Wish III SE


I think having a unit where the UI is completely digital would be a good move for V4. Same deal as the Two Notes Captor X, there's a few key controls on the unit but anything else you need to connect a phone to it and frankly it's better for it. If you mess up or change your mind about what's the best UI with a physical unit you're screwed, with a touchscreen you lose all those limitations immmediately. Gain many on the accessibility side but I don't think Fractal has put any thought into that anyways (happy to be wrong, inclusivity is good and there's some excellent blind players that deserve good gear).
 
Who would buy a Axe lll with no screen to navigate?
I would. I use mine only in my studio, it's in a rack built into my desk right below my 5K monitor. No reason for me to use the front panel at all when I've got a nice high-res screen running Axe-Edit right there.

I'd go even further and reduce / modify the amount of IO on the back, so that the whole thing would only take up 1 or 2U
 
I doubt that subtracting the cost of the front panel components then adding in the cost of developing a new product of limited appeal would amount to savings worth not having the front panel.
I'd wager the other way. A subtractive product seems like "easy" work. I doubt much of the rear panel I/O depends on the front panel UI.
The real challenge would be designing the new front plate. Blank? Cool etched fractal logo? Boudoir photo of Cliff?
 
Eventide H9000: $7,000
H9000-Front.jpg


Eventide H9000R: $5,000
H9000R-Front.jpg


Though, I have heard people regretting of buying the blindfolded version, because the software works through Ethernet only, and it seems like it is a PITA to configure
Software works like a charm. I rarely use the front panel. Only occasionally to turn on the dummy lights (meters).
Oh, and they have a DAW plugin with recall.
 
I like the idea. But please give at least level control, and a display for patch/scene/channel... !
And, and, and... this is a valid request, but I think it is a slippery slope. You can justify any hardware control in isolation. Everyone will have a different "must-have" list.

The FC will be your display and the connected computer does the editing.

I think Eventide and Bricasti got it right by taking the bold move to have a blank front panel.

EDIT : FYI : that link above is the top result for a Google search of :

"error code led status cryptic front panel"
 
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You can justify any hardware control in isolation. Everyone will have a different "must-have" list.
True. I must clarify.
Level control are for analog I/O... no digital gain or level for the amp!
The display is only to verify status of the device. When you change patch and sound doesn't change... is the controller? The cable? The unit?
There should be no need for editing, only output.
 
True. I must clarify.
Level control are for analog I/O... no digital gain or level for the amp!
The display is only to verify status of the device. When you change patch and sound doesn't change... is the controller? The cable? The unit?
There should be no need for editing, only output.

Why? Do the VST instruments and FX have hardware visual output? and we still can troubleshoot them when there is no sound, don't we?

Have another look at the Eventide H9000R posted above. Only power button and network status. It is much more complex than the Axe-FX III, and it can still be fully handled from the software.

I have been working for years with a Nord Modular G2 Engine. A synth without keys, buttons, sliders or display! without any problem.
849b94245b7c1ccc1a1ff6bc48c2990014434c40.jpg

Those who miss keys, buttons and displays don't need to be afraid of its existence. It will not bite them. They can still buy the full version
 
Nord G2 is exactly the kind of device I was thinking of. That would be the perfect form factor for an Axe-FX III SE... I'd just add digital outputs to that.
 
They don't sell it anymore. Says a lot about product viability.
That has nothing to do with the form factor, more to do with shifting industry trends. Back in 1998 when the original Nord Modular was introduced it was a pretty cutting-edge device and allowed you to do a lot of stuff that was difficult to do otherwise. By the time they discontinued the G2 series in 2009, PCs and VST plugins had caught up and surpassed the capabilities. Clavia found a more lucrative market in keyboard players so their stage piano business kind of took over.
 
That has nothing to do with the form factor, more to do with shifting industry trends. Back in 1998 when the original Nord Modular was introduced it was a pretty cutting-edge device and allowed you to do a lot of stuff that was difficult to do otherwise. By the time they discontinued the G2 series in 2009, PCs and VST plugins had caught up and surpassed the capabilities. Clavia found a more lucrative market in keyboard players so their stage piano business kind of took over.
Like, you're just adding fuel to the "this is a bad idea" fire with this post. :D Your post pushes a VST as a better investment of time and product development energy.

If it was a good idea, more companies would be doing it. It's neither new or novel. That they don't says everything you need to know about the idea.
 
They don't sell it anymore. Says a lot about product viability.

Nord finished the production of all the G2 line, including the keyboard versions, in 2009. And the value of the Engine rack version has skyrocketed. You cannot find a second hand unit for less than $1,700, while the original price was $900.

It is the piece of gear that I regret more of having sold. The sound was amazing, and the editor very fun to use
 
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True. I must clarify.
Level control are for analog I/O... no digital gain or level for the amp!
The display is only to verify status of the device. When you change patch and sound doesn't change... is the controller? The cable? The unit?
There should be no need for editing, only output.
Ok, status lights might be legit. I think these guys have an interesting idea:

https://www.dialogic.com/webhelp/BorderNet2020/1.1.0/WebHelp/fp_led_error_codes.htm

Sarcasm of course - inspired by a recent debugging episode with our HVAC system which had the same sort of status display. I apparently found one of Cliff's dud contractors b/c he wasn't able to figure out the error message so I had to interpret the manual for him.

But, yeah, some sort of status/dummy lights would be nice. I can see the utility of analog level controls (as in, turn that MF'ing thing down). But, I can also see that list expanding...

Edit : FYI - that link was the top search result for:

"error code led status cryptic front panel"
 
Other companies are doing it successfully. Eventide was just given as an example earlier in the thread. Ever heard of UAD? They have a whole lineup of DSP accelerators that are widely used in studios and live setups all over: https://www.uaudio.com/uad-accelerators.html
Eventide? What do they sell that's just an DSP acceleration box with no physical UI?

UAD DSP accelerators are useful for more than just guitar signal processing, so their addressable market is larger (though still not very big). They're also very, very expensive; a necessity if your market is small even if the physical UI on the unit is greatly reduced (and in the case of the UAD boxes it's got near zero physical UI beyond what it takes to connect it to a host). And the hardware doesn't cover the full cost of ownership; you still have to pay additonal money for the algorithms with UAD boxes.

Total addressable market for guitar processors is already small. It's approaching zero for a DSP acceleration box that's hyper focused on guitarist IMHO. It wouldn't be priced much less than the flagship product as a result.

People get hyperfocused on the costs of the hardware and wonder what companies in the DSP space can do to make things more afforable by reducing hardware costs. You're not paying for the hardware. You're paying for the way the hardware is used; you're paying for the algorithms. Stripping a screen and some knobs away from an Axe-Fx III but demanding it still run the same algorithms as the full UI version isn't going to net you much savings at all; the value you're paying for is equally present in both types of hardware and therefore demands near equal costs.

What @flash6 is asking for wouldn't cost any less than a III. So, why bother making it?

Agree to disagree as neither of us is going to put money where our mouths are here.
 
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