Instrument cables

[Rex]

I found this interesting. From a premierguitar article:...

There's a lot of good information in that article, but one point of confusion:

Among most manufacturers today, the consensus “sweet spot” for capacitance is between 20 and 30 pF per foot...

I'm not sure sure how he's defining "sweet spot," but he says it's between 20 and 30 pF per foot. I've never seen any manufacturer achieve less than 20, so the "sweet spot" must be the lowest capacitance available.

It can't be a sonic "sweet spot," because ten feet of 20-pF-per-foot cable has a total capacitance of 200 pF; a 20-foot length of the same cable will have twice as much capacitance (400 pF), which can cause a significant change in sound.


A personal story: a friend of mine bought an Evidence cable (a high-dollar cable that comes with a hefty dose of smoke-and-mirrors advertizing copy). He raved about how much brighter and clearer it was than his old cable. I gave a listen, and sure enough, on his G&L Strat with Kinman SCs, more highs were getting through. Then we tried the same two cables on my Ibanez 540-SQM with stock Quantum pickups. We heard no difference at all between cables on that guitar.

His guitar had pickups that were more succeptible to the capacitance added by the guitar cable, and the difference was the difference between a high-capacitance cable and a low-capacitance one. That low capacitance can be had from George L and several other manufacturers, for half the price of the Evidence cable.

 

[Deltodo]

I use Sommer Cable, The Spirit with neutrik plugs. Good tone and almoast indestructable! :lol

I use the same, great sounding cable!
I buiilt a few, various length with neutrix plugs and the quality is outstanding. Just one drawback, the coating of the cable makes it a bit sticky, which is not a problem for short cables but is a bit of a hassle for the longer ones.

 

[Trazan]

They not only sound completely different and more/less congested, but they "feel" completely different. If you like the dull and congested sound of cheap cables, great.

As I already stated, don't take my word for it. Buy or try out all the different cables you can and find out what works best for you. I did.

I don't question the difference, I'm saying the difference is only capacitance. The cable business don't want to to know this since the dollars are in the "magic". Obviously, the cable should be of proper construction, shielding, termination...but even the cheap segment has that.

Capacitance. Test it for yourself. Different brands with the same capacitance, or with different capacitance and lenght resulting in the same total capacitance. They sound the same.

 

[Matt Steele]

I tried Lava cables as well. I had him make me one for my wireless unit, he told me he would have it made in a few days prior to me ordering when I asked him about any wait time, it took him 2 weeks to put it in the mail!!!!!! I wrote him about it, and he acted as if he was in a haze, very un-professional. But then, I get the cable and it doesn't work correctly. So I write him, and he sends me another which took 1 month to arrive, "my goodness that dude was slow on all accounts" and the 2nd one did not work correctly, so I told him, I will send you both of these junk cables back, I want a refund, he was mouthy about it with major attitude, the guy is a clown, and my point I suppose is, if you're lucky to get one that works then he's great "if you catch him in a mood to actually ship your cable quicker than umm 2 weeks or a month" then great for you, but YMMV greatly with that guy, i'd rather purchase cheap Guitar center cables than ever deal with his meat head mentality. You want custom length or custom cables, go Death Valley, Irv has been around a long time, and is a true gentleman who will not "string you along like the lava guy"

Actually, I'm NOT recommending Lava cable. What I do recommend is the Mogami Platinum. It's what I am currently using and I consider it the best cable I've ever used.

Like I said earlier, I had issues with the Lava Cable, and I can attest to your comments concerning the customer service with Lava Cable, the guys I dealt with are total asses.

My story... At the time, I was using my Lava Soar, and I realized the braided cable was coming undone from the end. There's a lifetime warranty with these cables so I contacted them asking if they could fix it for me. I remember it took a VERY long time for them to get back to me, but they did. I sent out the cable and ordered a replacement not knowing how long it would take to get my original back. I can't recall, but I ended up sending e mail after e mail and ended up calling the guys to gt them to send me the new cable I ordered and get my fixed cable back. I remember it getting really heated and me saying that I did not intend on ever dealing with them again.

Amazing sounding cables but total dicks to deal with. I would not recommend Lava cable to anyone. I am running 100% Mogami at the moment and am very happy.

 

[RDeraz]

the biggest bullshitters in the audio industry are power cable companies.quotes like "my sound improved 100% when i used this cable to power my amp."

i mean...really?what do they do,realign the electrons coming from the wall outlet?
$195 for a damn power cable.....come on!

 

[cobbler]

Capacitance. Test it for yourself. Different brands with the same capacitance, or with different capacitance and lenght resulting in the same total capacitance. They sound the same.

^This! Your buying decision should be decided on 1)capacitance 2)type of plug 3)build quality.

 

[Jason W.]

I've had really great results with the Monster Rock 500 eq'd cables, but when I can afford to, I'd really like to buy a bunch of the Mogami Platinum cables to see if I've truly been missing out on some sound quality. Do the Mogami Platinum cables really put the Monster's to shame?

 

[Matt Steele]

I've had really great results with the Monster Rock 500 eq'd cables, but when I can afford to, I'd really like to buy a bunch of the Mogami Platinum cables to see if I've truly been missing out on some sound quality. Do the Mogami Platinum cables really put the Monster's to shame?

Check out that thread I posted. I believe the shootout was between Monster vs Lava. There was a huge difference between them. HUGE. Just read the comments. I can tell you there is little sound variation between Lava Soar and Mogami Platinum. The Lava might sound ever so slightly better to my ears, but the Mogami is the better constructed cable for sure.

 

[groovenut]

After 30 years of using mostly junk cabling, I decided to try Mogami. I have to say I am impressed with how noise free their cables are. I sourced and built my own sets from bulk using Neutrik connectors and I dont think I would go back, especially for recording. They are durable and about as neutral as I have tested. I do also have some 30 year old cables that I use specifically because of their higher resistance, but that is a different topic.

 

[UnsungHeroGuitars]

Interesting

I've built custom racks, mic / instrument / power / lighting cables, various multicores and all sorts for years - not once have I experienced 'noise' or been aware of 'better' or 'worse' cables

That is either sheer luck, or perhaps more likely, down to the fact that having proper kit wired properly makes all the difference

 

[groovenut]

Interesting

I've built custom racks, mic / instrument / power / lighting cables, various multicores and all sorts for years - not once have I experienced 'noise' or been aware of 'better' or 'worse' cables

That is either sheer luck, or perhaps more likely, down to the fact that having proper kit wired properly makes all the difference

I never experienced any noise with cables other than the guitar input cable. Given the small signal and high input impedance, it's really easy to get "motion noise" from cabling that has crap sleeve insulation. This is, IMO, where the Mogami shines over cheap cables.

I dont think it makes as big a difference with interconnect cabling and I still use inexpensive generic cable for that.

 

[Rex]

Interesting

I've built custom racks, mic / instrument / power / lighting cables, various multicores and all sorts for years - not once have I experienced 'noise' or been aware of 'better' or 'worse' cables

That is either sheer luck, or perhaps more likely, down to the fact that having proper kit wired properly makes all the difference

Passive guitar signals are susceptible to cable capacitance, incomplete cable shielding, and cable microphonics (at high gain). Line-level signals are pretty much immune to those things, except at the extremes (though poorly-shielded cables can induce crud on line-level signals).

If you've never heard the difference between various guitar cables, you owe it to yourself to experiment a bit. Get a 15- to 20-foot length of bargain-basement guitar cable and a similar length of cable rated at 20 pF per foot. Test them using a guitar with low-output single-coil pickups. Make sure the guitar's tone knob is all the way up. The difference will be stark.

 

[UnsungHeroGuitars]

I've no reason to question any of your points groovenut or Rex - largely because neither myself, or anyone in the band, have ever had a guitar with those single-coil, low output pick ups!

Always been humbucker, active or variax electronics

 

[Ole]

Isn't this alot like Pick choise?
If it works for you great, but might not work for others.
And believing that something is better, may often make it better...or... something like that

 

[Matt Steele]

Isn't this alot like Pick choise?
If it works for you great, but might not work for others.
And believing that something is better, may often make it better...or... something like that

This really does NOT work for me this kind of thinking. Sure, if anyone likes the sound of your guitar being muffled and congested, sure go ahead and use a Monster cable or the like. But we are in 2013 and most of us on this board are using the Axe FX II. The most sophisticated piece of guitar hardware known to man. Why wouldn't you want to feed it all your guitar can? Then if you want to dial in your sound on a patch to sound more low fi/more congested, you can. But I just do not understand the thinking behind actually wanting to rob your guitar and the Axe of everything it's capable of.

I mean come on guys, you're shelling out how much for the Axe FX II? Why would you want to skimp on a cable that is going to give you sub par performance???

I dont think it makes as big a difference with interconnect cabling and I still use inexpensive generic cable for that.

I agree with this, although I do know guys that have their entire rigs set up with high end cabling and end up spending thousands of dollars just for cables. One of the reasons I love the Axe FX is because it can get everything done in one place. The amp, cab and effects aren't connected through a series of cables increasing the chance for signal loss. I cringe at the guys that have all those pedals connected through crappy patch cables. :nightmare:

 

[Trazan]

Why would you want to skimp on a cable that is going to give you sub par performance???

Essentially, what you are saying is that everybody should use active pickups and dial in the flavor in the Axe Not sure everybody will agree!

 

[Ben Randolph]

I use Armor Gold: Armor Gold Cables

Great cables and reasonably priced. Plus they look cool. No complaints.

 

[cobbler]

After 30 years of using mostly junk cabling, I decided to try Mogami. I have to say I am impressed with how noise free their cables are. I sourced and built my own sets from bulk using Neutrik connectors and I dont think I would go back, especially for recording. They are durable and about as neutral as I have tested. I do also have some 30 year old cables that I use specifically because of their higher resistance, but that is a different topic.

We are on the same page here. I bought bulk Mogami cable and Neutrik connectors years ago and never looked back. If you have basic soldering skills it's a no brainer.

 

[Matt Steele]

Essentially, what you are saying is that everybody should use active pickups and dial in the flavor in the Axe Not sure everybody will agree!

Way to put words in my mouth. When did I say anything about active pickups? I only have 1 guitar with active pickups. When did this conversation become about pickups?

I'm simply talking about incorporating a quality cable that allows the true sound of your guitar through, be it passive or active pickups.

Hey, I tried helping add to the discussion from my experience. If you don't appreciate my advice, don't take it.

 

[feedback]

Actually, I'm NOT recommending Lava cable. What I do recommend is the Mogami Platinum. It's what I am currently using and I consider it the best cable I've ever used.

Like I said earlier, I had issues with the Lava Cable, and I can attest to your comments concerning the customer service with Lava Cable, the guys I dealt with are total asses.

My story... At the time, I was using my Lava Soar, and I realized the braided cable was coming undone from the end. There's a lifetime warranty with these cables so I contacted them asking if they could fix it for me. I remember it took a VERY long time for them to get back to me, but they did. I sent out the cable and ordered a replacement not knowing how long it would take to get my original back. I can't recall, but I ended up sending e mail after e mail and ended up calling the guys to gt them to send me the new cable I ordered and get my fixed cable back. I remember it getting really heated and me saying that I did not intend on ever dealing with them again.

Amazing sounding cables but total dicks to deal with. I would not recommend Lava cable to anyone. I am running 100% Mogami at the moment and am very happy.

Yeah man I totally agree, total ass that dude was. I use to use Mogami's and they're my 2nd favorite cables. But they are not as good to my ears as the DeathValley cables. That doesn't mean I am suggestion anyone who has a full set of Mogami's to go and order Deathvalley's, but I would suggest anyone who needs custom length cables at the highest quality I have found, "and I have tried just about every cable named in this thread" to look into this company. Not only is the cables top notch, but you get the service!!! I use to make my own cables, but I just don't have the time, and so I spend a few bucks more and have Irv who owns Deathvalley do them. He is so fast that I was even shocked. My first order I must of ordered 5 cables and 3 different sizes LOL. He had my cables out by the next day!!!!!! Then my next order a few more cables, had it out same day!!!!! Over the years he has stayed in contact as well, just a stand up person.