab trouble finding the sweet spot in my Cab settings. It was like nothing had the mids and the response I was looking for. I used IRs from Redwirez and Ownhammer and I don't want to bash what they are doing, but I guess they are doing something wrong or telling us lies or something else (no blame, but searching for a reason I had that trouble with their IRs...).

So I decided to make a little experiment, which I thought would not end in good results. But I tried and it was just the right step to "my sound" with more than great results. I shot a lot of IRs of my own cabinets. Exactly, I did this:

I shot:
- 16 IRS of every speaker I have in combination with a mic and a cabinet. (each Centimeter one IR, from edge to cap, on axis and angled)
- I've got 2 speakers (Celestion V30 and Celestion G12M Greenback), 10 suitable mics out of the locker (cheap ones and expensive mics; ribbons, condensers and dynamics) and 3 different cabinets (1x12 open back, 4x12 straight closed back, 4x12 slanted closed back)
- So all in all I've shot about 1920 IRs, of which I could choose exactly the one I need for a sound.
- I know it's a bit overkill to shoot that much!


My obversations:
- All the bass and treble that annoyed me in those commercial IRs is gone. It just sounds like it sounds in real life, on stage and in the studio when you mike a cab.
- No need for all those virtual parameters like high cut, low cut and proximity anymore. It's all captured right in the "real" IR. Choose IR, perhaps adjust delay when going stereo and start playing.


So my advice for you is to shoot your own cabs (with a method that suits your power amp) and enjoy playing your real cabs. They are so much better than what they offer you for money.

By the way: My favorite IR is my "4x12 straight V30 SM57 on axis 13cm" IR.

Again, I don't want to blame the commercial IR factories to do something wrong intentionally but something is quite different in their IRs and mine. I don't know what it is.... if you know it, tell me....nevertheless, try it!

I hope this helps if you have trouble with IRs.
 
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Do you mic your SM57 13cm away from the cab when you are live or recording?

Maybe this is the difference. OH far-field IR's don't have that excessive low-high end for example.
 
to ertan:
"13cm" means that it's the close-miked position 13cm from the edge of the cabinet. Weird kind of measurement, but in the end it's just a name to have them sorted.

to yek:
The only thing I am telling you are my (long-term) experiences.... I have tried a lot of things with their IRs to have them sound right and what I've found is, that my own work better right after shooting the IR. I'm not an expert for IRs, capturing and all these things, but I do hear and feel things going on when playing guitar.

I don't doubt that there is knowledge and experience, but I trust my ears, my hands and my own experience more than their knowledge and experience. I read a lot of times we should trust our ears in this forum...

I am sorry for the sentence you've quoted, yek, I should have written that better. There is no "but" now.... I've just tried to explain my thoughts, searching for an explanation of what I was hearing and if this is the only complaint, I am cool with it...

to sustainerplayer:
No you can't try my IRs, because I made the mistake of not dumping them from the Axe to my computer.... If anyone knows a way to get them out of the box into my pc, please let me know and then of course you can try them.
 
yek said:
Unjustified and uncalled-for statement against some very knowledgeable and experienced IR producers.
Not cool.
Click to expand...

For sure. Just because a person may not prefer the sound of a producer's IR's, it certainly doesn't mean they're lying or "doing something wrong". But it appears the OP has apologized for that, kinda.

To the OP...it's great you've found your solution. But it's just that...YOUR solution. There is nothing at all wrong with what Redwirez and Ownhammer are doing. I've auditioned tens of thousands of IR's before settling on two cabs from Redwirez that work for me. All the others aren't "wrong", just not a fit for me.
 
"I guess they are doing something wrong or telling us lies or something else"
Far out - your third post and you're saying stuff like that about well respected members of the Fractal community? Not cool
 
But, but, but, I don't have a bunch of cabs and speakers and power amps to shoot IRs of - nor do I want them. To me, the whole benefit of commercial IRs is that I can have the tone of any cab/mic/mic
position I want without owning a bunch of cabs/mics - just some FRFR. So if it's true that no commercial IRs are any good, then I'm lost.

PS - I've been buying celestion IRs lately precicely because they are brighter and sound very realistic to me. Go figure.
 
Cut him some slack guys. If you read his posts in context, you can see he wasn't trying to start something or make an accusation. A poor choice of words, as he's already admitted.

Jul H said:
If anyone knows a way to get them out of the box into my pc, please let me know and then of course you can try them.
Click to expand...

Use Fractal-Bot. Click the "receive" tab. Select your device. Set destination folder on your computer (where the Axe II will be exporting the cabs to). Click "begin." Check items you want to export (user cabs).

https://www.fractalaudio.com/fractal-bot/
 
Rane said:
Use Fractal-Bot. Click the "receive" tab. Select your device. Set destination folder on your computer (where the Axe II will be exporting the cabs to). Click "begin." Check items you want to export (user cabs).
Click to expand...


Thank you! I will do that in the next few days!
 
sprint said:
But, but, but, I don't have a bunch of cabs and speakers and power amps to shoot IRs of - nor do I want them. To me, the whole benefit of commercial IRs is that I can have the tone of any cab/mic/mic
position I want without owning a bunch of cabs/mics - just some FRFR. So if it's true that no commercial IRs are any good, then I'm lost.
Click to expand...


You're definitely not lost.... Did I sound like "All you commercial IR users are lost?"...... sorry for that, wasn't my intention.... it's meant for those who still have cabs and speakers at home, perhaps resting in a dark chamber. They're still an option to take into the equation of the axe fx. And self shooting sure can bring great results without having all the ultra expensive pro-gear....
 
I've spent days shooting thousands of IR's with thousands worth of gear. Ownhammer IR's are better than my DIY without exceptions. I embrace the situation: yes, it's home made and my own cab, but for higher class sound, Ownhammer wins...
 
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Jul H said:
For those who want to try.... would appreciate some feedback if they're working for you, too....
Click to expand...

Thanks. I'll try them out later and let you know.

EDIT: Seems that OP deleted his post where he actually posted his IR's.

Haven't had time to try them out yet.
 
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If you had trouble with two of the best IR producers there are, then it means the problem resides with you and only you. I’d change the thread’s title and rephrase some of the post itself. It’s cool and all that you share your captures and point of view, but the way you put it is simply wrong.
 
all you're saying is it's your preference, which you could have said without besmirching the good name of companies that make products that thousands of users love and enjoy. I for one have no issues that you refer to...and when you use 3rd party Ir's, are you using single mic or mixes?
 
I appreciate the fact that you shared. I used a C++ with one of your cabs on the x and a ML Sound Lab on the Y with the exact same settings for both. I fail to hear your claim that all these manufacturers are lying and that yours are better. Your's are good, don't get me wrong. I can see an use for them. But your claims are over the top. ML has more body and low mids and just growls. Yours was fizzy and not much body to it. So the good mids in a guitar tone seem scooped out. I tried an Ownhammer next and had the same experience.

So your claims are far fetched and quite honestly unfair. I know this is possibly not how you meant it, but the word "lie" translates across all languages.

So thank you and I think you did a good job. But I was turned off by the presentation and the fact they don't live up to that presentation. I realize tone is subjective, but to my ears, the difference was clear.
 
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