How are you using the FM3 Live?

[BDer]

Hey all,

My apologies if this has already been asked but I wasn't seeing anything specific to my question, so here we go....

I use the AxeFXIII as my main live unit but also have the FM3 as my backup unit. On the AxeFXIII I use the Setlist feature, and each song is its own patch with Scenes as my way to switch things within each song. Since the FM3 doesn't have the setlist feature I'm finding that I have to order my FM3 patches based on whatever show we're doing. To add to the complexity, as a band we make a very conscious effort to keep our setlists unique from show to show. What ends up happening is that I may have 4 or 5 groups of patches in order, and there are are fair number of duplicate patches because of this. I like the flexibility of using a specific patch per song, but it turns into a bit of a maintenance nightmare at times.

My question is pretty simple...how are you using your FM3 in live situations?

I do have the FC-12 so I can do a lot of different things in regard to stomp-box functionality and scenes. Part of me is leaning towards just setting up a singe patch with everything (staying under the CPU limit if possible). I know there really isn't a right vs wrong way of doing things, but would love to hear what everyone else is doing, especially those that use the AxeFXIII as their main unit.

Thanks!

Bill

 

[Greg Ferguson]

… Since the FM3 doesn't have the setlist feature …
…I do have the FC-12 so I can do a lot of different things in regard to stomp-box functionality and scenes. Part of me is leaning towards just setting up a singe patch with everything (staying under the CPU limit if possible). I know there really isn't a right vs wrong way of doing things, but would love to hear what everyone else is doing, especially those that use the AxeFXIII as their main unit.

You don’t say which layout you are using. Something like OMG15 would be a very good starting point because it lets you move forward and backward through ten presets at a time.

Then, using the Preset Manager on the FM3 you can quickly rearrange the song order.

If your presets on the FX3 are compatible with the FM3, then simply backup the bank(s) on the FX3 using Fractal-Bot, then restore them on the FM3. The presets are compatible within the limitations of the FM3.

I build my presets so they fit the FM3 and have them on all three units, so I know it’s doable. Make sure the units are running the latest firmware to have the best compatibility in the modeling algorithms.

 

[chris]

i use one preset mainly. i don't try to make tones for each song, but instead choose from 4 different amps to fit whatever i'm playing (range of gain, etc.) if i need a special effect for a song, i duplicate my main preset and rearrange what i need.

fewer presets are easier to manage with updates or changes for whatever reason.

 

[hole]

Same as Chris

1 Bread and Butter preset with 4 main scenes (clean to mean) and one or two 'specialty' presets for specific songs that need 'that special certain sound'

I used to be that guy that would have song specific patches, and trying to copy the exact tone for each song we played, but I figured out that the only one who really noticed was me (and not the audience).....and it's a lot of effort to put in , just so only one guy hears it

 

[Intoodeep1113]

It is also likely that the FM3 will have the setlist feature in firmware 6.0 which is due any day now.

 

[TheloniusJ]

It is also likely that the FM3 will have the setlist feature in firmware 6.0 which is due any day now.

This would be cool. I really like the sound of this feature.

Right now for my main gigging band, I use one primary preset which uses a single amp/cab set up for all scenes. My scenes are set up with different combinations of effects and the functionality of the expression pedal changes with each scene. I use the FM3 to move around scenes and engage the tuner. I did change my scene layout to toggle between two scenes rather than do one scene per button. So the way my scene views work is:

View 1

• Switch 1: Toggle between scenes 1/2 (clean and clean with delay, exp pedal is auto-engage wah). This is kind of my homebase.
• Switch 2: Toggle between scenes 3/4 (Both dirty lead, each with a different pitch effects mixed in with the exp pedal - No wah).
• Switch 3: Toggle between scenes 5/6 (5 is a toned down clean sound to comp behind the keyboard player, 6 is a super lush clean sound for special use).

View 2:

• Switch 1: Toggles between scenes 7/8 (a more bluesy dirty tone and a lead tone with wah). I don't use these much.
• Switch 2: Actually the same as switch 1 in view 1. Allows me to land back home quickly if I need scenes 7/8.
• Switch 3: Tuner

Long press on switch 2 will take me to the master layout as normal.

I run a EV-5 expression pedal and a two switch Mosky. First switch scrolls through scene views, second switch is tap tempo (I use a lot of delay). I also run a passive volume pedal before the FM3. As stated, the expression pedal function changes based on the scene.

I do have a couple of small variations on this preset for dramatically different effects I may want to employ (including say the position of the pitch block).

I do a similar thing for my metal/hard rock band but my home base is a dirty rhythm tone.

 

[ElectricPhase]

That's so similar to my scene layout that I'll borrow your format to describe it.

View 1

• Switch 1: Toggle between scenes 1/5 (clean/clean+fx; long press for CS2 boost)
• Switch 2: Toggle between scenes 2/6 (rhythm/rhythm+fx; long press for Drive 2)
• Switch 3: Toggle between scenes 3/7 (lead/lead+extra fx; long press for MLM, only used if I don't have the add-on board)

View 2:

• Switch 1: Toggle between scenes 1/5 (same as view 1)
• Switch 2: Toggle between scenes 2/6 (same as view 1)
• Switch 3: Toggle between scenes 4/8 (song specific)

Add-on board with EV-5 and two button switch

Two button:

• Switch 1: Switch between view 1/2 (long press for preset layout)
• Switch 2: Tap tempo (long press for tuner)

The buttons in the preset layout are layout linked back to the scene layout.

GMTA!

Edit: ...and of course, prompted by this thread, I just changed my approach pretty drastically. I now have the Mosky set to increment/decrement views. That means that in every layout, all four views have to be populated, even if just with duplicates. This approach lets me fly through pretty much everything very quickly. For me, it's a big improvement! Still working on what to put in the layouts....

 

[Mark Wein]

I've been using my FM3 and FC6mk2 for several months with an EV PXM 12mp wedge. I was using the OMG9 layout but I discovered that I really needed direct access to more scenes per preset so I made my own layout where the first button takes me to presets on the FC6 and the rest of the buttons give me scenes 1-8 of each preset. I have a two-button aux switch that I use to go between my two main presets quickly and an expression pedal for wah and volume adjustments.

 

[Rumbletone]

Currently I use a mix of generic presets (like an ‘80s’ preset with clean chorus tones, slick leads with delays, etc, a ‘basic tones’ preset with blackface, tweed, voxey, and Marshall tones and basic FX available, an ‘acoustic instruments’ preset for acoustic, mandolin, a dub/reggae preset with appropriate base tones and with dub-specific FX (especially delay functions) etc.) and then I also have song-specific presets for any songs that warrant it - which is probably 30-35% of the repertoire

Once a setlist is locked down I re-order into banks for each set, so even though they are not in the exact order as the setlist they are easily accessible. I also have layouts set up so I can quickly bank up or down so no preset is more than a few button presses away.

Setlist feature would be great, but I don’t think it’s practical on the FM3 given how long it takes to load presets.

 

[TheloniusJ]

I've been using my FM3 and FC6mk2 for several months with an EV PXM 12mp wedge. I was using the OMG9 layout but I discovered that I really needed direct access to more scenes per preset so I made my own layout where the first button takes me to presets on the FC6 and the rest of the buttons give me scenes 1-8 of each preset. I have a two-button aux switch that I use to go between my two main presets quickly and an expression pedal for wah and volume adjustments.

View attachment 109309

Courage = Starbucks right next to the FM3.

This is where I admit at my last show a guitarist came up to ask me about my rig (right after sound check) and I was drinking a beer. As I'm pointing out some things, I spill beer on my own gear. Just a little bit, but I almost created the foul of the century (take out my FM3 right before my first paid gig with it).

On that note, does anyone know how robust the FM3 is to liquid spills? It still makes me nervous to have the "brains" of my rig right up there in the beer slosh zone.

 

[Mark Wein]

Courage = Starbucks right next to the FM3.

This is where I admit at my last show a guitarist came up to ask me about my rig (right after sound check) and I was drinking a beer. As I'm pointing out some things, I spill beer on my own gear. Just a little bit, but I almost created the foul of the century (take out my FM3 right before my first paid gig with it).

On that note, does anyone know how robust the FM3 is to liquid spills? It still makes me nervous to have the "brains" of my rig right up there in the beer slosh zone.

Hehe. This one from last week

was even worse:

 

[RLD]

I use my FM3 like a single channel amp...1 preset and added foot switches so I can turn on/off all fx without have to menu dive.
Volume and Wah on controller pedals...various stages of gain plus drives allows jazz like cleans or screaming distortion at any volume.

 

[TheloniusJ]

Hehe. This one from last week

was even worse:

Awesome.

 

[BigBabyBurrito]

I also use one preset per song, and I have BandHelper set up on an iPad to change presets over midi. Makes it really, really easy, although I learned my lesson the hard way trying to do bluetooth over midi (the Yamaha MD-BT01 kept overheating during gigs and freezing up my footswitches, now I use a hardwired midi adapter)

 

[DJD100]

I use an Arthur Sounds AS JCM 800, a true high voltrage JCM 800 tube preamp in a lightweight AC powered pedal. The FM3 does a very high quality tube power amp sim for the JCM 800 preamp, as well as cab/acoustic guitar sims (IR's) and FX etc.

I use one kitchen-sink preset using eight scenes for the whole show (would love more scenes though, as I need pristine cross-fades and reverb/delay tails!).

The FC Setup which includes the FM3 and a Mosky Dual Switch has one layout which is...

FC1 tap controls the Ableton LIVE Looper Plugin's Play button, and hold the FM3's Tuner.
FC2 tap controls the Ableton LIVE Session Loop button, and hold the Ableton LIVE Looper Plugin's Undo button plus a Control Switch Boost with EQ.
FC3 tap adds a Delay FX, and hold selects a Pitch FX (Auto-Whammy).

The Mosky Dual Switch one tap increments Scenes while hold decrements Scenes (the majority of FX changes and cross-fades/fades are automated directly via MIDI from Ableton LIVE).

The Mosky Dual Switch two tap selects an Auto-Wah.

 

[lauke-lux]

FM3 + Voes MX5 + 1 Boss mini exp + Hotone dual switch scratched to a self made board. 1 additional boss EXP pedal

• Scene switching on MX5 page A
• 8 patch selection on page B (3 patches cover 90% of songs)
• FX on/off on FM3 per preset buttons layout 7 view 1
• tap/tuner on FM3 layout 7 view 2
• looper on FM3 layout 7 view 3
• Hotone dual tone for patch UP and Patch DOWN for if I want to reach a patch beyond the Voes MX5 page B
• the 2 Exp for Volume and Wah

CLR as stage monitor for guitar on OUT2, OUT1 to FOH.

Quite standard I guess.

 

[scott.frank.b]

I am in a couple cover bands and I built the majority off my main patches off the Carol Ann Tucana models with an aftermarket York Audio Creamback IR. I have a preset that is hard rock, one that more country, one that’s more of an 80s sound with pitch detune/delay and I use an FC-6 to switch between my scenes and effects.

 

[MrPond]

post-metal/rock band:

• one preset per song
• one scene = one sound, used across multiple parts
• views to iterate through scenes, part for part (if playing manually)
• Ableton Live controls some small backing tracks, click, midi clock, pre-programmed lights and all patch changes
• connection via WIDI masters & bud
• soundwise: nothing super fancy - hot Marshall sounds, delay and huge reverbs, YA IR
• other guitarist uses also FM3
• both FM3s going direct and separately into real cabs to get a decent stage sound (SD PS170)

 

[whodatonguitar]

I understand your dilemma.

I personally play rock/metal/fusion (only requires a few different sounds/scenes) but I also do a lot of fill in gigs with local top 40 cover bands when their guitarist is out so I have a long list of Top 40 cover songs programmed into the FM3 that sound close to the original or what I would have done. Although most of the bands all play the same songs, I'm alway creating new set list from that pool of songs.

To make things even more complicated, I sometimes use my Synergy SYN-2 preamps and/or one of my tube amps just for it's power amp/speaker for some onstage volume. But I also always go direct to FOH and use a set of IEM that I mix myself. So I have 2 copies of every preset where one group of presets is the FM3 as a standalone using it's amp modeling and IRs and the other set of presets is with the SYN-2 integrated in the signal path. In the Syn-2 set up, the FM3 is configured for 4cm and no amp/cab modeling is in the signal chain. In this scenario, I'm using the XLR and main out on the SYN-2 to go FOH and to a combo amp.

To be able to quickly arrange and access the set list and presets, I added a Morningstar MC8 to create and organize the set list. The FM3 is always in "scene" mode and I have the scenes set up as either intro, verse, chorus, bridge, solo, etc. and I usually try to limit it to just 3 scenes so I don't have scroll during a song. If I need 4 sounds in a song, I'll figure a way to integrate the expression pedal to access that 4th sound. I.e. adding a ridiculous amount of reverb to just the stand out bending riff in Sex on Fire. It adds a dramatic feel to the song and audience members always comment on how it fills the air and makes the song "dreamy".

The CPU is usually at it's limits because I like the high quality reverbs, multi-band comp, tri-stereo chorus... all the CPU sucking effects. I also keep the virtual capo on all presets because depending the vocalists of whatever band I'm playing with might need to change keys and I need to be able to quickly make that adjustment for that specific vocalist. Because of the CPU limitations, I'm tempted to get rid of the NovaDrive and Bloom and swapping in a HX Stomp just for the modulations and other non-time based effects. Would be nice to have instant access to 3 modulation effects while having the FM3 focus on the more complex algorithms.

The FM9 is an option to consider but since I like to use 2 x SYN-2 and I want easy access to the 8 channels, the MC8 has a "bank" page that gives me instant access to any channel. For my personal stuff, I use 1 preset with 3 main scenes... reverb, reverb/with delay, reveb/delay/tri chorus. I select one of the scenes on the FM3 and then I switch the SYN-2s based upon what amp sound I want. I can go from a clean twin, to a gritty deluxe, a chimey AC-30 to the brown sound or Vai's thick/fuzz like tone without the slight gap that the FM3 has when changing amps.

Complex set up but it hits every aspect of my "must-have" list that I've pulled together in my head over the last 35 years. I can go to a gig with just the pedalboard and guitar and it sounds amazing but I can easily add in my "luxury" gear without spending more than 20-30 minutes to setup and sound check.

 

[Plato67]

I also use one preset per song, and I have BandHelper set up on an iPad to change presets over midi. Makes it really, really easy, although I learned my lesson the hard way trying to do bluetooth over midi (the Yamaha MD-BT01 kept overheating during gigs and freezing up my footswitches, now I use a hardwired midi adapter)

I've been using this method for years. I've never encountered this issue with my BT01. It's dropped connection once or twice, but it's an easy reconnect. I've also hooked up a separate one to our Nord so it changes settings according to the song automatically.