Increasing Volume Over Time with Sequencer

A

Alex Kerezy

Inspired
Hi,
I want to INCREASE the volume over time (on a delay.....but it could be a reverb or anything).

I was "trying" to use a sequencer to do this, but I do NOT want the sequencer to run all the time; I want it to start or literally 'run' when I play a note, and then step through it's sequence. So, I "thought" the right way is to tie or add a modifier to the run control, correct? An envelope follower it seems. When I play a note, the sequencer run control should be changed to 'RUN'; and I can adjust the release on the modifier so that it doesn't run once and stop (which is what I need).

I can not get the sequencer to switch or go to 'RUN' when I play a note (it's soOOOOOoo frustrating).

I've attached my syx file. I'm using a Kalimba instrument; but honestly it shouldn't matter.

H E L P!!

Why is it soOOOOoo difficult to automate an increase in volume over time???

Seq-01.png

Seq-02.png

Seq-Volume01.jpg


Seq-Volume02.jpg
 

Attachments

  • Kalimba.syx
    48.2 KB · Views: 3
Maybe some more background on exactly how you need this to work? Is it a one-shot event? Etc... ?

Why don't you attach the Envelope (or ADSR) controller directly to the parameter? The 'Attack' and 'Release' parameters can be set for up to 10 seconds.
 
Simple..... on the Kalimba (wood box with metal prongs or tines in the picture above).......... I want to play one note; and make it into a string pad like sound. I have a decent sound/tone............but NO SUSTAIN.

The box and pickup are very simplistic, and unlike electric guitars (some of which have good sustain) the volume QUICKLY decays after the initial attack.

I do not want a volume swell string pad, I really want near (as near as possible) instantaneous string pad. It DOES NOT have to go on forever or anything. Right now at 70 bmp, the note played on the Kalimba dies before the 2nd beat. Of course.... the nature of the instrument is that it has no sustain capabilities.

In my Preset - I used the pitch shifter to add an octave higher, and the fifth up and the synth pad as well --- all to add/produce the string pad sound; again.... I like the sound...... but there's no sustain; it dies.


PLEASE.... PLEASE.... PLEASE..... don't say something stupid like 'get a keyboard'; those type of comments infuriate me. This is supposedly the best Fx processor on the market (or so you claim); I'm not asking too much here...............

HELP ME sustain the note!!!
 
(or so you claim)?? I don't work for Fractal Audio. I know that you're frustrated. Hang in there, I am sure that this can be figured out.

I can't load the preset right now. I am on an older firmware working on something for a client. And have a gig tonight. I will check this out tomorrow, if somebody else hasn't solved this by then.

Any chance of a dry DI recording of that instrument that can be re-amped though the preset?
 
Sorry about that..........
ATTACHED are two mp3 files. One is a single note, the other is repeated single notes. I put them in a zip file since you can't seem to attach mp3 files.

It's a small boxed instrument. To answer the other posted question: Yes; I add a lot of both amplification and compression. To make the sound both louder and to even the dynamics. I may be using the wrong compressor, I don't know. You can hear how quiet the instrument is.

You depress the tines with your thumbs so it's easy to get an uneven volume level (I'm a beginner).
 

Attachments

  • Kalimba Recording.zip
    646.8 KB · Views: 7
The problem with the Envelope controller is as the note decays, it most likely falls below the threshold fairly quickly and stops the Sequencer? I think that the 'ADSR' controller would work better, connected directly to the parameter(s).

The note seems to ring out longer than I would have thought.

Were those clips recorded with a mic? They need to be 'DI' clips, recorded in a mono track through USB input 5 in your DAW to be able to be re-amped.

Also, A compressor is perfectly suited for something like this, if increasing the volume of the instrument over time is the goal. But not if controlling a Reverb or Delay parameter is the goal.
 
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Here is another idea, not to replace what you are trying to do, but to augment it.
Use a synth patch that swells (quickly) to take over the Kalimba sound.
The initial attack of the Kalimba gives it it's character. Then replace the note as it sustains (too short) with a synth which you can tailor to mimic the sound of the Kalimba sustain. A little bit like the old D-50 synth. It had in memory just the attack samples of instruments and used generators to mimic the sustain portion of the sound.
 
Alex Kerezy said:
PLEASE.... PLEASE.... PLEASE..... don't say something stupid like 'get a keyboard'; those type of comments infuriate me. This is supposedly the best Fx processor on the market (or so you claim); I'm not asking too much here...............
Click to expand...
You know, you have a habit of continually making comments like this in your posts.

It's really quite irritating to me

Just because something is "the best" doesn't make it easy.

Just because you want it doesn't mean it's even possible.

Many of the things you've asked for in previous posts are very complex or esoteric.

And you often get great advice/suggestions anyway!

But your whole approach to asking for help could be improved a lot, in my opinion.

I suspect Moke, Simeon, Bakerman or Admin M@ would come up with a solution if it's possible.
 
Patzag said:
Here is another idea, not to replace what you are trying to do, but to augment it.
Use a synth patch that swells (quickly) to take over the Kalimba sound.
The initial attack of the Kalimba gives it it's character. Then replace the note as it sustains (too short) with a synth which you can tailor to mimic the sound of the Kalimba sustain. A little bit like the old D-50 synth. It had in memory just the attack samples of instruments and used generators to mimic the sustain portion of the sound.
Click to expand...

So...how do I set a modifer on the synth block volume to increase ....as the volume from the input (the Kalimba) is decreasing???
 
..... sorry; but when you spent THIRTY HOURS.....of your time, trying to get something as simple as.... automate an increase in volume over a set time, trigged by an single input note............ THIRTY HOURS, and you can't get it to work; you would be frustrated as well. You'd be cussing up a storm.

then when, in your frustration you ask for help you're ostracized.... it's pretty sad to be honest
 
Alex Kerezy said:
So...how do I set a modifer on the synth block volume to increase ....as the volume from the input (the Kalimba) is decreasing???
Click to expand...
You don't. You set the attack speed on the synth block to whatever setting you need. Your Kalimba sound probably starts decaying after 100 ms or so. Maybe less. Set the synth attack so that the blend is as un-noticable as possible.
 
Alex Kerezy said:
trigged by an single input note
Click to expand...
Please understand that I'm attempting to help and in no way meaning to insult your intelligence.

The quoted comment makes me wonder if there's simply a misconception of what the Axe Fx III is capable of. It is not a tone generator or sampler like a MIDI/VST instrument that can be triggered with a device. It is an effects processor that can only process and alter a signal created outside of the Axe III. It can extend the length of a sound by repeating it with delays and other effects.

You're wanting to have a single sound increase slowly over time but wanting to use a sound that lasts less than a couple of beats. Something that creates a sound that decays that quickly can typically be extended only so long before artifacts from the effect(s) being used would be heard.

We need to figure out how to extend the sound to the length you need without altering it before it can be used with the other tools mentioned to increase it's volume.
 
everybody take a chill pill

you're using the wrong modifier to try and achive the effect you want. the sustain on the kalimba is extremely short, and the run parameter will only stay active when the volume of the incoming note is above the threshold. as soon as it drops below the sequencer will stop.

you need to use the adsr, which will complete the cycle, even if the volume of the incoming note goes below the triggering threshold.

there are other ways to achieve what you want. one would be to tie envelope to reverb length, so that when envelope is low, time is high. each time you play a new note the old reverb tail will be killed and a new one will be created from the new note (fiddly to set up though).

there are probably others, but i've literally just got up and i haven't even had my cuppa tea yet. i'll have a think.
 
Pretty much what you mentioned. ADSR (sustain mode, retrig = on) to get the swell. That could be combined with delay or reverb to extend the decay time, with ADSR lowering the effect output level and feedback/time initially on each note to clear the previous tail.
 
Finally had a chance to temporarily update my Axe-Fx III to 16.05 and load this up. Like I stated in post #7, as well as other people in this thread, the ADSR seems to do what you were attempting. I also noticed some other issues, so I made some other edits listed below.
  • Removed all of the 'Sequencer' controllers.
  • Added the ADSR 1 controller to the 'Level' parameter in the 'Multi-Delay' block.
  • Setup the ADSR 1 controller to take 4 seconds to ramp up and about 2 seconds to ramp back down.
  • Set it up to make the 'Level' parameter to go from -5 dB to +5 dB.
  • Set the 'Diffusion Mix' parameter to 100% to 'defuse' the delay attacks. (no real need anymore for the second Reverb block?)
  • The Synth block was reacting to Pitch block in front of it, as it monophonic (can't deal with more than one note at a time).
  • Put the Pitch and Synth blocks in parallel to avoid this.
  • Tweaked the compressor a bit.
Let my know if this helped at all, Moke

P.S., It seems that there may be a bug in the controller implementation of the new 'Pause' option? I couldn't make it do what you were attempting either?
 

Attachments

  • Kalimba (Moke) 16.05.syx
    48.2 KB · Views: 3
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