Hit a brick wall with rhythm tone.

With drive blocks, definitely play around with the high and low cut to dial in top and bottom. Also, experiment with leaving tone control at noon or lower and decreasing high cut to let more highs through vs. turning tone control past noon to 2-3 o'clock and increasing high cut to tame highs. Two different approaches and they yield very different results even though gain stays the same. New FW also has "Crunch" control in amp block that changes distortion character. Very cool.
You can also try reducing Transformer Match in Amp block a bit. This will tighten up the sound a bit.
Do you have Power Amp sim turned on or off? I've heard people experiment both ways. Still don't know what amp you are driving your cab with or what your routing looks like. The more info from you the better. Post example of your preset, that way we can have more info that might help. Otherwise we are stuck with very general advice.
On advanced page you can turn on Sat for additional gain and increase MV Trim or Input Trim beyond what they are capable of on their pages.

Glad you're getting closer,

Good luck!


Sent from my iPhone
 
The Mesa Mark IV gets a lot of its gain from the Treble control (the tone controls are early on in the signal chain). When I use these amps I have my Treble a fair bit higher than I would on other high gain amps... usually around 8 or so. Bass way down... between 1 and 2... and mids around midway.

With the Treble high and both gains (input and drive) around 7 or 8 as well, I get plenty of grind/gain without any boost in front of the amp.

If you already know all this, then disregard.
 
euro uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuber, I had that sound today g3 I was on. I think i used the standard 4x12 v30 cab, omg, rockin
 
I never liked a boost with the Mark IV model. A PEQ maybe to cut some bottom and boost some upper mids, but its plenty tight by itself, as long as you have the bass dialed down very low and the treble high. I also always had the 'Fat' switch on, seems to sound a lot better that way.
 
Bill Piersall said:
With drive blocks, definitely play around with the high and low cut to dial in top and bottom. Also, experiment with leaving tone control at noon or lower and decreasing high cut to let more highs through vs. turning tone control past noon to 2-3 o'clock and increasing high cut to tame highs. Two different approaches and they yield very different results even though gain stays the same. New FW also has "Crunch" control in amp block that changes distortion character. Very cool.
You can also try reducing Transformer Match in Amp block a bit. This will tighten up the sound a bit.
Do you have Power Amp sim turned on or off? I've heard people experiment both ways. Still don't know what amp you are driving your cab with or what your routing looks like. The more info from you the better. Post example of your preset, that way we can have more info that might help. Otherwise we are stuck with very general advice.
On advanced page you can turn on Sat for additional gain and increase MV Trim or Input Trim beyond what they are capable of on their pages.

Glad you're getting closer,

Good luck!
Click to expand...

Thanks man, I'll try that. I said earlier I was using an ISP Stealth to drive it, and that I've stripped down to just straight drive pedal in front of an amp and nothing else (except input gate of course). I also found that placing a second gate in my chain choked a lot of the tone, less so if I put it after the amp instead of between the drive pedal and the amp, so that's going to take a lot of tweaking... might have to find the perfect tone without the gates first and then spend time finding the perfect gate settings later. Power Amp sim is on, has been for ages. It just sounded better. Maybe I should turn it off and start over?

3Dhuman said:
The Mesa Mark IV gets a lot of its gain from the Treble control (the tone controls are early on in the signal chain). When I use these amps I have my Treble a fair bit higher than I would on other high gain amps... usually around 8 or so. Bass way down... between 1 and 2... and mids around midway.

With the Treble high and both gains (input and drive) around 7 or 8 as well, I get plenty of grind/gain without any boost in front of the amp.

If you already know all this, then disregard.
Click to expand...

Thanks man, I'll definitely try that out. I had similar settings but more like 6-6.5 on the treble, I'll raise it up and see what happens.

mnemonic said:
I never liked a boost with the Mark IV model. A PEQ maybe to cut some bottom and boost some upper mids, but its plenty tight by itself, as long as you have the bass dialed down very low and the treble high. I also always had the 'Fat' switch on, seems to sound a lot better that way.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I'll give that a shot!
 
Make sure your trying you results in a mix, with at least drums, however bass does help too

sometimes what cuts it in a mix wouldn't necessarily be you favorite bedroom sound

Also be very aware that a lot of guitars are double in a mix to fill it out

Sometimes when i double a guitar i do it on different pickup settings, which adds extra harmonics

If your tones are too muddy try and cut some bottom or top out of the spectrum, there are many threads here on what people are doing to tidy up their tones in that regaurds

Anyway all the best with find the tone you want
 
No luck messing with the drive blocks just yet. I should also add one issue I have is the lower strings feeling week. It's not muddy or anything, they just don't feel quick to react. I'll play with Transformer Match some more.

Bojangles said:
Make sure your trying you results in a mix, with at least drums, however bass does help too

sometimes what cuts it in a mix wouldn't necessarily be you favorite bedroom sound

Also be very aware that a lot of guitars are double in a mix to fill it out

Sometimes when i double a guitar i do it on different pickup settings, which adds extra harmonics

If your tones are too muddy try and cut some bottom or top out of the spectrum, there are many threads here on what people are doing to tidy up their tones in that regaurds

Anyway all the best with find the tone you want
Click to expand...

I've already made comments about this, but I'll reiterate. I know how their guitars sound on their own, and that's the tone I'm trying to get.

Ben.Last said:
Try boosting with the PEQ in front of the amp block, instead of using a drive.
Click to expand...

Thanks I'll give that a shot too.
 
It looks like at least one of the guitarists is using the Mesa Grid Slammer as his constant boost pedal. So, you might want to look into what exactly that thing is doing, tone-wise, too.
 
During the sound check, you might ask the sound tech if you can listen to the sound coming to FOH with headphones. That might get you a more accurate comparison.

Also, IR's are at least 1/2 the sound you hear. You gotta try other physical cabs or IR's. Your 2x12 won't have as much movement of air and low end as a 4x12.
 
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So have you heard any studio tracks of guitar on their own to go by, ConnorGilks, or just the live sound you heard? With the live sound during a check, the acoustics of the situation comes into play. Much different than dry tracks on a record, of coarse. Taking this into account may help you zero in. I often put a good dose of some realistic acoustic ambiance in the sound to check it out, before going dry.
 
Ben.Last said:
It looks like at least one of the guitarists is using the Mesa Grid Slammer as his constant boost pedal. So, you might want to look into what exactly that thing is doing, tone-wise, too.
Click to expand...

Thanks man! I started looking more into what they are doing and Pat did a killer rundown with lots of details about how he sets things. Apparently he uses a Mark V now though. But he did post some pictures of settings and talk about how he sets the amp and the Grid Slammer so I'll sit down and give things another shot. Should I stick with the USA Lead or is there something closer to the Mark V? I have no idea about the difference between these amps besides what can be seen on the front and back. What's the Grid Slammer most like in the AxeFX II? Any ideas? Unfortunately the picture of his amp is too dark to make out the 5-band EQ settings, among other things. Vital imformation obscured in darkness. Oh well...

Philip34 said:
During the sound check, you might ask the sound tech if you can listen to the sound coming to FOH with headphones. That might get you a more accurate comparison.

Also, IR's are at least 1/2 the sound you hear. You gotta try other physical cabs or IR's. Your 2x12 won't have as much movement of air and low end as a 4x12.
Click to expand...

That's not really an opportunity I can get.

I've tried several different cabs and mine is the closest. They use V30's too, although they are the Mesa ones and not the standard Celestion's, but they're still the next best thing. My 2x12 sounds massive, and I've compared it to other 4x12 and the difference isn't very big. Plus when I say tone I'm not just talking about the low end, I'm very much talking about the EQ of the entire tone.

symphx said:
euro uber
Click to expand...

Tried it, it's rad, but not what I'm looking for.

BillyZeppa said:
So have you heard any studio tracks of guitar on their own to go by, ConnorGilks, or just the live sound you heard? With the live sound during a check, the acoustics of the situation comes into play. Much different than dry tracks on a record, of coarse. Taking this into account may help you zero in. I often put a good dose of some realistic acoustic ambiance in the sound to check it out, before going dry.
Click to expand...

Live sound on it's own, but I was quite close to the stage in a smallish venue. It was pointed at me and sounded killer. I watched the show from further back and it still sounded awesome and more or less the same.
 
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Dude!
I think someone in Hellbound needs some hugs. Maybe cut down on the coffee intake. Maybe go up a size in underwear. Not sure, but they sound pretty pissed off.
 
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