Got my Axe Fx.....but not impressed so far.

I think rich2k4 should keep the AxeFx and learn how to use it, our true sound comes from our hands, the gear just inspires.
 
I think a lot of it has to do with me not being aware of the difference in the FRFR sound. I assumed I would be able to get all the cool tones I like hearing but it would feel bigger, etc. While the tones are possible, they are just more "contained" for lack of a better term. Through recording, as demonstrated above with the John Mayer clip, it can sound pretty damn close if not identical. But it won't feel "in the room" and its a completely different feel when playing.

Just something to get used to I guess.
 
rich2k4 said:
I think a lot of it has to do with me not being aware of the difference in the FRFR sound. I assumed I would be able to get all the cool tones I like hearing but it would feel bigger, etc. While the tones are possible, they are just more "contained" for lack of a better term. Through recording, as demonstrated above with the John Mayer clip, it can sound pretty damn close if not identical. But it won't feel "in the room" and its a completely different feel when playing.

Just something to get used to I guess.
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are you as loud as you would be with a real amp, or quieter?
 
Chris@AxeFxTutorials said:
are you as loud as you would be with a real amp, or quieter?
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That's another thing that may be a big factor. I got the Axe also for the ability for low volume playing while retaining good tones. a lot of my testing so far has been fairly low volume. If I were to crank the monitors it would probably feel much fuller. Thing is, that wouldn't be my normal playing volume. This is strictly a home recording/practice machine for me.
 
rich2k4 said:
That's another thing that may be a big factor. I got the Axe also for the ability for low volume playing while retaining good tones. a lot of my testing so far has been fairly low volume. If I were to crank the monitors it would probably feel much fuller. Thing is, that wouldn't be my normal playing volume. This is strictly a home recording/practice machine for me.
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"in the room" typically comes from the sound bouncing around the room, which requires volume, that's all.

many people get the axe, turn down so the axe sound coming through speakers is softer than the guitar strings themselves, then say "i just don't get that amp feel." it happens a lot.

volume and physics are non-negotiable for certain things.
 
If you are in the USA you can purchase any frfr speakers such as QSC K12 etc on 3 monthly payments with no credit check through american musical.com I buy all my equipment other than the fractal stuff through them. I have been purchasing through them for 7 years now, all on account so now I have a $4000 credit limit with them on up to 12 monthly payments. Really good company.
 
guitarmike said:
Get a guitar cab and descent solid state amp and enjoy amp in the room. FRFR is a different animal.
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This ^^ is how I would go if I had to start over & was tight for cash. FRFR is not everybody's cup of tea and perhaps is not where sceptics (like me!) should start...

Get a cheap...
1. 1 x 12" cab with a greenback speaker, nice for anything old skool imho & better than any cube speaker, @ $125 used
2. 300watt + @ 8 ohm solid-state poweramp @ $200 used. Ive used power mixers, PA poweramps, tube poweramps, Matrix, etc into various cabs including a single 10" 25watt greenback and havent blown any of them.

Sell the cube to pay for half of the above if necessary. I can't see you missing it. Cubes (Ive had a few) are good for the money but they are not good enough to translate the subtle qualities of the axefx. I can imagine buying a Mess MK5 head, plugging it into the cube speaker, and being well disappointed.

Alternatively here's a nice video by a well known touring guitarist getting a killer tone via humble studio monitors in a couple of minutes (it's an AX8 which hasn't even got all of the horsepower that you have)...
 
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Chris@AxeFxTutorials said:
"in the room" typically comes from the sound bouncing around the room, which requires volume, that's all.
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It also requires a room. ;-) I.e. no headphones. Also, I would say if amp in the room is your thing it is worth considering using a real guitar cab and power amp rather than FRFR plus impulses. It is immediately authentic. You are limited to one cab but if you can deal with one cab and 200+ amp channels and tons of tone shaping and FX you are golden and it is zero effort.
 
At low volume or with headphones you have to add the "room" sound yourself using reverb. The Ambience mode in the reverb block works really well for adding a bit of room vibe. Experiment with the reverb parameters and EQ to dial in the room sound you want.

One trick I use for room sounds is to turn the reverb mix all the way up to 100% wet, then tweak the reverb until the room sounds the way I want. That serves as a sort of virtual distant room mic. I then dial back the mix to the point where the guitar sits where I want.
 
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The more I compare the Axe tones side by side with actual recorded tones on youtube, the more I realize that it really is very close if not identical. For example. I came across a video of slash demoing the AFD100 amp. I called that up, with a 4x12 marshall cab with V30's and some reverb. Set it using the same settings he would use, and it sounded identical.

It made me realize that the tones are authentic, it just isn't obvious at first for someone who has no experience playing while the sound is a miced guitar tone. At first, pulling up a marshall amp, one might say "that sounds nothing like a marshall" until you compare side by side with an actual miced marshall and then you realize....yeah.....that's the same sound.
 
Another good thing to do is compare full mix tracks to isolated guitar tracks for some of your favorite songs. There's tons of them on YouTube and elsewhere online. It can really open your ears so to speak in regards to what the guitar really sounds like by itself. Sometimes the difference can be quite surprising. So often in rock and metal types stuff, the bass sort of doubles the rhythm guitar and give the illusion that the guitar tones are much bigger and beefier than they actually are.
 
rich2k4 said:
While the tones are possible, they are just more "contained" for lack of a better term...its a completely different feel when playing.
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That's all about volume. There's no escaping it. Cranked to gig levels, the Axe-Fx will make the room sing, and it'll feel like you're playing the room instead of the guitar. Back down to realistic apartment levels, and you lose that—but it still slays any "real" amp at the same volume.
 
rich2k4 said:
The more I compare the Axe tones side by side with actual recorded tones on youtube, the more I realize that it really is very close if not identical. For example. I came across a video of slash demoing the AFD100 amp. I called that up, with a 4x12 marshall cab with V30's and some reverb. Set it using the same settings he would use, and it sounded identical.

It made me realize that the tones are authentic, it just isn't obvious at first for someone who has no experience playing while the sound is a miced guitar tone. At first, pulling up a marshall amp, one might say "that sounds nothing like a marshall" until you compare side by side with an actual miced marshall and then you realize....yeah.....that's the same sound.
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Rich you sound like myself. I too only bought the Axe for bedroom production and noodling. I too have had a hard time finding something that compares to what I had before (Guitar Rig Pro), I too have tone matched John Mayers Belief from the Live in LA concert, I too dialled in the Slash amp and tried to copy his tone :D

We would all hate to see a new comer go so early but people do what they need to do.This things not cheap (especially in England for me)

Can I ask simply what your tone sounds like in your head?

Then can I ask what's actually missing from your Axe Sound?
 
rich2k4 said:
..., it just isn't obvious at first for someone who has no experience playing while the sound is a miced guitar tone. At first, pulling up a marshall amp, one might say "that sounds nothing like a marshall" until you compare side by side with an actual miced marshall and then you realize....yeah.....that's the same sound.
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^^^ THIS ^^^

I've always been convinced that the players that struggle w/ the Axe just don't have the experience of hearing your own gear mic'ed up and recorded .... I remember my first go-round with the POD XT ( before Fractal Audio was around ), and it was a real struggle at first.

But I bought the POD because I started doing a bunch of hobby recording w/ some buddies that play Keyboards, Bass, etc; And after a couple of months of listening to the recordings and practicing through the monitors, I actually began to prefer the sound coming directly back at me ( monitors ) instead of it flapping my pants legs ....

The "amp in the room" has no meaning to me anymore ....

GOOD LUCK, I'm sure you'll get there too !
 
HarrySound said:
Rich you sound like myself. I too only bought the Axe for bedroom production and noodling. I too have had a hard time finding something that compares to what I had before (Guitar Rig Pro), I too have tone matched John Mayers Belief from the Live in LA concert, I too dialled in the Slash amp and tried to copy his tone :D

We would all hate to see a new comer go so early but people do what they need to do.This things not cheap (especially in England for me)

Can I ask simply what your tone sounds like in your head?

Then can I ask what's actually missing from your Axe Sound?
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I like a lot of different tones. The usual lead tone I try to go for though can pretty much be summed up as 80's lead. Van Halen style. That, or Andy Timmons tone.

In terms of cleans....I'm still in search of this, in a box:



I think that is a volume problem though. Not sure if I'd get that at apartment levels.

Or this:



I guess what is missing is that "thump" for lack of a better term. The tones always feel distant, like there not really here with me. But I guess that's the whole point, cause its a miced guitar sound.

It's not necessarily bad, its just something I need to get used to.

One thing I haven't head the Axe do yet in any recording is to capture that "thump". Sometimes in recordings, you can actually "hear the cabinet" if that makes sense. It's as if someone put a microphone in the middle of the room, with a loud amp far away from it. It captures the room feel as well. You can hear it in both clips above, but the second one more. You can hear if a lot in the following clip:



It's a recorded guitar, but it sounds "in the room". Haven't heard any clips of the Axe capturing that. It always sounds like close mic tones.

First order of business is to rethink my amplification. While the studio monitors I bought are ok, I think it might be best to get a pair of actual PA wedges. Place each on opposite sides of the room. Might give a more "filling" experience.
 
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Rich,

This reminds me of your posts 13 years ago on the Marc Seal Forum; Back then I think you were working up to a Marshall Half-stack in your bedroom searching for that "something". Those of us older than you saw you making the same mistakes we had made. I wish that an internet forum or piece of equipment could give you what you want but it is something you have to work out for yourself. The nice people here may be able to help if the AxeFx ends your search for awhile.

I hope you find what you are looking for someday. Contentment is bliss.
 
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