Heavy Devy on EMG tv, Axe-fx II content

He simply doesn't have the financial backing to do what you're talking about.
You sure? As much as he talked about having no budget for Retinal Circus, that involved a lot of people and he expressly spent a year putting that together (with a team of his own people and outsourced companies too). Seems to me he does have the resources, but chooses to allocate them toward other areas.
 
You sure? As much as he talked about having no budget for Retinal Circus, that involved a lot of people and he expressly spent a year putting that together (with a team of his own people and outsourced companies too). Seems to me he does have the resources, but chooses to allocate them toward other areas.

I'm not saying he's broke, but he's pretty much working with his own resources as the limitation. Meaning he most likely needs to determine what he "needs" liver performers for and how much he can do with backing tracks without ruining the experience.
 
I am a devout I mean devout metalhead, I just have NEVER gotten into him, what am I missing? I mean I know he is original and produces all sorts of music all over the place but fill me in, I usually try to listen then just have to turn his stuff off...

i've got a theory that i've proven with a couple friends that didn't use to like him and now love him, it's just not your time yet. everyone's got their time for devin and some get it sooner than others
 
Guys a legend. I've been a fan for years..... City just tore into me first time I had heard it. I'm so glad he re recorded Kingdom. The original didn't do it justice. Just waiting for Ziltoid 2.

Here another vid...... get to 3:18 when he starts ranting as he plays.... Guy has some set of pipes too..... and to think he tunes in perfect 5ths rather than 4ths (except the first string which is a major 3rd)....

 
I am a devout I mean devout metalhead, I just have NEVER gotten into him, what am I missing? I mean I know he is original and produces all sorts of music all over the place but fill me in, I usually try to listen then just have to turn his stuff off...

Strapping young lad-city
Then
Ziltoid the omniscient
Then
Synechestea and or ocean machin

After that you can pick from the DTP stuff.
 
I'm not saying he's broke, but he's pretty much working with his own resources as the limitation. Meaning he most likely needs to determine what he "needs" liver performers for and how much he can do with backing tracks without ruining the experience.

I'm a huge Devin fan and have seen both By A Thread and Retinal Circus several times. Yes, he plays with significant backing tracks. And for most acts, that would definitely bum me out. But Devin is a different story - his tracks are HUGE... there's a youtube of him showing his track build-up in his DAW (forget which one), it's just insane how many tracks go into one of his songs. Truly insane amount of layering. It's every bit as complex as say a Skinny Puppy song and I don't think anyone would expect Skinny Puppy to reproduce ever sound live (really this is just a way for me to slip in another favorite band of mine). Here's the thing though, even with a ton of backing tracks, Devin himself brings more raw emotion, talent, passion, effort into his live performances than most 5-piece live acts. The backing tracks only enhance Devin, they do not replace him. Some acts use backing tracks to hide their flubs, their pitch issues, timing issues, etc - Devin uses them to go above/beyond what he could reasonably be expected to do live. Oh, and then there's Anneka. <3
 
I'm a huge Devin fan and have seen both By A Thread and Retinal Circus several times. Yes, he plays with significant backing tracks. And for most acts, that would definitely bum me out. But Devin is a different story - his tracks are HUGE... there's a youtube of him showing his track build-up in his DAW (forget which one), it's just insane how many tracks go into one of his songs. Truly insane amount of layering. It's every bit as complex as say a Skinny Puppy song and I don't think anyone would expect Skinny Puppy to reproduce ever sound live (really this is just a way for me to slip in another favorite band of mine). Here's the thing though, even with a ton of backing tracks, Devin himself brings more raw emotion, talent, passion, effort into his live performances than most 5-piece live acts. The backing tracks only enhance Devin, they do not replace him. Some acts use backing tracks to hide their flubs, their pitch issues, timing issues, etc - Devin uses them to go above/beyond what he could reasonably be expected to do live. Oh, and then there's Anneka. <3
I think this response was meant to be directed at me. I was the one issuing the complaint, and lern2swim presented a position similar to yours.

I understand what you're staying, but don't agree. And of course, it's just a really subjective thing. I used to be into the whole idea of what I call "The Dream Theater Performance" which, at best, is an accurate execution of what's on the record. I aimed to do the same for years. My fervor for it has since waned. Any more, I'm buying more into the "what's the point of seeing a band just redo the record note-for-note live when I can just listen to the record" position. Seeing bands like Mike Keneally and Me'Shell Ndegiocello swayed me. They and their bands have the musical wherewithal to use the recorded compositions as a reference and starting point, and then take it to another, moment-based level live. (Mind you, most of Keneally's compositions are exponentially more difficult and intricate than Devin's. Not suggesting better or worse, just more musically dense.)

Then again, some music, for example orchestral, for the most part is performed note-for-note. I don't think Stravinsky left much room for improv in "The Rite of Spring". So what's the delineating factor? I think it's whether the music is more composition-based ("The Rite of Spring", "The Black Page", etc.) or performance-based (blues, jazz, etc.). And to me, Dev's music is basically pop. Fancy pop sometimes. But still, pop. As such, I think there's room for moments.

I think what bugs me most about Dev's performances is that it does indeed seem the majority of what we're hearing on the DVDs is piped in. For example, when they play "Addicted!" (the song) live, the chromatic guitar line is played by...no one. Dev and Dave both are just sitting there chuggin' on low B (or whatever note it is). But beyond the total reliance on the piped in tracks, there's more. In the commentary track for Retinal Circus he talks about how he overdubbed the tapping sequence in "Planet of the Apes" because he botched it live. The choir(s) in both LBAT and RC - as far as I can tell, they're not even mic'd. And what I do hear of the choir, is clearly the recording from the album. And then there are quite a few moments when the beloved Anne's parts are clearly not her live. I think it's in "Supercrush!" (can't remember if it was in Live By A Thread or Retinal Circus), where you can visibly see she totally misses her entrance, but you can hear her perfectly. I don't try to notice these things either! I think the crux of my point is this, it seems a large part of what's presented seems an "air guitar" act. I'd rather see him play the stuff with a capable band -- live without the net.
 
I am not sure a metal fan could not like Strapping Young Lad!!



no leads no riffs solos, Im more into guitar playing then pounding and growling; that being said I think Lamb of God , old atheist, cynic, and for complexity Necrophagist blow this guy away. For what its worth my fav bands are Dream T, Symphony x, and Nevermore; plus all the original gangstas maiden, ozzy etc.

Well lern2--Ive a pretty broad range of like from early Rush and Kiss to White Chapel. In fact on the non metal side been liking Aloe Black these days, ha!
 
Good point about whether music is composition of live based. I prefer composition based on the whole as if it's not good enough for the record, then it's not good enough for the song. It's kinda like when I hear Comfortably Numb live. I've heard numerous solos by guitarists more technically proficient that David Gilmour, but none of them have ever played anything that I would prefer to hear on the record than the solo Gilmour recorded.

While the live improvisation thing has it's place, and I'm a fan of some jazz and blues, most of the time it boils down to fret wankery. Sometimes you get someone who can take the song, replace the solo with something better live, or take it to another place entirely and it will work (Eric Johnson being the only one I can currently think of), but they're the exception to the rule. More often than not it's to show how technically proficient the guitarist/saxophonist/trumpet-player/soloist is, and I'd take the thought that went into the album over ego any day.

This also seems to be what audiences are after. Artists who don't play their classics during a show, or who do a full show of new or unreleased material tend to be slated by the general public because they like familiarity. The only way I've seen live 'thing' work really and exceed the album expectations is when a track is redone from the ground up. For example, Bruce Springsteen's Ghost Of Tom Joad. The album version is far from what he did with Tom Morello live, but holy shit does it work!

All IMHO, so take it with a grain of salt.
 
I just recently got into Dev from watching his Supercrush! video on all the tracks and complexity in his mixes.
I think what someone said earlier, its either not your time to like his music or it is. Youll find something that will grab you and they you dive deeper. I intitially had some SYL albums and had always noticed Devin was just a little....different and never gave it a chance. Now im pretty much listening to all of his catalogue (20 studio albums and 3 live ones) mind you.

He got pissed from working in the "big time" with Steve Vai and went off to do his own thing his own way, and hes doing it. More power to him!
Protool Skool Supercrush!! - YouTube
 
Indeed, Devin magician, the greatest talent of our time. I'm a fan of his work for many years.

By the way, I noticed that one guitar level indicators do not move ??? 8)
 
I think this response was meant to be directed at me. I was the one issuing the complaint, and lern2swim presented a position similar to yours.

I understand what you're staying, but don't agree. And of course, it's just a really subjective thing. I used to be into the whole idea of what I call "The Dream Theater Performance" which, at best, is an accurate execution of what's on the record. I aimed to do the same for years. My fervor for it has since waned. Any more, I'm buying more into the "what's the point of seeing a band just redo the record note-for-note live when I can just listen to the record" position. Seeing bands like Mike Keneally and Me'Shell Ndegiocello swayed me. They and their bands have the musical wherewithal to use the recorded compositions as a reference and starting point, and then take it to another, moment-based level live. (Mind you, most of Keneally's compositions are exponentially more difficult and intricate than Devin's. Not suggesting better or worse, just more musically dense.)

Then again, some music, for example orchestral, for the most part is performed note-for-note. I don't think Stravinsky left much room for improv in "The Rite of Spring". So what's the delineating factor? I think it's whether the music is more composition-based ("The Rite of Spring", "The Black Page", etc.) or performance-based (blues, jazz, etc.). And to me, Dev's music is basically pop. Fancy pop sometimes. But still, pop. As such, I think there's room for moments.

I think what bugs me most about Dev's performances is that it does indeed seem the majority of what we're hearing on the DVDs is piped in. For example, when they play "Addicted!" (the song) live, the chromatic guitar line is played by...no one. Dev and Dave both are just sitting there chuggin' on low B (or whatever note it is). But beyond the total reliance on the piped in tracks, there's more. In the commentary track for Retinal Circus he talks about how he overdubbed the tapping sequence in "Planet of the Apes" because he botched it live. The choir(s) in both LBAT and RC - as far as I can tell, they're not even mic'd. And what I do hear of the choir, is clearly the recording from the album. And then there are quite a few moments when the beloved Anne's parts are clearly not her live. I think it's in "Supercrush!" (can't remember if it was in Live By A Thread or Retinal Circus), where you can visibly see she totally misses her entrance, but you can hear her perfectly. I don't try to notice these things either! I think the crux of my point is this, it seems a large part of what's presented seems an "air guitar" act. I'd rather see him play the stuff with a capable band -- live without the net.

I hear ya - and honestly, I don't disagree with anything you say. And trust me, I'd also love to see him play more of the tracks live with a larger band, etc. Keep in mind though, many of the tracks on the album (and thus in the backing tracks during his concerts) are heavily affected - i.e. they aren't just straight guitar/synth/drum sounds. Not that it wouldn't be possible to replicate the sound live, but it would be a lot more difficult than just hiring singers, guitarists, etc.

I guess my overall point was that Devin brings so much personality, showmanship, and enough live over-the-top vocal performance, that there's enough of a "live" performance there that you're more than getting your money's worth whether you're in the audience or watching a DVD.

Contrast that with something like the Aristocrats live - full "live" performance by 3 amazing musicians with no backing tracks. Good sense of humor (especially Marco), but overall pretty flat stage presence. Total opposite of Devin's performances - but personally, I love them both equally.
 
Devin is definitely one of my inspirations and I love his less is more philosophy on guitar playing. He is totally against wankery and more about the feeling of the music. I love face melting solos as much as the next guitar nerd, but it gets boring with certain players and I really love that about him. Lets get back on the topic of his current use of the Fractal! I see two mesas powered up behind him and it looks like he has some traditional pedals on his board and no MFC. Someone mentioned the input light on the fractal was not illuminating during this performance. What are your thoughts on this? I wonder how he is utilizing it these days. We know he isn't paid by FAS to promote the fractal, so I doubt he felt like he had to preface the video with a flash of the fractal audio logo. I wonder what EMGtv meant by "In association with FAS/D'Addario". Interesting stuff, as I know he raves about the Axe-FX II.
 
I think he's interesting and welcome to the genre. I just have a hard time not seeing him as a comedian. If he wants to write something serious to him, I'm primed to think its meant to be silly and just laugh.
 
Contrast that with something like the Aristocrats live - full "live" performance by 3 amazing musicians with no backing tracks. Good sense of humor (especially Marco), but overall pretty flat stage presence. Total opposite of Devin's performances - but personally, I love them both equally.

That's an awesome point. Dead on. I've known and watched Bryan for years (in the context of his playing with Keneally), and, well, his playing is top notch. :pride:

I was too young, but I would have loved to seen 1976-1980 Genesis. My understanding is they put on a great show, and even the earlier carnation with Peter Gabriel. A balance between entertainment and performance.
 
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