Help me think through a preset design?

[sick pickle]

Hey friends,

I auditioned for a band the other night using Justin York's GOT preset. This has 4 main amp tones - high gain, crunch, dirty fender, AC 30. It worked well for the most part! I dialled in some Lo/Hi cuts in the preamp and adjusted for the room when using my Line 6 L3M FRFR. However, I ran into some 'design' thoughts when playing. Each song usually called for a specific amp sound (picked from those listed above). But I had not dialled in any solo boosts - my solos were totally lost in the band mix while playing.

That being said....how to approach this? If I am on the AC30 sound, I want to dial in a lead tone specific to that amp for that song, and the same for the others. I can do this via scenes, but that would be the 8 scenes:

1. High Gain
2. High Gain Lead
3. Crunch
4. Crunch Lead
5. Dirty Fender
6. Dirty Fender Lead
7. AC30
8. AC30 Lead

That basically fills the entire preset. I can then use conventional methods for solo boosts - scene level, or EQ jumps, etc..

The other option may be, create 4 separate presets for the 4 main amp sounds and then open up much more possibility in each preset with more scene options, etc.

Any thoughts or insights would be appreciated!

 

[WKSmith]

I had a revelation about this same scenario just yesterday.

Flip the Input Boost switch in the amp block under the ideal tab. See if that works as a solo boost.
You can assign a foot switch's hold function to activate the input boost's modifier to engage a solo boost by holding that switch down.

 

[Moke]

Another thought is to have four channels of drives in a single Drive block as your pre-amp EQ and gain boost. Each with a specific drive model that is dialed in for each amp channel. Then have the Drive block switch channels to match the Amp channels via scenes.

Then also do the same thing with four channels of a Filter, PEQ, or GEQ block placed after the Amp block as your post-amp EQ and volume boost.

Now add a Control Switch to your Layout. Use that same Control Switch assigned to the bypass parameters of both blocks to activate the pre-dialed gain and volume boost for each amp channel at any time, and on any scene.

If switch real-estate is a problem, you could put the Control Switch on the 'Hold' function of each Scene switch. That way you could switch between the rhythm and solo versions of each scene on the same switch.??

 

[elvis]

What kind of boost do you want? Volume boost? Gain boost? Or both?

Easy enough to set a switch for "boost."

For me, I'd go with a preset per amp. This would allow for scenes like "Dry", "Compressed", "Lead", and "Wet lead", which is how I've been setting up scenes. For something like the AC30, I'd go "Less Gain", "Compressed", "More Gain", "Lead (more gain + clean boost + extra delay/verb)". By doing this, I've found that 90% of the time I use the SLP1959, and have a few tricks up that sleeve via scenes.

 

[sick pickle]

Another thought is to have four channels of drives in a single Drive block as your pre-amp EQ and gain boost. Each with a specific drive model that is dialed in for each amp channel. Then have the Drive block switch channels to match the Amp channels via scenes.

Then also do the same thing with four channels of a Filter, PEQ, or GEQ block placed after the Amp block as your post-amp EQ and volume boost.

Now add a Control Switch to your Layout. Use that same Control Switch assigned to the bypass parameters of both blocks to activate the pre-dialed gain and volume boost for each amp channel at any time, and on any scene.

If switch real-estate is a problem, you could put the Control Switch on the 'Hold' function of each Scene switch. That way you could switch between the rhythm and solo versions of each scene on the same switch.??

Damn! This is clever - I might try to implement it. I like your recommendation about the hold function. I was not sure how to handle it because I didn't really want to mess with the OMFG9 layout, so the hold function solves for it!

Actually thinking about this....keeping OMFG9 as default is actually limiting my creativity. But I really like it, and I am afraid to modify it! I guess I could always export it, or reset it back to default on the unit itself if went too far....

Each scene is an amp sound - each scene's switch hold function activates the boost!

 

[WKSmith]

If switch real-estate is a problem, you could put the Control Switch on the 'Hold' function of each Scene switch. That way you could switch between the rhythm and solo versions of each scene on the same switch.??

Ed Zachary

 

[sick pickle]

Actually just watched Leon's control switch video and got to thinking...he has an entire layout set to control switches...this is blowing my mind. There are TOO many options



I could then in theory, select a scene that loads up the "AC30" and then immediately changes to a control switch layout, which basically gives me a whole new pedal board for activating boosts, or other random things.

 

[Joe Bfstplk]

I had a revelation about this same scenario just yesterday.

Flip the Input Boost switch in the amp block under the ideal tab. See if that works as a solo boost.
You can assign a foot switch's hold function to activate the input boost's modifier to engage a solo boost by holding that switch down.

That only really works on clean-ish sounds. If the amp is already distorted, the boost in front will make it more distorted, but no louder.

OP was getting buried when his solo came up. Needs to boost after the amp. A null Filter block can do that. I use a VolPan block to add my main volume at the same spot....

 

[Dave Merrill]

I do the drive channels matched to amp channels thing like Moke suggested, but that's for tone and texture, not volume boost for solos.

Pretty much all my presets have a mostly flat PEQ with 2-5 db of gain for solos, on the same switch always. It's usually flat, but sometime I want more mid-highs for cut, or less bass, or more mids. It's easy to tailor it for each amp channel, like the drives.

 

[Greg Ferguson]

Flip the Input Boost switch in the amp block under the ideal tab. See if that works as a solo boost.

That will only provide a volume boost if the amp is running clean. If it's on the edge of breakup, or already distorting all that will happen is the distortion will increase.

Tube distortion, and, by extension, modeled tube distortion, occurs because the tube is being pushed past its ability to amplify further and the sine wave begins to change to a square wave. The farther it's pushed the more of a square wave it becomes.

 

[hitmusic]

I use the CS1 control switch attached to the input boost of the amp and l also add the same CS1 switch to the bypass of a filter block (to raise the volume by 2-3db and give a slight mid boost).

Finally, for some solos I also add the CS1 switch to a delay block so its doing 3 things all in one switch.

CS1 is set on a single footswitch which then works across all scenes for different amps.

It works great!

 

[Randalljax]

Actually just watched Leon's control switch video and got to thinking...he has an entire layout set to control switches...this is blowing my mind. There are TOO many options



I could then in theory, select a scene that loads up the "AC30" and then immediately changes to a control switch layout, which basically gives me a whole new pedal board for activating boosts, or other random things.

I somehow missed this one so cool

 

[Greg Ferguson]

A null Filter block can do that. I use a VolPan block to add my main volume at the same spot....

Matt previously said:

I'll be happy to give my usual answer here. I use a PEQ block after the cab and before post FX as a boost. This allows me to tailor the tone instead of just upping its level. This usually means a low mid hump. or some extra high end and low end rolloffs.

I went with his idea, using a GEQ instead because the sliders make it easier for me to visualize any hump I add, and have the level set to 3.5 dB for a little volume boost when I engage the block. I suspect the PEQ or GEQ blocks use a tiny bit more CPU but it'd be minimal.

I tweaked my layouts so that GEQ taps off the layout immediately before the Out 1 and feeds that block, with un-boosted feeds going to Out 2 -> Out 3. I modified my Scenes and Per-Preset layouts so they have a dedicated GEQ 1 bypass switch.



I've experimented using a CS to trigger the Bypass, and a modifier on the Level to release the volume over a couple of seconds when I deactivate the boost just to help delays and such maintain their tails, but it'd affect the volume of my rhythm playing too. Using the block as Matt suggests, after the cab and before post-FX, would fix that problem but would then affect all my Out blocks, not just Out 1.

My next step might be to add headphone compensation curves to channels B-D.

My GEQ is attached.

 

[WKSmith]

That will only provide a volume boost if the amp is running clean. If it's on the edge of breakup, or already distorting all that will happen is the distortion will increase.

Tube distortion, and, by extension, modeled tube distortion, occurs because the tube is being pushed past its ability to amplify further and the sine wave begins to change to a square wave. The farther it's pushed the more of a square wave it becomes.

I will keep that bit in mind for changing the gain structure of an amp(s). I use mostly EOB and the drive pedal algos in front for drive and solo scenes.

 

[Greg Ferguson]

I will keep that bit in mind for changing the gain structure of an amp(s). I use mostly EOB and the drive pedal algos in front for drive and solo scenes.

I treat most of my amp blocks in my own presets as if they're single-channel amps and control the volume and gain from the guitar's volume control. As I roll it back the amp naturally cleans up, and as I increase the volume it'll smoothly transition from clean through the edge of breakup, to distorted. And, as the guitar's volume increases and the amp transitions, the amp is naturally increasing in volume until the tubes saturate, so there's my lead boost. And, because of all that, I almost never have, or use, a Drive block because it seems redundant.

The only reason I have the GEQ in my presets is for others who might be sitting in on my board. Too many people don't understand how to work with/manage a single-channel amp because they've grown up with pedals and rely on them for everything, and, as a result, don't turn that funny knob on the guitar when they want to solo. The FOH guy at a jam I go to practically begged me to add that block because of those people.

Figuring out how we want to wire layouts together and control the amp and sound is a fun challenge.

 

[TSJMajesty]

See if these help you:

 

[Chromatizm]

Additionally, this: https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/modifiers-per-channel-sweet.190276/
You can use modifiers to control a few settings at once, making 4 channels at least 8 channels