Has anyone with a FRFR rig gone this far???

6L6C

6L6C

Power User
To recreate a back-line like you would have with real amps.
What I mean:

With a real rig you have your amp and cab in back of you facing the audience and if it is a large enough venue the cabinet usually has a microphone in front of it for the PA.

So has anyone gone to the trouble of say: using a cabinet sim for your FRFR system (without mic sim) and then break off with another but identical cabinet sim, use a mic sim for that and run it out, output 2 and send that to the house PA.
 
I am at a loss as to why anyone would do this other than as some type of goof. Micing a cab is a necessary tone-compromising evil eliminated by the Axe into a FRFR system.

If someone has done this, I'd like to hear the reasoning behind it.
 
I tried such sounds on stage, with cab-blocks in the patches and mics turned to off.
These patches worked well, I had some gigs that way.
But it never felt like the old real thing.

A fulrange valvestate powered monitor wedge, lying before your feet, will always give you a different sound, feeling and impression compared to a tubeamp powered guitarcab in your back, no matter how hard you tweak.
 
666was999 said:
A fulrange valvestate powered monitor wedge, lying before your feet, will always give you a different sound, feeling and impression compared to a tubeamp powered guitarcab in your back, no matter how hard you tweak.
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Perhaps, but I'm not understanding what this has to do with adding a gratuitous mic sim to your FOH signal.. that's what you were asking about, wasn't it?

I'm completely missing something, since this makes no sense to me whatsoever.
 
if you use a cab sim without the mic element it is still being micd by an earthworks mic so you wont be getting an unmicd signal. in any case, itd probably sound worse than direct.
 
6L6C said:
To recreate a back-line like you would have with real amps.
What I mean:

With a real rig you have your amp and cab in back of you facing the audience and if it is a large enough venue the cabinet usually has a microphone in front of it for the PA.

So has anyone gone to the trouble of say: using a cabinet sim for your FRFR system (without mic sim) and then break off with another but identical cabinet sim, use a mic sim for that and run it out, output 2 and send that to the house PA.
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In a case like you describe I would just use OP/1 to FOH w/ a cab sim including mic, OP/2 to a traditional amp and cab rig behind me and have FOH send the monitor mix at my feet using whatever monitor they provided and maybe even mixing in the FOH tone I was sending to the board from OP/1.

Giving total control to the sound tech can be a scary thing. Having something on stage you can send a signal to and amplify is good thing should the sound tech decide to turn you mix off for some unknown reason... we all know that has never happened.
 
I understand what you are saying. If your goal is to get the feel of a traditional cab setup I would imagine this would be the best way, seeing as it is a cab still.

However I personally don't think I will be doing this as you are losing (to me) one of the most powerful aspects of the Axe Fx- the ability to hear on your monitors almost exactly what the people in the crowd are hearing. Unless you auditon your patches to sound good at FOH and your cab, one will suffer. And it's still going to be a compromise.
 
Thanks for the replies guys, no I don’t plan on doing this myself.

I was just curios if anyone has ever taken it this far, as you know some people can be very obsessive compulsive, just put out the feelers. But there again if someone was that obsessive I guess they would not get an Axe Fx in the first place let alone using FRFR cabinets.
 
6L6C said:
Thanks for the replies guys, no I don’t plan on doing this myself.

I was just curios if anyone has ever taken it this far, as you know some people can be very obsessive compulsive, just put out the feelers. But there again if someone was that obsessive I guess they would not get an Axe Fx in the first place let alone using FRFR cabinets.
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I don't consider my self to be obsessive compulsive but I did try it once at a gig with my 412's and other than having the look of a back line which does have a cool factor it was redundant, cumbersome and added a ton of stage volume. Needless to say I didn't use the 412's the second night and went with a monitor wedge instead and was a lot happier with the results.
 
squidlips said:
I understand what you are saying. If your goal is to get the feel of a traditional cab setup I would imagine this would be the best way, seeing as it is a cab still.

However I personally don't think I will be doing this as you are losing (to me) one of the most powerful aspects of the Axe Fx- the ability to hear on your monitors almost exactly what the people in the crowd are hearing. Unless you auditon your patches to sound good at FOH and your cab, one will suffer. And it's still going to be a compromise.
Click to expand...

I love the whole idea of hearing exactly what the audience is hearing. Of course the soundman does still have some eq'ing capabilty.(if you have one)
 
This may have been addressed in another thread (probably a few) but what is the easiest way to have different blocks in the signal chain for the two different outputs? For instance, in our group writing sessions I play through my 4x12 cab in our live mix but would like to run one set of outputs direct to our DAW with the cab sims on. I believe this can be done with placement of the FX loop....? Is there any other way?

Thanks in advance!
 
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