Help me decide leaving my FRFR for pwrAmp and cab

Billbill

Billbill

Power User
Can some of you guys help me decide on a new amp setup please? I was running a Mission Gemini 2- 212 powered 220W cab and couldn't be happier sound wise. Unfortunately I've had two of these turds crap out on me in less than a year then
support simply stopped responding to my emails which surprised me. I've only tried a couple other amps ran various ways with my XL+ but only the Mission cab could translate well enough, the punchy metal riffage that I'm doing right now and with this setup, so I have some questions:
1) I'm fully aware of the benefits from FRFR cabs with modeling devices, but honestly, how different will my patches sound through a nonFRFR cab like an orange 212 with V30's in it and can't any differences be comped for with the numerous options in the axe??
2) The POWERAMP: I'll obviously need some recommendations for a punchy rack mount power amp. I was looking at the Engl 860/100W stereo power amp but laughed when I saw that 2500 dollar price tag on the bitch.
So this is an entirely new setup pretty much and would be fortunate to hear some options or experience that others have or could please recommend. Any help is greatly appreciated. Thx
 
It might take quite a bit of patch tweaking to get a non frfr rig to sound like your current rig. Why not just get a different FRFR brand if you were happy with your sound? After everything I've tried, I would probly get a mesa tube power amp if I wanted to go with a real cab and run PA sims off. But I could never gel with a nuetral PA and cab. Btw the ASM frfr is really great for punchy metal.
 
Tahoebrian5 said:
It might take quite a bit of patch tweaking to get a non frfr rig to sound like your current rig. Why not just get a different FRFR brand if you were happy with your sound? After everything I've tried, I would probly get a mesa tube power amp if I wanted to go with a real cab and run PA sims off. But I could never gel with a nuetral PA and cab. Btw the ASM frfr is really great for punchy metal.
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ASM FRFR? I'll check them out thanks
 
These Friedmans hit hard? I'm doing a lot of 7/8 string chug chug crap and I need a speaker that's going to not fart out with that bottom end range.
 
Sorry to hear about your Gemini's. Mission's warranty on the cab seems to be two years, too bad to hear that they're not upholding it.

Personally not a fan of the Friedman ASMs. It's not an FRFR. And it's heavy and badly spec'ed in comparison to the competition.
I think Xitone or Matrix FRFRs are much better options. Xitone in particular has the best customer service that everyone on this forum can attest to, you might want to write them an email, see what they recommend.

Using a guitar cab like Orange 212 with V30s... you might be able to comp the difference through the AxeFx, make it relatively flat from around 100Hz ~ 5kHz... but it just seems like a lot of work to me, and you're going to have beeming highs as with all guitar speakers. If you're happy with the Orange 212 with V30s sound, go for it. But if you want to take advantage of using IR/cab-block in AxeFx, better go FRFR.

If you're going to go passive guitar cab route and want a power amp, I think the most popular I've seen on this forum are the Matrix ones, they have various models in different power ratings. Fryette's also popuar, and the new Seymour Duncan PowerStage ones are quite well received.
 
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yeky83 said:
Sorry to hear about your Gemini's. Mission's warranty on the cab seems to be two years, too bad to hear that they're not upholding it.

Personally not a fan of the Friedman ASMs. It's not an FRFR. And it's heavy and badly spec'ed in comparison to the competition.
I think Xitone or Matrix FRFRs are much better options. Xitone in particular has the best customer service that everyone on this forum can attest to, you might want to write them an email, see what they recommend.

Using a guitar cab like Orange 212 with V30s... you might be able to comp the difference through the AxeFx, make it relatively flat from around 100Hz ~ 5kHz... but it just seems like a lot of work to me, and you're going to have beeming highs as with all guitar speakers. If you're happy with the Orange 212 with V30s sound, go for it. But if you want to take advantage of using IR/cab-block in AxeFx, better go FRFR.

If you're going to go passive guitar cab route and want a power amp, I think the most popular I've seen on this forum are the Matrix ones, they have various models in different power ratings. Fryette's also popuar, and the new Seymour Duncan PowerStage ones are quite well received.
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Your input is appreciated thx! I'll keep this in mind as my research continues
 
Billbill said:
These Friedmans hit hard? I'm doing a lot of 7/8 string chug chug crap and I need a speaker that's going to not fart out with that bottom end range.
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They do really good as far as chug and cab knock. I had 3 at one point and our bass player played his kemper rig through one st practice one night and it did just fine. We don't downturn past E flat be we play pretty loud with a hard hitting drummer and never heard it fart out. From all I've read the AsM's are not as flat as some other FRFR solutions but this is all relative. None of them are actually perfectly flat. The ASM has a reputation for being the most cab like and having the best chunk but yes they are hvy and awkward to carry. Ideally it would be best to compare a few back to back but that's hard to arrange. Anyway mine kick ass and I love em
 
Tahoebrian5 said:
From all I've read the AsM's are not as flat as some other FRFR solutions but this is all relative. None of them are actually perfectly flat. The ASM has a reputation for being the most cab like and having the best chunk but yes they are hvy and awkward to carry.
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It's not an FRFR period. Don't get me wrong, not being an FRFR does not make it automatically bad, but it doesn't fit the category. It doesn't have a frequency rating, and by all accounts it's not flat. FRFRs are flat to a rated dB range. To call it all relative wouldn't be correct.

(Btw, the fact that they advertise it as a viable PA, when it's voiced for guitars, seems disingenuous marketing, puts me off.)
 
Well I still think relative is an appropriate term when talking about flat response. Even the CLRs which are considered one of the flattest available FRFR is +\- 2.5 db over its range. So it's not flat but it's relatively flat depending on what you are comparing it to. The Friedman is also flat compared to a guitar speaker but not as flat as a clr. Regardless they sound great and are flat enough to allow the character of an IR to come through. That's really the only thing I care about.
 
Tahoebrian5 said:
Well I still think relative is an appropriate term when talking about flat response. Even the CLRs which are considered one of the flattest available FRFR is +\- 2.5 db over its range. So it's not flat but it's relatively flat depending on what you are comparing it to. The Friedman is also flat compared to a guitar speaker but not as flat as a clr. Regardless they sound great and are flat enough to allow the character of an IR to come through. That's really the only thing I care about.
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Relatively flat compared to a guitar speaker, I understand. But calling FRFRs relative when they have a non-relative rating, I don't quite understand. No one expects any speaker to be completely flat. Loudspeakers in the market are mostly rated to the 3dB spec, they're considered categorically "flat" once it meets that range.

And more importantly, I don't think it's helpful to AxeFx users. FRFRs help in sound translation to the FOH. Something like the Friedman will translate poorly to the FOH. It's a helpful distinction. Even Friedman doesn't make the claim it's an FRFR, in fact the opposite, not sure why it should be grouped as one.
 
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I might be looking at the SD power stage rack mount and a pair of Port City 112's, that should rattle your guts pretty good!
 
if you need pretty much one type of tone and usually use the same kind of IR, I don't think it will hurt you to go to a cab.
 
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