I need help with recreating Yamaha SPX-90 Pitch Change C

henryrobinett

Fractal Fanatic
Hm. I was doing a google search for finding parameters for SPX-90 Pitch Change C. And I found this thread - http://forum.fractalaudio.com/ultra...ant-roland-modulation-spx90-pitch-change.html - I started 3 and a half years ago. Some people insisted this effect was nothing more than two detuned sides, +0.8 and -0.8. Nope. There's a lot more going on than that. I have three of them but they're in various locations with only one of them being in the house here, in an old PA rack buried beneath all kinds of crap in the garage. I just don't have the energy to unpack and unrack everything tonight. So does anyone have one and know what the parameters actually are? I need to try and duplicate that sound.

I found some old cassettes of my band playing. I had my signature sound back then. I have forgotten all about it. Nothing too special but it was me and a sound I identified with. I'd love to recreate it. Some Majordomo's here might have a clue. Boogie Quad, Roland SDE-1000 delay, Spx-90 II (sometimes two), Either a Lexicon MPX-500, or a Digitech 256 or before that Yamaha Rev-7 for reverbs.

Two examples.

The first is a Strat with overdrive.
http://soundcloud.com/henry-robinett/hayleys-day-live-on-broadway

The 2nd is a Gibson ES-355 clean.
And When Fortresses Fall (Live at On Broadway) by Henry Robinett on SoundCloud - Hear the world

I'd love to get some help on this.
 
Last edited:
as this has been discussed at length before, i think you may have to dig out that old unit, hook it up and make a couple of recordings with it on. set up the axe detune in the same way and compare the two. we're flying blind, because on the surface it just looks like micro pitch shift...if there's something else going on, we'll need to try and discover what that is and the easiest way to do that is listen, analyse and compare.
 
Well I've detuned it the same way, of course. But there are other parameters like feedback and "Fine" and delay. The detune amount is +/- 8 cents. There are plenty of posts in plenty of forums about Pitch Change C, audio engineering forums and the like and no one has duplicated this effect. At least no one I've come across yet. I'd like to come close though.
 
well looking at the manual, "fine" is just detune in 1 cent intervals and there's no feedback enabled in patch C. if you can find out what the delay times are, that would help. i think the first step would be to make a note of all the available parameters in the patch and how they're set. if you want to get into some proper analysis, run some pink noise through the unit and look in a frequency analyser to see if it's reducing high end, or adding bass etc when it's engaged. also look and see how stable the pitch shifting is (whether it varies over time and how fast) and also if the delay time is constant or fluctuating. all this stuff can be replicated in the axe, but only if we really know what's happening.
 
If I have the luxury of extra time this afternoon I'll try and pull the unit out. I hope I don't have to replace the battery to get it to power up.
 
You had a nice setup back then Henry! I lived by my SPX90 and SDE1000. Wish I had never sold them (for sentimental reasons). Btw, the SC links don't work. :( Edit: Actually it may be an issue with SC itself.
 
I imagine that much of the difference you're talking about would be due to the state of the hardware in the earlier digital days - bit resolution, A/D converters, etc. God help me for lamenting the "vintage 8-bit" days, but my Rev7 and A3 had a certain audio charm. And I still maintain that my old Yamaha D1500 DDLs are the best sounding digital delays ever for guitar. (You had to have two of them for ping pong, though, at a cost rivaling the Axe-Fx!)
 
Bill - Thank you very much for listening to the tunes!

It's more than the charm of the 8 bit crunch. There's something going on in the algorithm or something. Too many folks have lamented over the loss of this patch. And I own a Rev 7. Could never really stand the thing. Noisy as hell. The only thing I ever used the SPX90 for was this damned Pitch Change C. I liked the SDE-1000. The modulation is cool. Rarely found use for most of the early digital effects. For live guitar I used some reverb, the Digitech 256 or even like the Lexicon MPX-500, or delay, but never in the studio.

I finally pulled it out this morning. I realized I had two in the garage. I had my old guitar effects rack. Perfect. Now if someone can tell me how to translate these parameters, that'd be great.

L PITCH +0
L FINE = + 8
L DELAY = 0.4 ms
R PITCH = 0
R FINE = -8
R DELAY = 0.1

So what to do with that? Pitch os 0, but FINE is Left/Right +/-8. Where is the micro tuning on the Axe Fx? I feel it's coming to me but hasn't arrived yet, in my mind. The delays are easy.
 
Strange that this is in presets exchange. I guess. Effects but I'm not trying to exchange a preset. Maybe there should be a forum just effects.

Here's my old Effects Rack for my live guitar rig. Axe replaced it. Actually for about a year I just used an original '65 Deluxe Reverb or a Seymour Duncan Convertible without effects other than reverb, or a Carl Martin Quattro pedal. I left the two small refrigerators home.

I've gotten a little closer with the effects on this preset.
 

Attachments

  • Old Guitar Effects rack.jpg
    Old Guitar Effects rack.jpg
    104.8 KB · Views: 25
I've still got half the stuff in this rack as well! I hate getting rid of anything... I am with you though on this patch, despite the noise and lo-fi nature it is special.
 
The Axe has all those parameters in the Pitch block Detune mode.
Although the delays start at 1ms and they are in 1ms steps... you may have to measure the SPX-90's AD/DA latency to get the "real world" numbers (I suspect them to be in the 5-15ms range). And then you are in the classic Eventide Micropitchshift ballpark.
 
Well if you search it there are people with Eventides who still can't get this effect. I know though. I've come relatively close but definitely no cigar.
 
Maybe the pitches and delay times are modulated in the SPX and Eventides... Have you tried attaching LFOs to those parameters?
 
ok, here's an fx block based on those settings...
 

Attachments

  • SPX-90.blk
    615 bytes · Views: 24
Last edited:
No I haven't. I don't know a what that means. I know what LFO means, but I don't know what it means to attach them and how.
 
Thank simeon. I'll check it out. But what is it? SPX90 as a patch it pretty general. I never liked the unit, just that one patch.
 
oh dude.

it's an fx block. drop it into your fractal audio workspace on your hard drive.

the best thing to do is this...

open axe edit
select a spot on the grid and drop in the pitch block
down the bottom left of the axe edit window, you'll see an area called "blocks library"
click on the "+" next to the little black area
this will prompt you to do a save - go ahead and save as "test"
find your fractal audio workspace on your hard drive
go to axe edit > blocks
in there, you'll find a folder called pitch and in there, a blk file called "test"
you can delete the test file and drop the blk file i gave you into that pitch folder

go back to axe edit and open up a patch that you would like to use the pitch block in
drop the pitch block into your layout after the cab
click on the blocks library black area while the pitch block is selected in the layout
select SPX90

this will load the SPX90 settings you listed above into the pitch block


if all that sounds too much like hard work, do this instead...

drop the pitch block into a patch after the cab
select the detune type
set voice 1 detune to 8
set voice 2 detune to -8
set voive 1 pan to 100
set voice 2 pan to -100
set voice 1 delay to 0.4ms
set voice 2 delay to 0.1ms
set mix to 50%
set input mode to stereo
 
btw - i forgot to pan the shifters in my block. here's an updated version. i've also replaced the version in my original post

bear in mind that this is a stereo effect. if you're playing in mono, pan both shifters to centre
 

Attachments

  • SPX-90.blk
    615 bytes · Views: 32
Back
Top Bottom