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I'm amp less again.

luke

Fractal Fanatic
Before the Axe Fx I use to own over 30 amps. A while back I picked up a Friedman Stevens, which is a great amp, but the volume and other issues relegated it to a studio prop. Sold it today. I can't see me ever trying a tube amp again.
 

retro_dad

Experienced
Bummer. I'm assuming when you refer to its volume you mean that it's too loud? I had always thought that Friedman's had a good master volume? Not that it matters, I'm sure when you have an amp like that you really want to crank the heck out of it [emoji3]
 

FractalAudio

Administrator
Fractal Audio Systems
Moderator
There's no such thing as a "good" master volume, just degrees of less bad. The whole key to a tube amp is power supply behavior. If the amp isn't operating near it's maximum power it won't have the dynamics. Power Scaling helps but it's not the same because the power and output transformers don't scale.

I keep lugging my tube amps out of storage when I read people saying "there's nothing like the real thing" thinking I'm going to experience some "mojo". Never happens. Sure the amp in the room thing is cool for a couple minutes but the novelty of that wears off quickly. So then I load the amp down or use an iso-cab and I go "meh, rather play the Axe-Fx".

I'm not an AC-30 guy but I dialed in a patch tonight that I played for over an hour. Turned up the Supply Sag and Power Tube Bias a bit, set Hi Cut to around 6 and used a 2x12 and 1x12 in stereo. IMHO I can't see how anything could've sounded better.
 

pima1234

Fractal Fanatic
Agreed. Every now and then I want to plug into a tube amp for the fun of it. Then, I turn the Axe FX back on, and don't miss it.

I didn't care for Power Scaling, but a similar technology by the creator of Maven Peal amps was pretty effective.
Patent US5635872 - Variable control of electronic power supplies - Google Patents
There was a lot of back and forth on forums (TGP) about how they are essentially the same thing. I wouldn't know. Even so, neither sounded as good at lower volume. It's just not possible.

Even low wattage amps (1-2 watts or even lower) don't cut it , although they definitely serve their purpose. Attenuators have the same problem, but again, serve a purpose.

I think back about how much I spent on gear to tame tube amp volume, pre-Axe FX...
 

musicmishka

New Member
I hear ya Luke...I recently made the move to an AxeFX after hearing a good friends ...I just began selling my Amp collection after running into the same problems that Luke found...sure I had my choice of great sounds but after a few minutes of guilt from using the volume I was needing to get the tone I was seeking, I went back to the AxeFX and the smile that crossed my face the first time I plugged into my AxeFXII came right back...and that's only one of the reasons I love being a member of the Fractal family.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

thunder100

Inspired
Agreed. Every now and then I want to plug into a tube amp for the fun of it. Then, I turn the Axe FX back on, and don't miss it.


I think back about how much I spent on gear to tame tube amp volume, pre-Axe FX...
(Un)fortunately YES

Since FW 17 or so my tube amps get little playing.And its no hassle to turn them on ( no lugging all in reach) but today they can do nothing better then the AXE,apart tube glow maybe.

Even my holy grail MKIIC is now better in Axe then in my Mark V

And since the myrad of new IR's its no deal anymore

I am glad that I life now and can watcxh a paradigmen change( 10 year ago would you believe sombody saying Hetfield plays anything electronic ?)

Good times

Roland
 

GazzaBloom

Inspired
There's no such thing as a "good" master volume, just degrees of less bad. The whole key to a tube amp is power supply behavior. If the amp isn't operating near it's maximum power it won't have the dynamics. Power Scaling helps but it's not the same because the power and output transformers don't scale.

I keep lugging my tube amps out of storage when I read people saying "there's nothing like the real thing" thinking I'm going to experience some "mojo". Never happens. Sure the amp in the room thing is cool for a couple minutes but the novelty of that wears off quickly. So then I load the amp down or use an iso-cab and I go "meh, rather play the Axe-Fx".

I'm not an AC-30 guy but I dialed in a patch tonight that I played for over an hour. Turned up the Supply Sag and Power Tube Bias a bit, set Hi Cut to around 6 and used a 2x12 and 1x12 in stereo. IMHO I can't see how anything could've sounded better.
I love your enthusiasm for your products Cliff, it's very reassuring that the guy steering future developments is a true user and has passion about tone. This assures me that we will not received products that are compromised by corporate marketing plans and product cost targets, we will continue to receive products and updates that will deliver the best tone, feel and replication of tube amps that are possible.

This makes me want to dial in that AC30 tone myself now!
 

Zwiebelchen

Fractal Fanatic
The AC30 is one of those amps you always forget about because it's not the "go-to" amp you can just dial in on the fly...
Unless you're in a U2 cover band, that is.

I always have to force myself trying it out. "You haven't tried the AC30 for that song yet..."

And whenever I do that, I just realize again that it's a pain in the ass to deal with and just take something that is less demanding.
I just don't get why this amp is so legendary.
 

Velokki

Inspired
There's no such thing as a "good" master volume, just degrees of less bad. The whole key to a tube amp is power supply behavior. If the amp isn't operating near it's maximum power it won't have the dynamics. Power Scaling helps but it's not the same because the power and output transformers don't scale.

I keep lugging my tube amps out of storage when I read people saying "there's nothing like the real thing" thinking I'm going to experience some "mojo". Never happens. Sure the amp in the room thing is cool for a couple minutes but the novelty of that wears off quickly. So then I load the amp down or use an iso-cab and I go "meh, rather play the Axe-Fx".

I'm not an AC-30 guy but I dialed in a patch tonight that I played for over an hour. Turned up the Supply Sag and Power Tube Bias a bit, set Hi Cut to around 6 and used a 2x12 and 1x12 in stereo. IMHO I can't see how anything could've sounded better.
Care to share that AC30 patch? ;)
 

pima1234

Fractal Fanatic
The AC30 takes a little time, but it's worth it.

Try the Matchless and AC20 amps too. There is something unique about EL84s. Early break up, heavy bass (which is why the AC30 is designed the way it is, I guess), ability to get very creamy drive. There are plenty of other EL84 amp models in the Axe FX that are different than the AC30 circuit.

The above list doesn't include Tom Petty, by the way. It should.
 
There's no such thing as a "good" master volume, just degrees of less bad. The whole key to a tube amp is power supply behavior. If the amp isn't operating near it's maximum power it won't have the dynamics. Power Scaling helps but it's not the same because the power and output transformers don't scale.
And that's EXACTLY why I am choosing to go with a Fractal XL instead of a Marshall YJM100 head.

a couple years ago when that YJM100 head first came out, I thought to myself THIS is perfect! Because, before that I had a Axe Standard but I eventually felt like I was missing something from tube amps, so I sold it. At that time I was living in a house and I could play amps as loud as I want, now I'm in a apartment so volume is a issue, but I hope to have a house again in another year or two.

So then comes along the new YJM100 head that I think gets 95% of all the guitar tones that I really want or need, AND, it has a new type of power scaling that sounds better than any types of power scaling technology that came before it... so I was really thinking that was going to be the be all end all of amps if I could just get that!

So I was almost going to buy one...

But then I saw the Mark Day videos Somebody Get Me A Doctor & Turn Up The Radio, and THEN I finally heard the Axe FX that sounded as good or maybe even BETTER than I had even heard a Marshall sound, even the YJM100...

And I thought ok, the YJM100 even used is going to be about $2,200... then I will want 2 Marshall Cabs that will be about another $1,600 (so I can run stereo), then I will want to put in 8 EV speakers or maybe Altecs 41H like Randy Rhoads used, that would be about another $1,600... plus then I would have the hassle of having to position a Mic just right to get the best recorded tones etc etc.

So the YJM100 route would have costed me a little more than just getting a XL and studio monitors and controller.

Plus with the Axe FX it's way easier to move around than two 4x12 cabs (because yes, if I would have gotten the YJM100, I would have HAD to have at least two 4x12 cabs, if not more, because having a wall of marshalls behind me has always been a fantasy for me anyway)

But the bottom line just came down to, with the Axe FX XL, I could do everything the YJM could do in a smaller package, AND A MILLION OTHER things, that maybe I don't have a use for now, but who knows, it's better to have too many tones than not enough.

Just makes the most sense to me to buy Fractal.

Now if Fractal had never been invented... THEN, I'd choose a YJM100 head because of the power scaling feature, because with that it seems to sound as good at bedroom whisper volume as it does cranked with that special power scaling...

But exactly as Cliff stated there, it's not TRULY power scaling everything... so something would still be missing from the tone, I mean it's not like you'd want to power scale if you didn't have too, so it certainly isn't giving you a tone benefit in power scaling.

But with Fractal, you get PERFECT tones at ANY volume without any compromise.

I think if the YJM100 had been invented in the 80s and 90s before good modelers, it would have sold like hot cakes.

But now, even though the YJM100 is great, it's obsolete in the presence of Fractal.

It just makes the most sense on all fronts to buy Fractal.

But if you aren't going to do Fractal, and you want the best master amp, get the YJM100, check out the two awesome demos Rob Chappers did of it on youtube.

But Fractal is like having EVERY amp ever invented, and being able to play them at ANY volume without sacrificing the quality of their tones, as well as making it super easy to record, especially with the built in audio interface.

And now I am eagerly anticipating these new Plug Ins, whatever they might be...
 

Kingjimmi

Inspired
It's crazy how good/integrated/invasive Google's products are getting. This video about Dick Denney was just recommended to me. Sure, it has to do with music and amps, so it's not exactly out of my viewing wheelhouse, but I don't think I've ever shown any interest in Vox amps. I do use Chrome though and read this page recently . . .

Edit: Cool thing about this product is even though I didn't buy the AFX for the Vox's I just might have to check them out now. They're included in the box after all!!!
 

axel

Power User
And that's EXACTLY why I am choosing to go with a Fractal XL instead of a Marshall YJM100 head.
But now, even though the YJM100 is great, it's obsolete in the presence of Fractal.
Sounds funny, "obsolete". Tube amps have been obsolete for decades, yet people still buy them and love them. I have both a YJM and an Axe Fx II, both great, but they are different. I like many flavors of Kool Aid.
 
Sounds funny, "obsolete". Tube amps have been obsolete for decades, yet people still buy them and love them. I have both a YJM and an Axe Fx II, both great, but they are different. I like many flavors of Kool Aid.
So are you saying then that there are tones in the YJM that you can't get out of the Axe FX 2?
 

axel

Power User
Only if you lack the ability to do so. Strictly speaking, there isn't a single tone you can't get out of the Axe-FX 2.
C'mon, Strictly speaking, you would have to have owned every amp ever made and duplicated them all perfectly with your Axe Fx to make those types of claims.
 
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